I love his example picture with the Nuclear waste plant, Lawyers kids, and Sleep Apnea clinic

Skalywag wrote:I love his example picture with the Nuclear waste plant, Lawyers kids, and Sleep Apnea clinic

Yeah, that cracked me up also!

When I was flying sailplanes, we were taught to recite our options for a rope break as the tow began and as the options got better.. Ie rope breaks now I can land straight ahead on runway, ropebreaks now I can land straight ahead off runway, Rope breaks now, I can land in clearing at 45 degrees, rope breaks now (about 200ft AGL), I can turn back and land on runway downwind, rope breaks now (about 500 AGL), I can do an abbreviated pattern. When I switched to learning GA, I was surprised that same sort of thing was not taught to at least keep the mantra and options in the head. I am still a student pilot as I have been too busy to fly and finish, but when I do fly, I recite something similar and I do have the impossible turn in there but at a height I think is safe for my local airports. I fly in the LA basin so my options of off runway are less than desirable.

When being taught to fly self launching gliders I was told to drift to the lee side of strip and weather cock into wind (if any) so that the turn back was already started if needed, with no wind at least I was offset to the runway, so easier to line up than if I was center line. When taught to fly GA they stressed to maintain centre line straight ahead with no weather cocking, this took some getting used too. If there's a crosswind on take off I tend to revert to my motor glider habits, I am still well away from downwind legs, if low and engine quits I still have a straight ahead option but as I get higher I feel more confident that I can get back, because I am already a that bit further around. In the motor glider with a 23:1 glide angle regularly made the turns from 100' agl, no engine failure but purely for practise. The Maule is a bit scarier in that it all happens very quickly, and anything under 800' I'm straight ahead.

After practicing "the turn" several times, I concluded that I could actually get it done in about 620' consistently. But that would be pretty disconcerting at very low altitude, as I practiced it at about 2000' AGL and noted the altitude loss. Accounting for some delay in recognizing the issue, I've concluded that I ought to be at about 700' before I use it. That in itself is a good enough reason to attempt to gain as much altitude early in the take off sequence. But often enough, an early engine failure would allow landing on the remaining runway, and since most airports are in relatively flat environments, there are frequently other options which are nonetheless safer than attempting the turn from too low an altitude. For certain, it won't work without some practice.

Cary

I have practiced this turn back numerous times and found in the 182 you could consistently get it done at 500' after a lot of practice, in the Fox I can accomplish it at 300'. I would strongly recommend a lot of practice if you are going to actually rely on this and what a lot of people don't realize is there is significant difference in a pulled back idle and an actual engine out, Several of us actually practice full engine off but we do it out at dry lake beds with cones set up, Lots of outs in all directions. I will film some next time we go out.

ozy wrote:When being taught to fly self launching gliders I was told to drift to the lee side of strip and weather cock into wind (if any) so that the turn back was already started if needed, with no wind at least I was offset to the runway, so easier to line up than if I was center line. When taught to fly GA they stressed to maintain centre line straight ahead with no weather cocking, this took some getting used too. If there's a crosswind on take off I tend to revert to my motor glider habits, I am still well away from downwind legs, if low and engine quits I still have a straight ahead option but as I get higher I feel more confident that I can get back, because I am already a that bit further around. In the motor glider with a 23:1 glide angle regularly made the turns from 100' agl, no engine failure but purely for practise. The Maule is a bit scarier in that it all happens very quickly, and anything under 800' I'm straight ahead.

I do that also, an old ultralight habit, it just gives you a lot more options if the fan stops.

Anyone else think it a bit odd that the pilot (can't think of his name, but I like his presentations, the whole camera in the cockpit thing and the humor) didn't nail that landing? Looked like plenty of remaining runway, it would seem that a strong slip and then a routine landing would have been part of the spiel: "don't be afraid to take aggressive action to make the runway", or something like that. When he throttled up and went around, I yelled YOU CHEATER! I see he jokingly blamed King....he could have still done that but then slipped her in and it would have made for a more interesting video and stressed the point to do what's needed to (safely) make the runway. Hopefully he doesn't think an aggressive slip is too radical or something? Any J-3 pilots want to comment on this?

I liked the King chart showing the energy involved in crashing at varying speeds, slower is better by a lot!