I have an light and very basic experimental L4 Cub with C85-8. I have been considering two routes of action:

1) keep my L4 as a classic, and look for a PA-18 and make the necessary mods to have a good backcountry airplane (I don't need to win the Valdez competition), or

2) modify my L4 by replacing the C85 with an O-200 with high 9.5:1 compression piston from LyCon, keeping it light, borer prop, and VGs (I already have the engine)

I am not comparing the L4 performance with the SC's, but the practicality and utility. I understand the L4 will have no flaps, range will be shorter, and payload less. But, the question really is, will it go into and out of reasonably short unimproved strips in the backcountry without me having to spend a lot of money on a SC?

I guess I could always sell the L4, but I love it and would hate to sell it. I guess I'm just thinking out loud. Would love you opinion.

Eduardo

PatínLoco wrote:I have an light and very basic experimental L4 Cub with C85-8. I have been considering two routes of action:

1) keep my L4 as a classic, and look for a PA-18 and make the necessary mods to have a good backcountry airplane (I don't need to win the Valdez competition), or

2) modify my L4 by replacing the C85 with an O-200 with high 9.5:1 compression piston from LyCon, keeping it light, borer prop, and VGs (I already have the engine)

I am not comparing the L4 performance with the SC's, but the practicality and utility. I understand the L4 will have no flaps, range will be shorter, and payload less. But, the question really is, will it go into and out of reasonably short unimproved strips in the backcountry without me having to spend a lot of money on a SC?

I guess I could always sell the L4, but I love it and would hate to sell it. I guess I'm just thinking out loud. Would love you opinion.

Eduardo

I think I would ask COYOTE UGLY about this one!!

I worked out of a 2600' abandoned paved road strip at 6500' MSL with a 65 hp Taylorcraft DC-65, which is very similar to a J-3. You have more engine and a better wing. I would stay with your basic J-4. There were no obstruction at my strip at Tohatchi, NM, except a wire beyond the end four hundred feet or so. I only had to go under the wire once, but that was with a loaded Tri-Pacer. As with any high density altitude takeoff, I got the tail up as soon as possible, the mains off as soon as possible, and stayed in ground effect out over the desert as long as necessary. As always, I knew which way was down hill and never took off toward higher terrain.

Learning to fly the wing, necessary with low power, will make you a better pilot.

I first soloed in a 90 hp Supercub at Jeffco in Denver. That was a Supercub in that day and was a mountain airplane. I trained ag pilots in 135 hp and 150 hp Supercubs and found the 135 handled much better. The 150 hp Cub means you can probably go over 10,000' passes in the cool, calm morning air. With your 85 hp, you may have to wait a bit on winds for oregraphic lift. Thermal and oregraphic ridge lift in the afternoon far outclasses even 150 hp but you have to be prepared to utilize this greater energy. Climb in updrafts and dive in downdrafts for a net gain and use ridge lift to get up to the pass.

E-mail me at [email protected] and I will send you an e-book that has all this stuff.

Jim

My first thought...

Do a paper weight and balance with "new" engine before you decide. See if you like proposed CG?

I'd keep the L4 and the C85 but install a set of pistons from Bob Barrows and a Catto prop.

Since your L-4 is experimental and without flaps, if you want better shortfield and you think the trailing edge is strong enough to handle the increased pressure, you could try wickerbills. Cheap and easy.

Stick with the L 4 unless you really need to haul big loads. Best bush plane I ever flew was a 90 hp J 3. Light as a feather, I landed in stuff that was REALLY hard to walk in.

MTV

I'd love to have COYOTE UGLY reply to it also!

Will do, contactflying, I'll e-mail you. Thanks!

8GCBC wrote:My first thought...

Do a paper weight and balance with "new" engine before you decide. See if you like proposed CG?

8GCBC, there are several J-3 Cubs flying with O-200 engines. I have gotten a lot of good information from www.j-3.com, which is a great forum for J-3/L4s. There is a guy, JimC (Cunningham) who has been flying one for one for a long time and loves it. He has been my inspiration.

By the way, the O-200 is 12 lbs heavier than the C85-8. I need to get on a diet!!!

I have an L-2 with 75hp. My experience is most L-4's will out climb my L-2 but the L-2 is quicker in cruise with its semi symmetrical wing. I think most L-2's weigh a little less.

If you run the L-4 lightly loaded with 85hp and the right prop it might take you to a lot of places and be a lot of fun.

Hey PatinLoco - that 12lbs is way out front too - makes a difference

Stroking the C85 adds no weight and gets you almost as many ponies as the O-200

My 85-horse J3 does pretty good. "Backcountry" however is all relative. It all depends on just how short and rough you want to be. But I would say if those are your only 2 choices - stick w/ the L-4 and modify to suit since you are experimental.

whee wrote:I'd keep the L4 and the C85 but install a set of pistons from Bob Barrows and a Catto prop.

whee, yeah, it looks like I'll keep the 'ol L4, but I'm not sure if I'll keep the C85 or switch to the O-200 since I already have it. The difference is that I have been flying with the 85 for quite a while without a hiccup, and the O-200 (half life) is a new engine for me. The reason why I tend to favor the O-200 is that with high compression pistons, I can push it to 110-115 hp which would help a lot considering my 230 lbs. frame!! That's mine, not the airplane's!!!

The C85 with O200 crank and Bobs pistons will give you the same 110ish hp and not add weight.

PatínLoco wrote:

8GCBC wrote:My first thought...

Do a paper weight and balance with "new" engine before you decide. See if you like proposed CG?

8GCBC, there are several J-3 Cubs flying with O-200 engines. I have gotten a lot of good information from http://www.j-3.com, which is a great forum for J-3/L4s. There is a guy, JimC (Cunningham) who has been flying one for one for a long time and loves it. He has been my inspiration.

By the way, the O-200 is 12 lbs heavier than the C85-8. I need to get on a diet!!!

Good deal. Thank you for the info. I sometimes join a thread to learn too (more often than not ).

soyAnarchisto wrote:Hey PatinLoco - that 12lbs is way out front too - makes a difference

Stroking the C85 adds no weight and gets you almost as many ponies as the O-200

My 85-horse J3 does pretty good. "Backcountry" however is all relative. It all depends on just how short and rough you want to be. But I would say if those are your only 2 choices - stick w/ the L-4 and modify to suit since you are experimental.

Yeah, I guess that makes more sense. That's really what I'm looking for. I need the power without the weight. Any idea who can do the "stroking"?

Dons Dream Machine will build you a certified stroker C85. Bob Borrows will build you a experimental stroker C85.

whee wrote:The C85 with O200 crank and Bobs pistons will give you the same 110ish hp and not add weight.

Now that's the perfect solution!! Do you have the web site for Bob Barrows?? And why would you go with them instead of LyCon??

whee wrote:Dons Dream Machine will build you a certified stroker C85. Bob Borrows will build you a experimental stroker C85.

I got the information on DDM, but can't seem to find the web site for BB for some reason.

Bob doesn't have a website but you can call him and he is happy to anwser any and all questions.

Bob Barrows, R & B Aircraft - (540)473-3661

I talked with Bob quite a bit about his pistons and I liked some of the features he designed into them: standard wrist pin with retaining clips instead of a piston pin, oil passage to lube the wrist pin bearing, lighter weight, and keeps the compression low enough to run 93 octane.