I just signed a lease to rent hangar space to a new freight company. The company will specialize in freight/passengers to and from the northern Native communities. They will be using a new GippsAero GA8 Airvan http://www.gippsaero.com/aircraft/ga8-airvan.aspx (it will be the only one in Canada). I was not familiar with this plane, but according to the freight company and what I have read, it is quite a performer.

The plane was shipped by container from Australia to the Seattle area and is currently being re-assembled there. The company pilots will train on the plane in Seattle and hope to be back to put it in service within the next two weeks.

Steve

Wow, 2 weeks? Has Transport C already done their conformity inspections? First type to be operated commercially in the country, might take them a little while.

An old coworker of mine is operating a couple out of ANC now, Grant Aviation. He likes them because of the performance and the "new" aspect, they've had good dispatch reliability.

Should be a good plane for the mission, always good to see somebody willing to try a new airplane in a new market.

A few years ago, I had the opportunity to fly an Airvan for an hour. Had four souls and full gas.....not a max load, but I was very favorably impressed by that airplane.

Lots of nice features: flexible seating, including the ability to install seats facing sideways, that big sliding door on the right side, great flight characteristics, and lots more.

New airplanes have a steep climb in this market, but the low time, nice condition older airplanes are going away fast, and the Cessna 206 H really isn't competitive in this commercial market. Except for the Caravan, Cessna apparently could care less about the commercial market.

This appears to me a very viable option.

MTV

Does it have de-ice capabilities? I'd think you'd want that in Canada!

I flew an Airvan Out of Smithers BC for a bit. I didn't get too much time on it because we sold it (we bought a Caravan and a Shorts). That plane started the company. As mentioned, the plane had some very good features. I didn't fly it enough to form an opinion on it....wish I could have.

I think this aircraft is being assembled and outfitted at Olympia KOLM airport in Olympia, WA by the folks at Soloy aviation.

I had a close look at one while having some avionics work down there. Hulking beast of an aircraft. Fit and finish seemed a little "basic". Not sure on performance etc.

The California Highway Patrol has selected the Airvan to replace the Cessna fleet after a review of capabilities.
Another SOCAL police agency just had one outfitted with Garmin's at Howard Avionics in CA as well.
Pretty rugged design... just not as cool as a Beaver.

Seems pretty large and heavy for "only" a 300-320hp 540-- since it's a recip, I would have guessed they'd use a 720.

Not exactly on-topic, but this aircraft looks like a really good candidate for the aluminum V8 conversions like the ones they do on Seabees. Obviously it would be a big certification project, but 400HP on car gas, with an engine that would certainly be a lot less expensive than a turbine, combined with the size and apparent toughness of this beastie seems like it would be a winner. The CAP had one or two of them here in SoCal at an airshow a while back, and it definitely looked like it was built for rough service.

SA Maule wrote:The 300 normally aspirated is a bit of a dog in hot in high, but the the turbo gives some great performance

The one I flew was not turbo'd. We sure could have used a turbo operating north of Smithers.

"There's no replacement for displacement"

northernguy wrote:

SA Maule wrote:The 300 normally aspirated is a bit of a dog in hot in high, but the the turbo gives some great performance

The one I flew was not turbo'd. We sure could have used a turbo operating north of Smithers.

"There's no replacement for displacement"

Except for boost. That's a pretty good replacement for displacement.

EZFlap wrote: Not exactly on-topic, but this aircraft looks like a really good candidate for the aluminum V8 conversions like the ones they do on Seabees. ......

Just how many Seabees are flying behind (under?) one of those V8's? I'd be surprised if it was more than just a couple. I haven't heard about very many if any auto-engine conversions that held up. There's a reason why there's a difference between airplane engines and car engines.

Halestorm wrote:Wow, 2 weeks? Has Transport C already done their conformity inspections? First type to be operated commercially in the country, might take them a little while.

An old coworker of mine is operating a couple out of ANC now, Grant Aviation. He likes them because of the performance and the "new" aspect, they've had good dispatch reliability.

Should be a good plane for the mission, always good to see somebody willing to try a new airplane in a new market.

Yute Air looked at them a few years back as a direct replacement for our ancient Sleds (C207's), but the bottom line killed the deal. Too much money to gain a couple hundred pounds in useful load, and they didn't want to deal with the Feds in introducing new airplanes to the fleet. So, they stayed with what has always worked for them, though I have no clue how they keep finding parts for 'em, or get the locals to keep riding in them, especially in winter with everyone spoiled with bleed air and heat.

I got to sit in one when when I was out of OTZ and in ANC for whatever reason. Sure was nice to sit in a new airplane. It reminded me of an Islander, and looked like it'd be a good airplane to work with.

Gump

Mahindra makes a pretty decent little tractor, no reason why they shouldn't be able to make an airplane.

Gippsland (now Mahindra) originally designed the Airvan to 'fill the gap' between the 206 and the Caravan; I bet it does that job nicely, based on the previous Comments here.

An interesting aside... a good majority of the airplane is manufactured here in the States, then shipped to AUS for Final Assembly...

http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/oshkosh-mahindra-floats-us-assembly-for-rebranded-airvan-402161/

Grant aviation here in Alaska just bought a couple. I'm told they do like them. I heard from a mechanic that they run super cold oil temps due to the engine having two oil coolers because they were built for such hot climates. I wondered why they could not just remove them but apparently that is not approved. Something like 150 degree oil temps.
On a side note about 207's. I think even if the cessna 207 was still in current production allot of operators would still have the same POS 207. There are not many parts that can't be purchased or fabricated still for the old 207 battle axe. I think in many cases the operator puts far to little into maintaining the fleet of antique 207.

The biggest problem any manufacturer faces in the commercial aviation market is simply the cost of a new aircraft compared to used aircraft.

At about $800,000 a copy for a new Airvan, that's a pretty steep curve to climb, when you could purchase and refurbish a few older planes for that same price......

New airplanes look pretty, and have a warranty, but......

One operator in Fairbanks used to buy old clapped out Navajos, give them a fresh paint job, new, basic interior, and a few radios, and put them on the line. Those airplanes spent all night in the shop, trying to more or less keep ahead of the big maintenance items (generally not successfully), but the customers were impressed by the fresh look of the planes.

Meanwhile down the ramp, Wright Air Service started buying new Caravans back in about 1986, and now has a half dozen, all bought new.....

But, the Caravan is an order of magnitude more airplane than a GA 8.

It's like Tubo Beavers vs Turbine converted Otters.....you can make that big Otter pay the bills.....but the turbine Beaver not so much.

I wish Mahindra the best, because they're the only company in business right now who's building a decent utility airplane of this size. Maybe as those old beaters continue to be used up, the market will pick up for them.

MTV

Yup. You can buy five Sleds for the price of one AirVan, and each Sled will make almost the same amount of money per hour flown as the AirVan. That's hard math to fight.

Long, long term the upgraded equipment will prevail and be a moneymaker, but most small Part 135 outfits in AK don't have the luxury of long term financial stability. In that tiny little corner of the world, western and northwestern Alaska, nothing has ever come close to the lowly C207 as a profitable airplane.

Though, when they finally run out of the old stuff, you're gonna need new old stuff.

Gump

GumpAir wrote:Yup. You can buy five Sleds for the price of one AirVan, and each Sled will make almost the same amount of money per hour flown as the AirVan. That's hard math to fight.

Long, long term the upgraded equipment will prevail and be a moneymaker, but most small Part 135 outfits in AK don't have the luxury of long term financial stability. In that tiny little corner of the world, western and northwestern Alaska, nothing has ever come close to the lowly C207 as a profitable airplane.

Though, when they finally run out of the old stuff, you're gonna need new old stuff.

Gump

Yep, by then, there should be a bunch of old, clapped out Caravans.....but those PT 6s are still God awful spendy to buy or overhaul.

MTV

mtv wrote:

GumpAir wrote:Yup. You can buy five Sleds for the price of one AirVan, and each Sled will make almost the same amount of money per hour flown as the AirVan. That's hard math to fight.

Long, long term the upgraded equipment will prevail and be a moneymaker, but most small Part 135 outfits in AK don't have the luxury of long term financial stability. In that tiny little corner of the world, western and northwestern Alaska, nothing has ever come close to the lowly C207 as a profitable airplane.

Though, when they finally run out of the old stuff, you're gonna need new old stuff.

Gump

Yep, by then, there should be a bunch of old, clapped out Caravans.....but those PT 6s are still God awful spendy to buy or overhaul.

MTV

Then it will cost the Taxpayers that much more to fly in Disposable diapers and soda pop!