So I wasted 10 hrs worth of fuel to go look at a better than new 185

Why do people claim of restorations when they have no clue what that even means.

Could they at least overhaul or replace the 20+ year old instruments when they make claims of near perfect.

And when asked of damage history could they please refrain from lies of none

Even though its happened many times before It still makes my blood boil
Just be honest and say its a piece of S*$# but its mine and I love it.

Then I get the old, well its not a show plane like yours,
Huh the Scout is far from that.

Maybe I can start a self help group called Hanger Queens Anonymous

Being down to one airplane is harder than I thought it would be

Come on! My 150 IS perfect!
Just got the really optimistic VSI...and the radio gets a big scratchy at times...and panel trim has seen better days...there's some hail damage, but you can only see it in the right light...and that oil drip is normal for O-200's...don't mind that the map case flops open sometimes...

But otherwise, she's perfect!

Besides, is avgas that went through the engine ever really wasted?

Phil

That's why I ended up buying an airplane that was advertised as needing paint and interior and was priced as such. I learned pretty quickly that what most people called a restoration is what we rednecks call a "Mary Carter overhaul". It was costing me I figured about $800 each time I had to travel out of state to look at an airplane. I decided that all I was looking for was a straight airframe that whatever damage had been correctly repaired and assume the avionics and instruments were junk. Of course, I was looking for a C-140, which is pretty far down the food chain from a C-185

And it seems like the same people want at least $10,000 more than one should even think about paying (esp. cubs!).

Just be honest and say its a piece of S*$# but its mine and I love it.

My wife says that about me all the time...

I live in a fairly populated part of the world so perhaps it's easier for me to do this, but I simply won't consider purchasing an airplane that I have to travel any real distance to. When I browse through trade-a-plane I sort the aircraft by state and don't even bother looking at distant aircraft.

It's a shame, but people are people, and when it comes to money most people are liars, or at least irrationally optimistic about the value of what they own.

I bought mine from the father of my mechanic. I knew that it had been pretty much sitting in FL for the past four years, but I also knew that I was going to have good help nearby.

I've learned that TLC really means "Takes Lots of Cash", but the journey has been fun and I've learned a hell of a lot.

Don

Okay.










It is a piece of shit but it's mine and I love it.

The other side of this coin is the buyer who comes in the door, trying to beat an honest owner out of a fair price for an airplane. I've had that happen. I advertised it honestly, and told the guy up front that this was the price, NO negotiating. He comes in and trys to nickel and dime every little thing on the plane.

In that case, I simply told him to go to hell, that I wouldn't take his money for my airplane even if he offered me $10 K more than I was asking. Didn't answer the phone if he called after.

Buyers and sellers can both be a serious pain in the butt. That is simply part of the process.

If you are buying something, you'd better be prepared to do the research. If you're selling, you'd better be prepared to deal with the jerks.

MTV

I'll be selling the 170 if and when I find the right 150/150TD, so I've done some thinking about this from both buyer and seller points of view.
Selling, everyone wants to know what the airplane is "on a scale of 10". I've had people tell me their airplane is an 8, then I look at it... yeah, an 8 on a scale of 5 to 10 maybe. Honestly, I'd have to rate my 170 as maybe a 5 or 6 exterior and a 6 or 7 inside, on a scale of 1 to 10- that might even be wishful thinking. Trouble is, you tell people that who are used to grading on the "scale of 5 to 10", and they think it's a piece of crap and don't even want to look at it. Kinda like asking too low a price- everybody thinks it's a POS and they don't even call. My 170, BTW, does have a few issues but they are not really airworthiness issues, except in the long long run- like how many times do you want to weld up cracks in the exhaust. But it is a bit cosmetically challenged-- old, faded paint on the outside and somewhat color-mismatched inside. But it ain't no hangar queen- I've flown it over 1600 hours in the 10 or so years I've had it. Except for OH'ing the engine 7 years ago, and welding the exhaust every 3 years or so, it's pretty much been a gas 'n' go airplane.
I've heard of people doing the "oh, this air filter needs replacement, knock off $10" kinda thing all over the airplane. To me, these old airplanes are for sale "as is, where is". Buyer should look it over, and make an offer if so inclined-- seller will either take it or leave it, or make a counteroffer.
BTW, I'm planning on asking around $30K-ish OBO for the 170 when it goes on the block. Email or PM for more info if interested.

Eric

I've become very good friends with the guy that sold me my 180.

We agreed on a good price with a little haggling

He still has his other C180 - the last one ever made... N180FN

He has a hangar on his strip and we get the engineer to come around to do the annuals. It's become a yearly pilgrimage for me with a few days of work and plenty of beers in the evening.

mtv wrote:... I advertised it honestly, and told the guy up front that this was the price, NO negotiating........... MTV

I wish this was the case with everything... you know, like at the grocery store- here's the price, buy it or not. Trouble is, most big ticket items arel priced, bought, & sold with haggling in mind. I would rather have a "no dicker sticker" price, but on the other hand, even when the seller sez "price firm", alot of the times he doesn't really mean it. So when I approach selling or buying something, I figure the asking price is set with that in mind. But I agree about the nickel and diming-- if someone wants to make a lowball offer, fine, but don't try to do a deduct for every squawk item.

Eric

When I sold my last cub the buyer said " will you take a little less" I said "no but I would take a little more" With that he wrote the check.

When I sell something I price it right no matter what it is, car, motorcycle, boat etc. Piss'es me off when people over price their stuff.

Like I said, I'd prefer a no-dicker sticker, but most people just don't want to pay asking price. For anything. So ask a little high & let them knock you down a tad, then everybody's happy.

zero one,

I agree--I really don't mind if someone wants to make an offer. I can always say no thanks. As noted, what torques me is a guy coming in saying that the paint isn't new. Well, no joke--I told him on the phone that the paint was 14 years old, etc.

MTV

After spending TIME and money traveling across two states twice to look at misrepresented airplanes, we paid a little more than I wanted too for a very good 170B. Traveling around the country side to look at planes can be very time consuming, and frustrating.

Looked at a nice 170A in MN. I asked the guy if the glass was in good condition? "Yes the glass is good." When we walked up to the plane the first thing my wife saw was the cracked windshield. So I asked him why he didn't tell me the glass was cracked. He said it was stop drilled and therefore it's ok. Shit

What the hell else didn't he tell me. BIG waste of time. What broke the deal for this guy is that he didn't tell me the windshield was cracked. Pissed me off, long drive home.

I learned that you need to ask if the glass is cracked, discolored, scratched, any finger prints on it, when was it last cleaned?

Had two trips like this, waste of time and money traveling to places I didn't want to go.

So we bought a 170B, almost sight unseen. The seller said "I guarantee you will love this airplane. I will bring it to you for this price. If you don't like it, pay my fuel and I will take it home." It was everything he said it would be and just the way he described it. I paid him his price and everyone lived happily ever after.

Any way I guess this whole thread is why man created auctions.

Bill

That's why Caesar coined the phrase "caveat emptor, Brutus"