On October 21, 2006, a Helio H-295 float plane crashed and sank in Lake Isabel, an alpine lake near Gold Bar, WA. According to the NTSB preliminary report, "The takeoff was normal until the airplane reached an altitude of 50 to 75 feet at which point he noticed that the engine was producing only '2/3rds power with full throttle.' The pilot was concerned about not being able to clear trees at the end of the lake if he continued straight ahead, so he elected to execute a 180 degree turn and land back on the lake. As the steep left turn was completed, the airplane lost lift, and the landing was hard. The airplane began to rapidly fill with water, and the pilot and passenger exited through the rear cabin door. As the pilot and passenger were swimming to shore, the airplane completely submerged."

This one has me wondering. Why wouldn't the pilot just lower the nose and land straight ahead? 50-75 feet seems like an extremely low altitude to attempt a 180 degree turn. The NTSB report says that according to a representative of the owner, there are no plans to recover the airplane from the lake.

Would the insurance company pay without seeing the wreckage? And what happens to all the oil and gas in the plane? This is a pristine alpine lake.

I read in the paper that this same pilot had just been fined $20,000 (the same month as the crash) by the Public Disclosure Commission for campaign fraud. He is a city councilman.

I can see a real problem with a recovery operation on Lake Isabel. It is either fly in or hike in and the trail is not an easy trail. Bringing in recovery equipment would be very difficult and costly. Also alpine lakes often times tend to be very deep complicating things even more with the issues of high altitude and deep diving. Unless the Forest Services mandates removal of the wreckage I'll bet that plane stays there for a long time.

I used to go into Isabel years back. I believe there is an airplane or two on the bottom already.
This one seems really weird to me. Helio Courier, only two, Lake Isabel. This is going to be an interesting story. I've seen a turbine Beaver depart from the beach to the west with no problem. A friend of mine once departed (due to the wind) to the EAST and turned around inside the bowl while climbing in a 135 h.p. Champ on PK 1800's! Also seen 206's depart light with the back taxi with no problem. So it would seem that someone screwed the pooch. 2/3rd's power, how's about three or so inches short of full because the freakin' place is at 3k msl. And if it was at 2/3rd's power why was it not aborted while still plowing?
I bet that thing stays up there. Our insurance rates go up. The fuel and oil surface and run down the mountain into the pacific with all the other fuel and oil.

You know the solution to pollution is dilution. Or that is what it used to be. As a diver in the navy I made a few dives around Guam in 1968. They had a few oil and fuel spills in the early 40's and that place cleaned up pretty good.

Tim

Tad bit of difference between alpine lake eco-system and open subtropical ocean.

Not being much of an expert but reading a little between the lines here;
2/3rds power and he gets off the lake in one of the few A/C that is renowned for it's slow flight capabilities and almost non-existent stall characteristics. Granted, he put it back, just hard. It appears to have been lightly loaded, two people though no mention of gear on board. The one thing that seems glaringly obvious is that it was Oct. 21, at a higher altitude and he was unable to maintain the altitude he attained. Bet he didn't have wing covers....
Recovery would likely be possible but is it economically feasible? $150-175k hull value, parts for that thing are astronomical if available, maybe the reason for the insurance company taking it. That will probably take a year or so to sort out anyway.
Should the insurance company choose though, recovery could be done with say a Sky Crane. On the environmental end of things, wonder if the State or Fed.s would ever get around to enforcing the "You messed it up, you clean it up" angle like they do with land? Owner responsible remediation.
A waste of a good plane in any case.

I agree w/ sanjuander that if the loss of power was from the get go then the he probably was not off the water at his lift off decision point. Even if he was off the water at the decision point lack of acceleration in ground effect should have been a tip off on the power loss and he still would have had time for a straight ahead landing.

To make a turn at the West end of the lake from 50'-75' would require at least a 60 degree banked turn. With the increased drag and stall speed in that steep a turn the plane probably quit flying. I know Helio's are exceptional low speed aircraft but they still subject to the same aerodynamics.

There is a little rotor that tends to push you down as you approach the exit if the wind is out of the NW. Maybe that was part of the issue.

I have made several attempts in my M5 w/ Aqua 2400's out of Isabel when the wind died on a hot day with a heavy plane. So far the only thing repeated attempts have cost me is time, fuel, and dented ego.

I really would like to hear what the pilot has to say. We can arm chair this until the cows come home, but we were not there.

TomD wrote:I have made several attempts in my M5 w/ Aqua 2400's out of Isabel when the wind died on a hot day with a heavy plane. So far the only thing repeated attempts have cost me is time, fuel, and dented ego.

I have landed at a few high altitude lakes, in calm conditions (they're in the log book) but was afraid to let the plane off the step. High altitude and a calm lake with glassy water is like glue. The slow flight characteristics of the Helio, allowing it to get off the lake, may have been it's demise.

Mark

Tom D said he'd like to hear what the pilot has to say. Well, he's not talking, apparently referring questions to his "representative" .

It seems odd that there has been little to nothing written in the papers about this incident. Especially since the pilot is a Monroe attorney and on the city council to boot. His name has been in the news a lot lately (Seattle Times, the Everett Herald, etc.) because of his campaign concealment violations and whopping $20,000 fine.

Do insurance companies pay out without examining the wreckage?

The owner is listed as a leasing outfit in Monroe,named for the councilman, & the airplane appears to be based at Firstair Field. Interesting- there's a noted Helio rebuilder/repairer based there also, who's well-versed at salvage operations under adverse conditions. Recovery'd probably be a cakewalk for him.
NTSB report sez 1400 PDT, aka 2 pm. Afternoon frost on the wings in late October-- possible but doubtful. I assume that's what you were referring to,Kurt, with regards to wing covers.
Environmentally speaking, I'd think that any fuel/oil would float atop the water in the lake. Winter rainfall/runoff should flush that stuff out,down the Skykomish/Snohomish River system and out to sea near Everett. Not good, but (eventually) the dilution solution seems feasible. Shoreline of lake & outlet stream might need some special attention though.
Any apparent "shadiness" aside, at least local pilots have one of their own looking out for them on the city council. That should make patrons of the local airport(s) breathe a little easier anyway. I wish we had a pilot on our local county comission, or even on the airport board.

Eric

We've talked with Jim about recoveries at the location in question.
Access to the lake is very difficult (you're not going to be able to
pack in heavy recovery equipment on the trails that exist). Helicopter
sling-loads full of diving and floatation euipment, etc. was discussed,
but it is very expensive (figure $2K/hour for a UH-1). Then you need
tools to dis-assemble whatever it is you float up to the surface, and
then ya gotta helicopter sling-load the pieces out (more $$$$$$).

Also, the divers we talked to both balked at diving that deep (forget
what the estimated depth of the wreckage is) in water that cold.

Bottom line, the insurance company would be inclined to write the
owner a check and leave the aircraft there (like someone else said,
there are several aircraft at the bottom of that lake). A Luscombe
on floats comes to mind....

We've done one water recovery where the State (or whomever
the entity was, ecology folks, etc.) "forced" the insurance companies
hand to recover/remove the aircraft. For what it's worth, the salvage
value of what came to the surface didn't begin to cover the recovery
cost....

i would guess the insurance company will simply cut a check and accept the ac as a total loss...

diver safety is a huge factor in this type of recovery operation... flying and diving don't mix, and many divers have die as a result of flying home to early from dive vacations... so any diving operation over 66ft deep requires additional time on the mountain or in a chamber... in fact depending on the altitude, dive depth and time working at depth, divers could be required to spend up to 1 week on the mountain before flying... deep diving at altitude is possible but presents a set of unique challenges which will increase the recovery operations overall cost...

The rules of salvage are different in the open ocean than on inland waters. The Glomar Explorer comes to mind. Howard Hughs not only was a wiz at airplane stuff but not too shabby at sea. As I recall it was a Russian Kilo class ballistic missile boat that the Explorer partially salvaged.

As far as a deep cold water recover is concerned, going deep is really tough without really expensive gear. Interesting article about some deep diving. http://www.specialoperations.com/Operat ... bells.html

Tim

Lake elevation is only 2,800 feet so diving at that altitude will only diminish bottom time by a small amount. The problem as previously stated would be flying out again but a 24 hour lay over would suffice to preclude any decompression sickness, assuming you "stay on the tables" during your dive(s). I have personally dove at Lake Tahoe and it's not a big deal as long as you follow the tables or dive on an altitude compensated computer. (I think most of them are now)

The real problem, in my opinion, would be how deep the wreck is. Your bottom time could be limited to a few minutes per dive if it is in any more than 100 feet. (unless you wanted to use mixed gas) Pretty hard to get anything done when you only have five minutes at a time. As far as the cold goes, most divers considering this kind of work would be wearing dry suits so it's not a big deal.

Salvage rights vary and you may not get a straight story from the insurance company. My brother was given salvage rights to a stolen and sunk Mac Tool truck in a lake by an insurance company once. They told him it's all his, they had written it off and faxed him a statement saying so. This was ten years ago and things may have changed. The insurance companies now worry about the liability and perceived permission to attempt a salvage. I wouldn't dive without something saying I had permission from the owner (which is the insurance company once they pay off)

My bet is Lake Isabel now has another bottom decoration for the next hundred years or so.

Sure is pretty there though...

If the Department of Ecology or some other agency imposes a fine for the environmental cleanup, who pays it--the pilot or the insurance company?

I'm guessing it's the pilot, but who knows?

in speaking with my dad, he states, mixed gas would be the most cost effective method on this type of salvage operation, if the depth is 80ft plus, at which point the 2,800 ft altitude is a serious factor that would be taken into consideration...

funny you mention "Ivy Bells", pops was in charge of all dive/recovery operations on this and NASA's Mercury & Apollo missions, plus the loss of the USS Thresher sub, which was lost with it's crew off the eastern seaboard during it's initial sea trials, because we didn't have the technology at the time to reach and save the crew, who were alive for several days after it sank... This one incident affected pops to the point he dedicated the reminder of his career developing new submarine rescue methods, many of which are still used today... He also worked with Jacques Cousteau on several projects...

N6EA wrote:Lake elevation is only 2,800 feet so diving at that altitude will only diminish bottom time by a small amount. The problem as previously stated would be flying out again but a 24 hour lay over would suffice to preclude any decompression sickness, assuming you "stay on the tables" during your dive(s). I have personally dove at Lake Tahoe and it's not a big deal as long as you follow the tables or dive on an altitude compensated computer. (I think most of them are now)

The real problem, in my opinion, would be how deep the wreck is. Your bottom time could be limited to a few minutes per dive if it is in any more than 100 feet. (unless you wanted to use mixed gas) Pretty hard to get anything done when you only have five minutes at a time. As far as the cold goes, most divers considering this kind of work would be wearing dry suits so it's not a big deal.

Salvage rights vary and you may not get a straight story from the insurance company. My brother was given salvage rights to a stolen and sunk Mac Tool truck in a lake by an insurance company once. They told him it's all his, they had written it off and faxed him a statement saying so. This was ten years ago and things may have changed. The insurance companies now worry about the liability and perceived permission to attempt a salvage. I wouldn't dive without something saying I had permission from the owner (which is the insurance company once they pay off)

My bet is Lake Isabel now has another bottom decoration for the next hundred years or so.

Sure is pretty there though...

A subtext to this entire recovery discussion is that Isabel is in a proposed Wilderness area ( Big Sky?) which was signed off on everyone but held up by Congressman Pombo of California. Pombo lost his seat and the Wilderness Act will probably now go through.

There was an agreement in place to maintain floatplane access to Isabel when it becomes part of the Wilderness area.

I am hoping dropping the Helio into the lake will not screw up this agreement.

Recovering it and cleaning up the gas and oil may be required to save our access to the lake.

Tom

I made a few calls and found out that the Dept of Ecology is insistent that the plane be brought out in the spring, providing it can be done safely. They want the lake to be restored to the pre-crash condition. Since it's federal land, the EPA may be called in to do the actual retrieval, and will pass those costs on to the owner. Sometimes the EPA makes the responsible person(s) pay three times the cost of clean-up. I don't know what criteria they use to make that determination.

The Director of DOE is an acquaintance. He called me for advice when he had a problem with his boat sinking. I will field a call to see what info I can get.

A couple of comments and a couple of questions

Helios can be a bitch if the wing slats drop out at different times, this is prone to happen during very slow, steep turns but sounds like the guy made the turn and then dropped it hard?

I know of a guy who salvaged a front end loader out of quite deep, cold water without even getting his feet wet. He took a thousand foot or so of heavy cable and hooked the ends to two tug boats. They drug the cable along the bottom with the boats several hundred feet apart untill they hung up on the loader. They then made circles with the tugs in oposite directions for several turns and headed for shore. They drug the loader in untill they could tranfer the cables to bulldozers on shore and dragged the fool thing right up onto the beach Might work in this case it you could find the plane with sonar and get a positive location.

I am a pilot and a diver and I understand about compression tables and such but is there some reason why you can't fly away from a place like this lake safely as long as you maintain very low altitudes?

If the fuel can float out of the tanks it will be all gone before springtime unless the lake freezes over, It will evaporate very quickly after it hits the surface. I should think that even the oil will evaporate most of the ethers out of it and form tar balls that will sink, unless aircraft oil is far more stable than most other stuff. Sometimes when we go in and "clean up" a mess we damage things alot more than if we just left it alone.