1SeventyZ wrote:

Skystrider wrote:So the latest is that the crew was busy on their laptop computers. I think they had those new laptops. You know, the ones that fold out.

They were either 1) Posting on BCP, or 2) Playing World of Warcraft on the new Airtel in-flight wireless.

Or Farming/Farmville on Facebook

Apperantly, the two pilots are from the Northwest (one from OR and the other from WA).

http://news.aol.com/article/wayward-pilots-we-were-on-laptops/735575?icid=main|htmlws-main-n|dl1|link3|http%3A%2F%2Fnews.aol.com%2Farticle%2Fwayward-pilots-we-were-on-laptops%2F735575

Don't be too quick to lynch these guys. Yeah, from the published information it looks like they screwed up but let the investigators do their job. What the media reports is very seldom the actual facts. The FAA seems to be on a crusade as of late and more in favor of revocation than suspension. From what I've read they have already informed these guys that they may face revocation. Very sad to think that two guys with otherwise spottless records will lose their careers over a NORDO/lapse in professionalism incident.

It will be interesting what explanation finally comes out. For my $.02 worth, their is no excuse for their behavior. To fly for 1:20 in the middle of the USA under positive control and NOT hear or acknowledge any ATC communications AND miss your destination airport with all the bells and whistles in their cockpit is pitiful. This was a 3.5 hr flight, not a trans oceanic flight. These guys are paid good money and recieve tons of training to fly passengers safely and professionaly. They failed in both cases.

When I fly cross country VFR and have flight following I get nervous if I don't hear some chatter now and then. If I am tired, I have my pilot wife fly while I take a nap. When I am on an IFR flight, there is constant communications and to go 15 minutes with a quiet mike is unusual. These guys lucked out by having a voice recorder that only recorded what they had to say while landing. When all is said and done, I will be surprised if they don't get suspended at the least.

I hate to say this as I really feel for these guys, BUT I have not seen anyone look into the camera and tell such a whopper since the runaway balloon guy!

This just in. They got their tickets jerked by the FAA.

read more here: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/28/us/28plane.html

tom

courierguy wrote:I hate to say this as I really feel for these guys, BUT I have not seen anyone look into the camera and tell such a whopper since the runaway balloon guy!

curious....

....as to why you think that they have told a "Whopper"? Not an argument....just wondering about your logic.

Thanks,

Bob

Pretty sure these guys will be looking for a new line of work soon. Too bad, given their experience and past record. If they do get their tickets back, this is not the time to be looking for a good airline job. Especially with a big black mark on your record. For the life of me, I dont see how two pilots could fly that far past their descent point untill the attendants got their attention. "knock-knock"..."hey there captain, uh....ya think maybe we should start down now?... What up?" The question I have is, just how far would these guys have flown on auto-pilot past their destination if the flight attendants didn't notice something was up? Untill they looked out and saw a couple of F-16s out their window rocking their wings? Yea, that would have looked real good. In hindsight, they would be better off if they would have reported that they had both fell asleep. That's a poor excuse, but it beats "What....we were on our laptops".

I wonder how much fuel they landed with?

I guess that it is better for that to happen in an Air Bus than a Greyhound Bus. Besides the big running dog, what is the difference.

Tim

Maybe not as bad as your laporoscopic surgeon falling asleep or playing video games during the procedure, but it's not entirely dissimilar.

I am curious if something like this would have been a big deal before 9-11 or prior to that. 100 plus miles sounds like a lot, but probably not much more than 10 minutes in the air. I am not saying that they didn't mess up but to get distracted for 10 to 15 minutes and the FAA yanks their ticket?

1SeventyZ wrote:

Skystrider wrote:So the latest is that the crew was busy on their laptop computers. I think they had those new laptops. You know, the ones that fold out.

They were either 1) Posting on BCP, or 2) Playing World of Warcraft on the new Airtel in-flight wireless.

...or 3) surfing porn sites. One thing for sure, when the FAA gets done with them, they will need to check out Monster.com for a new job.

gb

What you need to understand is the arrival they were supposed to be on started at Redwood Falls, MN.(RWF), approx 90 flying miles SW of MSP. They should have expected to be descending to the initial altitude of the arrival well before that, probably 75-100 miles SW of RWF. So they didn't just miss MSP by 100 miles, they missed something they've done hundreds of times by about 300 miles which was approx 45 minutes.

Just dawned on me that they were still a cruising altitude.

Bonanza Man wrote:What you need to understand is the arrival they were supposed to be on started at Redwood Falls, MN.(RWF), approx 90 flying miles SW of MSP. They should have expected to be descending to the initial altitude of the arrival well before that, probably 75-100 miles SW of RWF. So they didn't just miss MSP by 100 miles, they missed something they've done hundreds of times by about 300 miles which was approx 45 minutes.

I'm with you now....not good

I spoke to some of the controllers who were working that night. The mainstream media is going with the laptop or maybe lying about sleeping story. I guess the controllers sincerely thought this was actually going to be another Payne Stewart incident. I'm told the military didn't scramble because their wasn't much they could do or really even see since it was already dark. The plane was on a NE track and Northwest knew exactly how much fuel was on the plane, the fuel burn, and the exact time the plane would run out of fuel. The plane was predicted to run out of fuel and crash somewhere in a fairly remote section of southern Canada. If the crew was incapacitated and the flight deck door securely locked could the passengers get in to rescue the plane? That is just not a good thought....

When I was controlling about 2 years ago there was a twin cessna that was supposed to land at one of our smaller airports. The plane flew right over at 13,000' and finally ran out of fuel over South Carolina. It was horrible watching that plane fly by and not be able to do anything about it.

cabinflyer wrote:I spoke to some of the controllers who were working that night. The mainstream media is going with the laptop or maybe lying about sleeping story. I guess the controllers sincerely thought this was actually going to be another Payne Stewart incident. I'm told the military didn't scramble because their wasn't much they could do or really even see since it was already dark. The plane was on a NE track and Northwest knew exactly how much fuel was on the plane, the fuel burn, and the exact time the plane would run out of fuel. The plane was predicted to run out of fuel and crash somewhere in a fairly remote section of southern Canada. If the crew was incapacitated and the flight deck door securely locked could the passengers get in to rescue the plane? That is just not a good thought....

When I was controlling about 2 years ago there was a twin cessna that was supposed to land at one of our smaller airports. The plane flew right over at 13,000' and finally ran out of fuel over South Carolina. It was horrible watching that plane fly by and not be able to do anything about it.

You know, you brought up an interesting senario. What if the two pilots for what ever reason (worse case senario) (and probably will never happen, but) did become incapacitated. I'm curious too, to find out if there's a way to get into the cockpit. But for security reason's, most of us will never know. But you would think that there's a way. Maybe the flight attendants know? Man, that's kind of worry some. Especially if I was on a flight and the two pilots up front became incapacitated and then there's no way for me or any other pilot that maybe on that flight to get up in the cockpit and rescue the plane.

But back to the two pilots of the Northwest flight. I going with they were sleeping (I know I'm jumping the gun here). But come on, how can two high time pilots F up that bad if they were completly awake doing what ever on there laptops? Maybe the company and the FAA checked there computers somehow to see if they were on during this 10-20 minute period (if that's possible?)?

I don't know, just too bad these two pilots had to loss there jobs this way. A good lesson for others, though.

It would have been a lot worse if they both ate the fish. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vosq85B_ ... re=related

Tim

qmdv wrote:It would have been a lot worse if they both ate the fish. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vosq85B_ ... re=related

Tim

One of my favorite movies! Tim, that's great!!