This question is for MTV or anyone else with experience with a 180h 170 and a contant speed prop. I have got a few hours on mine with the new engine and the MT prop, it performs quite well on take off getting 2700rpm but my cruse speed seems to not be any faster than it was with the old 0-300 and on full fine its like pushing a sheet of plywood. on final I have to maintain 2500rpm to stay over 65mph. Is this normal? how fast should it cruze ? I am on skis (2500AWB) right now so that has some efect on the speed im sure.

I have not flown the MT prop on a 170, but I have flown a couple of Huskys "before and after" adding the MT prop. My experience with the Husky is that we lost perhaps 2 to 5 mph in cruise speed with the MT prop, as compared to the Hartzell 76 or 80 inch prop. BUT, we gained in takeoff and climb performance.

As to prop rpm on final, your prop control should be set to fine pitch for landing, so I'm assuming what you're saying is that to maintain an approach profile, you are having to keep the THROTTLE up to keep the engine in the governing range????

It may be that the pitch stops aren't set quite right on that prop.

But, without knowing what your approach procedures are, it's impossible to answer your questions.

If you are dragging the plane in on a long, low final, behind the power curve, of course your prop is going to be running at a higher rpm.

On the other hand, if you are making a "normal" descent profile (and I always prefer a steeper descent profile if at all possible) and the prop is still running that sort of rpm, I'd have the pitch stops checked.

That said, one of the advantages of the MT prop on the Husky is that, with an aerodynamically slick airplane, the MT prop provides additional drag close to touchdown. Carry a little power into very short final, then close the throttle, and the prop acts like a speed brake. If that's what you're referring to, I consider that a good thing, because it offers an additional tool to help you more precisely touch down on your chosen spot.

More information would be helpful.

MTV

Friend of mine in McCall had, may still have, an MT prop on his Scout.
His wife was practicing wheel landings and did not know that she had just barely "clipped" the prop.
Took of about a half an inch. Cost them a whole new prop.
Apparently there is not much in the way of repairing what is essentially a wooden prop in a condom.

Its more like Im keeping the rpm up to keep the plane from stalling! If I set up an aproach how I would with the old engine for power off Im at almost full power to make the runway now. I think it just needs a diferent aproach set up but I dont know what that is, I could turn short final at 1000agl and easily make the threshold if I wanted to come down like a rock.
The other question is what do you do in the event of an engine failure (especually on final) pull the prop full coarse? It glides like an anvil otherwise.
Im not unhappy with it there are definate advantages to it for off airport operations, Im just wondering the best procedure for normal operation so as to not scare the shit out of my pasingers.

they told me that you could brake a tip right off and they could put it back on?

I'd give the guys at MT a call, and double check the fine pitch stops on the prop.

And, yes, in the event of an engine failure, pulling the prop to full coarse pitch will offer the best glide distance in any constant speed prop equipped aircraft.

MTV

I have zero experience with this combination, but it sounds like it just needs a different landing technique than what you were used to with the old set up. How far back are you considering part of your approach? Can you make the same approach profile you're used to by delaying the fine prop setting until later in the approach? This whole thing sounds like a good thing to me, more than once I have found myself wishing I could have *just a touch* of beta ...
And BTW...in the event of an engine failure in a single how are we moving the prop to coarse? Is this an electric prop?
Sorry for the barrage of questions rather than solutions, it's an interesting topic and I've flown with people who handle power / prop settings completely different, but in most cases it was just what they where taught and they could offer now real reason why they flew it that way...

Take care, Rob

As to the gal that busted the tip off her prop with out even realizing it... I would think that if the transfer of energy was that small, (so small she didn't notice the prop strike) than the likelihood that she damaged her engine in a major way, was that much less than with a metal prop Which she most certainly would have noticed... and that is probably a good thing.

in an engine failure were the prop is windmilling the oil pump and governor are still turning so you can still usually controle the prop. if the engine sieses solid or the prop stops for some reson it is a moot point unless you have a full feathering prop.

I'm still curious if you are making fairly steep approaches or really flat, drag it in type approaches?

MTV

There must be something seriously wrong with that prop. I would not fly it untill you have it looked at by a prop shop.

If it is a standard constant speed prop from MT, then it should work the same as a Mccauley or Hartzell. There is absolutely NO reason you should need almost full throttle on final.(unless you regularly fly waaaaaay on the back side)

Please get it looked at before you find that full throttle isn't enough

well MTV if I come in steep it workes great it is trying to fly a normal glide slope that i dont know how to do, It workes fine if I leave the prop in cruse setting Im not sure if thats the best idea.

Basically it workes great for coming in steep or draging it in way behind the power its when my mom wants a ride I dont know how to do it.


Ive been in contact with the guys at MT and it is functioning normally. and by the way if you break it off they can put up to 20 inches back on!

the manifold presure isnt very high 10in or less its not that the prop is pulling its just that you need it spinning like that to keep from putting on the brakes. Ive flown it more and am getting the hang of it now. I like it more and more the more I fly it, its like having an extra notch of flaps, and the 170B already has great flaps!
Im going to have to shut it down in flight to work out a procedure for an engine falure I think the prop might stop in fine pitch so it wouldent cause so much drag but Ill have to try it and see.
I think its a great prop It just takes a diferent techneque, the performance is greater on bolth ends of the flight, takes some getting used to though.

Okay, I think I'm understanding what you're describing now. Yes, when the MT prop (actually the MTV 15 prop--they named it after me.... ) goes to full fine pitch, it creates a lot of drag. This is just one of the tools you can use to smoothly fly relatively steep approaches, and also to get to the point where you really can hit your desired landing spot consistently. Carry a touch of power right up to the flare, then pull the throttle back, and the airplane will land.

If that's what you're talking about, yes, this is perfectly normal for the MT. Frankly, I love that feature of the prop, because it really permits steep descents and very positive control of descent rates and touchdown.

I wouldn't worry too much about engine failure in the MT. If it fails with the engine turning, pull the prop control all the way to coarse pitch. If the engine stops, no worries, cause a stopped prop provides very little drag in any case.

One of the things that really gets people's attention with the MT prop is there's almost no flywheel effect on start and stop. Start it, and it just starts, no spin up. Shut it down, and the prop stops. Now.

Keep us posted.

MTV

OK Ive got a few hours on it now and let just say it dont fly like a 170 anymore. take off at gross 20c temp 800ft with room to spare, landing you can turn short final at 1000ft and still have to ad power to make the runway. the only problem with this is next time I fly a stock one I'm going to overshoot by about 2miles I still fly final with the prop in cruse pitch and then go full fine on short final, not sure if this is this is the best technique but it seems to work. cruse seems to be about 129mph at 2350 squared on 8.00s wich is a little slower than a hartsell, im told, but I didnt do all these mods for speed so I'm verry happy so far. Now all I need is wing extensions ,VGs, and a baggage door.

All props are somewhat different in this respect. We have hired a 180 while ours is being rebuilt. The first few (quite a few actually) landings I over shot. The prop on this machine just did not have the braking qualitys of our 88" 2 blade. The airplane just hung up there. I much prefer a prop that brakes for the reasons MTV has all ready stated. We have ordered a 3 blade MT so I am realy looking forward to the braking qualitys you are alluding to. It is much easier to nail the spot, I have found, with a prop that has those characteristics. No floating and steeper descents.

Jamie G

Ya a friend of mine has a 83inch three blade on his 185 and it puts on the brakes at least as good as mine Im sure you will be happy with it.
I took my dad and my unkle for a ride ,bolth pilots, and they bolth thought I was going to overshoot and when I had to ad power to make the runway they couldent believe it.