I just bought a 59 182 tail wheel conversion. The battery is mounted under the pilot seat? A real pain in the ass
I haven't looked at the CG that closely yet, but do I move the battery to the firewall or the baggage compartment?

I'm not sure which is best. But, while I have my engine out for an overhaul, I'm going to look into moving the battery in my 58 182 to the firewall.

If your battery is under the pilot seat, is it mounted to the chair or floor board? Interesting.....

What is your mission? If you tend to fly solo or with just one person, having too much forward CG causes longer take off, higher stall speeds and lower cruise speed. Ski and float ops tend to put the CG even farther forward, so something to consider. If you are loading the family wagon to the roof and plan to put in the extended baggage? - put the battery on the firewall and get the flush floor type extended baggage.
I have the Atlee STCd firewall battery kit, yet to be mounted and was back and forth on whether to mount it. Everytime I load up to max, I wish I would've done it already. With the current aft battery, my emergency gear, repair kit and tiedown gear goes under the back seats. I figure when I move the battery forward at overhaul time I'll just start putting all of that stuff back in the extended baggage when I'm not maxed out and things should be just fine.
Matt

The battery is mounted under the pilot seat? A real pain in the ass

You need more padding in your seat

Everytime I load up to max, I wish I would've done it already. With the current aft battery, my emergency gear, repair kit and tiedown gear goes under the back seats. I figure when I move the battery forward at overhaul time I'll just start putting all of that stuff back in the extended baggage when I'm not maxed out and things should be just fine.

I couldn't agree more. Plus getting rid probably close to 30 pounds(long cables, big battery box, heavier battey) and having shorter cables which also as big advantages.
I like the mod
Gary

Moved mine from the rear to the firewall. It was a total of 32lbs of old stuff. Bought the Burl's firewall mount (half the cost of others on the market) and Odessey lightweight battery. I noticed I was having issues getting the tailwheel to touch in a three point landing, even with full nose up trim. I just installed the Selkirk extended baggage mod that pretty much lays flat inline with the forward baggage area. The baggage mod is certified to carry 50lbs. I plan on keeping my survival gear and some tools back for day to day flying, then stuff if full of light weight gear while camping. Will come in handy if I ever need to sleep in my plane.

Thanks for the advice.
I have an extended baggage, so I could leave some gear way aft.
With the firewall mount and smaller battery, is it lacking in cranking or reserve power?

My 180 had the battery located under the pilot's seat until my last annual. I'm not sure why the previous owner had done it, but the only documentation was a logbook entry. I certainly don't want to get into the discussion of what level of modification this is, but I made it through four annuals with four different mechanics before the fifth wouldn't sign it off. I decided it wasn't worth arguing the point to every different mechanic, so I went with the F. Atlee Dodge Firewall battery mod and purchased the Selkirk extended baggage.

The firewall battery mod is a welcomed reduction in weight both from the smaller battery and shorter cabling, and I plan on offsetting the forward CG with my wife's toiletries kit in the extended baggage. I guess that would count as her survival kit.

Brett

UH-60andC-180 wrote:My 180 had the battery located under the pilot's seat until my last annual. I'm not sure why the previous owner had done it, but the only documentation was a logbook entry. I certainly don't want to get into the discussion of what level of modification this is, but I made it through four annuals with four different mechanics before the fifth wouldn't sign it off. I decided it wasn't worth arguing the point to every different mechanic, so I went with the F. Atlee Dodge Firewall battery mod and purchased the Selkirk extended baggage.

The firewall battery mod is a welcomed reduction in weight both from the smaller battery and shorter cabling, and I plan on offsetting the forward CG with my wife's toiletries kit in the extended baggage. I guess that would count as her survival kit.

Brett

The battery under the R/H seat was a STC from Oregon .I believe it was by something seaplanes who are no longer in Business .The STC and assets were moved to AZ. in 1980's but is no longer supported.
I make the stainless steel battery box that mounts on firewall -we use the SBS J16 battery and fabricate new #2 wire battery cables. 14 Lbs on the firewall vs 38lbs at station 115 ? If you move the battery to firewall you need extended baggage to compensate for battery move. I keep my survival gear 60-80 lbs in my extended baggage all the time. Aft of the Station 109 (aft side of baggage door ) to Station 140 (measure aft from firewall in inches for station) was designed for 80 Lbs. in early 1950's for old radio's and battery. Firewall is Station "0" our box/system is station -3.5 @ 14 lbs. Gives back approx. 28 lbs more useful load than old G-35 in back = 4 gallons fuel. Just think of it as 3 good sized bowling balls .

Mabe not an issue were you live, but for those of us in northern climates It is a huge advantage to have the battery in the engine compartment so when you preheat you also warm up your battery. Un loading all your gear and climbing back in the bagage compartment to remove the battery so you can take it in the cabin for the nite is no fun.

Also you loose a huge amount of power with long aluminum cables and coper cables are heavy So if you mount it on the firewall you can get away with a smaller battery and still get the same amps to your starter.

Small Tail Caddy wrote:Thanks for the advice.
I have an extended baggage, so I could leave some gear way aft.
With the firewall mount and smaller battery, is it lacking in cranking or reserve power?

I bought the Burl's mount for $115 direct from them and put in a lightweight Skytech starter at the same time. Hard to say what the cranking power difference is due to this fact, but that Skytech starter is amazing. Goes like a son of a gun.

182 STOL driver wrote:

UH-60andC-180 wrote:My 180 had the battery located under the pilot's seat until my last annual. I'm not sure why the previous owner had done it, but the only documentation was a logbook entry. I certainly don't want to get into the discussion of what level of modification this is, but I made it through four annuals with four different mechanics before the fifth wouldn't sign it off. I decided it wasn't worth arguing the point to every different mechanic, so I went with the F. Atlee Dodge Firewall battery mod and purchased the Selkirk extended baggage.

The firewall battery mod is a welcomed reduction in weight both from the smaller battery and shorter cabling, and I plan on offsetting the forward CG with my wife's toiletries kit in the extended baggage. I guess that would count as her survival kit.

Brett

The battery under the R/H seat was a STC from Oregon .I believe it was by something seaplanes who are no longer in Business .The STC and assets were moved to AZ. in 1980's but is no longer supported.
I make the stainless steel battery box that mounts on firewall -we use the SBS J16 battery and fabricate new #2 wire battery cables. 14 Lbs on the firewall vs 38lbs at station 115 ? If you move the battery to firewall you need extended baggage to compensate for battery move. I keep my survival gear 60-80 lbs in my extended baggage all the time. Aft of the Station 109 (aft side of baggage door ) to Station 140 (measure aft from firewall in inches for station) was designed for 80 Lbs. in early 1950's for old radio's and battery. Firewall is Station "0" our box/system is station -3.5 @ 14 lbs. Gives back approx. 28 lbs more useful load than old G-35 in back = 4 gallons fuel. Just think of it as 3 good sized bowling balls .

Bill
Is that battery box STC'd or on a field approval, and how much does it cost ? I've got the engine out for overhaul and now might be the time to do it.
Russ

Glidergeek wrote:

182 STOL driver wrote:

UH-60andC-180 wrote:My 180 had the battery located under the pilot's seat until my last annual. I'm not sure why the previous owner had done it, but the only documentation was a logbook entry. I certainly don't want to get into the discussion of what level of modification this is, but I made it through four annuals with four different mechanics before the fifth wouldn't sign it off. I decided it wasn't worth arguing the point to every different mechanic, so I went with the F. Atlee Dodge Firewall battery mod and purchased the Selkirk extended baggage.

The firewall battery mod is a welcomed reduction in weight both from the smaller battery and shorter cabling, and I plan on offsetting the forward CG with my wife's toiletries kit in the extended baggage. I guess that would count as her survival kit.

Brett

The battery under the R/H seat was a STC from Oregon .I believe it was by something seaplanes who are no longer in Business .The STC and assets were moved to AZ. in 1980's but is no longer supported.
I make the stainless steel battery box that mounts on firewall -we use the SBS J16 battery and fabricate new #2 wire battery cables. 14 Lbs on the firewall vs 38lbs at station 115 ? If you move the battery to firewall you need extended baggage to compensate for battery move. I keep my survival gear 60-80 lbs in my extended baggage all the time. Aft of the Station 109 (aft side of baggage door ) to Station 140 (measure aft from firewall in inches for station) was designed for 80 Lbs. in early 1950's for old radio's and battery. Firewall is Station "0" our box/system is station -3.5 @ 14 lbs. Gives back approx. 28 lbs more useful load than old G-35 in back = 4 gallons fuel. Just think of it as 3 good sized bowling balls .

Bill
Is that battery box STC'd or on a field approval, and how much does it cost ? I've got the engine out for overhaul and now might be the time to do it.
Russ

See your PM BR

Burl's it is, with beer in the extended baggage . Thanks for the help!

ya I agree Burl's lotta $ left over and an STC to boot. Better rethink that price Bill.

Small Tail Caddy wrote:I just bought a 59 182 tail wheel conversion. The battery is mounted under the pilot seat? A real pain in the ass
I haven't looked at the CG that closely yet, but do I move the battery to the firewall or the baggage compartment?

Why is it a PITA? A buddy of mine with a 1956 C180 did a field-approved mod that got rid of the aft-mounted G35 and put an Odyssey/Powersafe battery under the floor under one of the front seats. He's real happy with it-- moved the CG forward some (but not too much), and avoided adding anything to the crowded engine compartment. Accessing the battery is easy once he removes the seat, real easy to do with the rear seat out or with AtleeDodge foldups. Not that ya need to access it very often- sealed, maintenance-free, just check the connections & mounting security at annual time.
I have a Powersafe battery in my airplane, mounted aft of the baggage like a C180. Unfortunately no baggage door so it's a PITA to crawl back there. I thought about either a firewall mount or an underseat mount, but the CG's good where it's at & like I said ya only gotta look at them once a year. So I just put it in the relocated stock battery box and called it good.

Forward, and here's why:

Shorter cable runs = less cable loss, especially when cold, AND less weight in cables. Those big copper cables weigh more than most would think

EVERYTHING you put in that airplane moves the CG aft. Start with a forward CG. You SHOULD be carrying survival gear at all times. Put that in the extended baggage, and you're OPERATIONAL CG, even when "empty" should be legal.

Battery's easier to access.

Battery on the firewall, when you pre-heat the engine you pre-heat the battery as well, which is vital in really cold weather or with a weak battery.

MTV

mtv wrote:Battery on the firewall, when you pre-heat the engine you pre-heat the battery as well, which is vital in really cold weather or with a weak battery.

Amen if you live anywhere cold. Unless you're in a heated hangar, you will not get a battery compartment under the seat, or in the tail, warm enough to give you full cranking power. Same with being parked out in the boonies. Easy fix, just pull it out and keep it warm elsewhere. But what a pain in the ass.

Gump

Hey it's not a PITA to pull yur mits off and stand on your head in your thick coveralls to get the battery out. What is a PITA is trying to put the damn wing nuts back on the battery and have them stick to your fingers ,but that way you wont drop them, Not to worry about the sweat you just broke by being all humped up trying to get it in there. Then putting that damn little pin in the cover on the battery box!!!! 20 minutes and now were ready to start this &$*_$*(#&^_*%(&_& airplane!
Just my fond memories of cold dark frozen mornings!!
GT

Hey it's not a PITA to pull yur mits off and stand on your head in your thick coveralls to get the battery out. What is a PITA is trying to put the damn wing nuts back on the battery and have them stick to your fingers ,but that way you wont drop them, Not to worry about the sweat you just broke by being all humped up trying to get it in there. Then putting that damn little pin in the cover on the battery box!!!! 20 minutes and now were ready to start this &$*_$*(#&^_*%(&_& airplane!
Just my fond memories of cold dark frozen mornings!!
GT

Probably by the time you are done, the battery is cold again.

Hotrod, it is a PITA because of the way the battery is mounted.
It sets on top of the floor, between the seat rails. The seat only has about 6" of travel, a real PITA to get in.