I'm curious what the typical PA-18/150 weighs in at. Hey you Cub guys, how about some real-life, no bullshit weights?
FWIW I have a D-model C150/150TD -- on 850's with minimal radios and minus the vacuum system & gyro's, it comes in at around 1240 with a gross of 1760.

Mine weighed in at 1147 (actual not paper) prior to my instrument panel/wiring/interior/exterior/engine overhaul project that's almost done. Threw out the old boat anchor gill 35 battery for an underseat odyssey, and ditched the vacuum system as well. Also shedding some weight up front with alternator conversion, and lightweight oil cooler...

Added 3"ext gear and a long step, hopefully after all this work I will have a net loss of 15-20 lbs.

I think it would be hard to get a "bush equipped" cub under 1100, without going to extremes like losing the starter and electrical systems.

Survey results: http://www.supercub.org/forum/showthrea ... pty+weight

I'd like to see a scattergram of actual weights though: As Bart implied, big variations based on equipment and fabric system/workmanship. And I DO know of some well under 1100# that aren't radical, just carefully done. And of course, probably more variation of modifications and equipment than just about any other G.A. aircraft. Weight drift is insidious, and "calculated" (a/k/a "pencilwhipped") Weight and Balance tend to be optimistically low over time.

Brian at Steve's Aircraft, does this square with your experience?

Thanks. cubscout

I think that if you go over that poll you'll find that most of the guys reporting under 1200# for a bush worthy cub are also reporting 'very stock' or original fabric. My experience has been that 99.9% of these cubs are still running off computations as opposed to scales.

A no BS bush worthy cub that hasn't had extensive attention to detail in the weight department is going to come in at 1250 +/- a few pounds.
For the purpose of this post Bushworthy means;

31's
Big brakes
Boosters instead of diaphragms
Big T/W
Pawnee or equivalent T/W spring
X'd top deck
X'd tail
Long gear
Long prop
Safety cables
Ext Baggage
Tie down doublers or Atlee spar wrap tie downs

and whatever personalization mods a particular owner requires


The good news is there are a ton of ways to save weight when comparing to a stock or older bushy cub as well. It is theoreticaly possible to get into the high 1000's with a bushy cub, but you will have to sacrifice. Mine at one time weighed 1034 on 31's...it is close to 1200 now If memory serves me, Paul K and Lonnie H's cubs are in under 1100. To get there they have no headliner, no radios, light weight everything possible. The kind of attention to detail I'm talking about here, is like when they remove the T/W chains, they go ahead and remove the arms from the T/W disk as well

Does that "no radios" and no tailwheel chains apply only to when they are in a takeoff competition, or do they fly all over remote Alaska that way all the time?

A friend who rebuilds cubs in Fairbanks owns a Super Cub that is an honest 1030 pounds, empty, on 29 inch bushwheels. It's equipped with an electrical system, with lightweight starter, pad mounted alternator, small battery, but has a full interior (cloth headliner), extended baggage, third seat, etc. I did a Cub checkout with a fellow in that cub, and it's a sweetheart. That said, if it isn't NECESSARY, it's not in there. And it was weighed on another shops scales. It also had the One Ton Cub GW kit, so GW is 2000. It can be done.

BUT, that cub was a 125 cub, so it has 13 rib wing instead of the 16 rib wing. Lots of basic differences between those early SC and later ones. Like most airplanes, Cubs got heavier through their production run.

The outfit I worked for worked over our Cubs at one point to reduce weights....they were porkers. The list of mods done to all:
1) Remove front mounted oil cooler, and replace with aluminum oil cooler mounted on aft baffle.
2) Replace Generator with lightweight alternator
3) Replace starter with lightweight starter.
4) Removed boat anchor Gill battery, and installed Odyssey battery under pilot's seat per Dan's A/C STC.

Those four mods removed an average of 44 pounds from the basic weight of these aircraft, without degrading functionality at all. That's six gallons of fuel.

B & C makes a small pad mounted alternator that weighs like 3 pounds. It'd have to be field approved, but that's happenign around here.

Lightest Cub I ever flew was 970. No electrics, no interior, silver dope on top surfaces only, handheld radio, VERY basic. And, it was a 13 rib wing airplane as well. It was on the old Goodyear 31 inch Airwheels. Fantastic beach airplane, but LOUD, COLD, and not very comfortable (NO padding on seats, for example).

Most of our Cubs, with reasonable equipment, wound up weighing right around 1200 pounds honest weights, and that's on big tires. I think that's a pretty reasonable goal.

If you want to build up a light one, find a 13 rib airplane to start with, then figure out what's NECESSARY, and remove anything that's not. Do you REALLY need to X the top deck? Do you REALLY need a vacuum system? Etc.

My last Super Cub weighed 1220 with a standard alternator and the brass oil cooler. It was a 79 model, so had metal flaps and ailerons.

MTV

cubscout wrote:Survey results: http://www.supercub.org/forum/showthrea ... pty+weight

I'd like to see a scattergram of actual weights though: As Bart implied, big variations based on equipment and fabric system/workmanship. And I DO know of some well under 1100# that aren't radical, just carefully done. And of course, probably more variation of modifications and equipment than just about any other G.A. aircraft. Weight drift is insidious, and "calculated" (a/k/a "pencilwhipped") Weight and Balance tend to be optimistically low over time.

Brian at Steve's Aircraft, does this square with your experience?

Thanks. cubscout

Hey there Cousin....

Ya it does... I have re-weighed several older cub's where the weight on the paper did not equal the weight on the scales....

Just for reference... Our 1953 AG model cub with 0-320 conversion weighed in at 1080 after the fuselage recover and re-paint of the wings...

Here are a few more...
PA-18 on Whipline Anphib floats with 0-360 - 1470
PA-18-150 - 1144
PA-18-150, Airframes Inc. fuselage - 1197
PA-18-105 special, bone stock - 1002
PA-18-150, 1982 ex military converted back to standard glass - 1152
PA-18-150, Airframes Inc. fuselage, dakota wings, kydex interior, ti firewall, other light weight bits - 1090

Just a few to show that it can vary quite a bit depending on model and what has been done to them. But, a no-thrills cub with the basic Alaska mods should run between 1100 to 1200 pounds... Any higher than 1200 and I would say its a bit of a porker.... That is if it does not have an 0-360 on the nose...

Brian.

1976 PA-18 (Round Wing)
O-320 160 HP
Borer Prop
31" AKBW Radials
AKBW TW
Stock Landing Gear
Original Factory Covering
LW Starter & Alt
LW Battery Mounter in Fuselage
Rear Mounted Oil Cooler
Fabric Headliner
Flaps Extended Inboard
No Extended Baggage
Basic VFR Panel
LW Seat Cover/Cushion
Empty Weight #1105 (Actually Weighed)

1956 PA18 90 (Round Wing)
O-200
Flaps Extended Inboard
Climb Prop
29" Airstreaks (Old School)
Stock Gear
No Electrical
Single 18 Gal Wing Tank
CC Drooping Aileron Kit
Very Basic VFR Panel
No Extended Baggage
Empty Weight #925

hotrod150 wrote:I'm curious what the typical PA-18/150 weighs in at. Hey you Cub guys, how about some real-life, no bullshit weights?
FWIW I have a D-model C150/150TD -- on 850's with minimal radios and minus the vacuum system & gyro's, it comes in at around 1240 with a gross of 1760.

Now why would you be curious....?

180 HP Carbon Cub EX is 920 lbs with all the bells and whistles and 26" air streaks. 1865 maximum gross.

Cub271 wrote:180 HP Carbon Cub EX is 920 lbs with all the bells and whistles and 26" air streaks. 1865 maximum gross.

I think the airstreaks are limited to 1650# airplanes. Thought about buying some but my gross is 1760.

onefitty wrote:

hotrod150 wrote:I'm curious what the typical PA-18/150 weighs in at. Hey you Cub guys, how about some real-life, no bullshit weights?
FWIW I have a D-model C150/150TD -- on 850's with minimal radios and minus the vacuum system & gyro's, it comes in at around 1240 with a gross of 1760.

Now why would you be curious....?

Like I said, just curious. Mainly about how my airplane stacks up against the average SuperCub (if there is such a thing)-- I'm giving away about 15 sq ft of wing area, just wondering how much weight I was giving away. They're different animals with different airfoils, but similar potential usage.