I am currently looking into picking up a 22 Tripacer to make a winter project. I have a friend that will be flying out with his 22/20 so I can take a good look and check the fit for our operations. I have the need to carry 2 skydivers (1 tandem pair) to 11K msl and hate sending my 206 for such a light load. Ive been looking into the mods that I need and sure I will spend more time and money building it up and maintaining it than the loss I would take from flying the 206 with a poor load factor. This will be my first tube and fabric plane mod and restoration so it will be for fun factor of building and having a cool hotrod in my backyard. My main goals are, 4 cyl, Carb, fixed pitch prop, big door to haul my meat out of, taildragger, and climb.
Question. Have you seen stripped 22 freighters? What have you put through the back left door of a 22? Ive found plenty of static photos of 22/20s and even monster versions but no freight working photos. If you know of a complete, was flying, needs covering, engine OH, 22 TriPacer or 22/20 that is for sale please let me know.

I have a 180 hp 22/20 that I was just getting ready to put an engine back in. I have not seen (or looked for) any mods for a bigger back door. I think it would be awful small to tandem jump from. That much weight in the back has never been fun either, unless the jumper is a kid or first semester college freshman. Fun plane otherwise.

I have a tripacer and I think you are pushing the capability limits there. The back door can be removed and could accommodate the pair but you would need to get rid of the back seat and frame. Fortunately you won’t have to land with the pair back there. There is an STC for a borer prop but I don't know what performance you would get at 11,000 ft. actually, with a 180 there is a STC for a constant speed prop if your engine is set up for it. Also, remember you cannot put a 180 in a tripacer, only one converted to a tail dragger.

Interesting note: in Cuba they removed the back seat, the right front seat and mounted a 30 caliber to shoot at communist guerillas during the revolution.

I had a PA-22/20 for a long time. They do a lot of things really well, but climbing to 11,000 feet isn't one of them. That short wing just doesn't have enough area for higher altitudes.

Years ago I hauled skydivers in a variety of different types, 180s, 185s and a 180hp 170. For a single tandem load seems like it would be tough to beat a 180hp 170 or 172.

There is a ton of STCs for the 22/20. PA-18 wings or wing extensions. This will cover the short wing poor lift at 11K msl. STC O-360 tuned up and prop pitched for rpm should cover the power issue. I had a chance to take out the rt front seat today of a friends 22/20. My wife sat in the pilots seat and I put a box and board to sit on facing aft with my tandem rig on. luckily we are both small and slim and it will just work. For the CG on takeoff and climb my weight postition will be slightly fwd of the copilot seat arm and the Tandem passenger would be aft of the front seat arm but fwd of the back seat arm. Handling should d be ok for climb and we are very used to extreme aft cg on jump run. The aft left door is just big enough for us to fall out of from a seated position. I checked and there is at least 3 STCs for that door removed in flight. This is a tight fit with not a lot of wiggle room but do able. I like the side gunner position idea. My original thought was a 170 but after seeing a 22/20 with the side door open I gave the 22/20 a look. Same engine options, the 22 is 300lbs lighter, same cabin width, the 22 is 10 to 20 grand cheaper. I dont need the cruise speed like a 170 would give me just climb. A monster 22/20 would look cool in my yard and I could afford to go put putting around.

Not meaning to thread drift. But (and I'm sure you thought of this), what about a 182 like Gary is selling on Ebay? It should have a lot less operating cost than the 206 and carry up to 3-4 jumpers if you need but still economical for 1-2 jumpers?

I don't know, just throwing this out there

My 206 is cheaper than a 182 in direct operating cost to send 2 jumpers to alt. Higher compression, fuel injection, wing mods. Just the airframe and engine cost so much more and have to be figured. I want 2 less cyl and a fix pitch prop. Lighter airframe would reduce fuel required. 2 jumpers to 11K in my 206 6gals .3 tach, 182 7 gals .4 tach, 22/20 180hp 4gals .4 tach est.

Skydive206 wrote:My 206 is cheaper than a 182 in direct operating cost to send 2 jumpers to alt. Higher compression, fuel injection, wing mods. Just the airframe and engine cost so much more and have to be figured. I want 2 less cyl and a fix pitch prop. Lighter airframe would reduce fuel required. 2 jumpers to 11K in my 206 6gals .3 tach, 182 7 gals .4 tach, 22/20 180hp 4gals .4 tach est.

So when you whip that with a pencil, how many trips does it take to make up the acquisition cost, maintenance costs, insurance, hangarage etc. Seems like a non starter to me. I dunno.

Your right about the best thing is to have 1 plane and just fly the 206 light. But I will have a toy that I can justify. A short fun run in the 206 is no cheaper than $50 in gas now. Put Putting in a Pacer for $25-$30 and it would pay for itself Monday through Friday. Function Check Flight on the wifes 550 206 tomorrow. Fun for me!!

SD
Look at the extended 22, bushmaster is one of them, puts a big door in it and extend the fuselage 24"
There are some other names, but all are just a streched pacer.
Nother question , why not find a 180 hp Maule with a fixed pitch and just fly it?
Just take off the back door, pull the right seat and go fly, wouldn't have to do anything.
They started out as pacers and just grew is all.
There are a couple on BS and in Controller
GT

Emory Bored wrote:

Skydive206 wrote:My 206 is cheaper than a 182 in direct operating cost to send 2 jumpers to alt. Higher compression, fuel injection, wing mods. Just the airframe and engine cost so much more and have to be figured. I want 2 less cyl and a fix pitch prop. Lighter airframe would reduce fuel required. 2 jumpers to 11K in my 206 6gals .3 tach, 182 7 gals .4 tach, 22/20 180hp 4gals .4 tach est.

So when you whip that with a pencil, how many trips does it take to make up the acquisition cost, maintenance costs, insurance, hangarage etc. Seems like a non starter to me. I dunno.

Your right about the best thing is to have 1 plane and just fly the 206 light. But I will have a toy that I can justify. A short fun run in the 206 is no cheaper than $50 in gas now. Put Putting in a Pacer for $25-$30 and it would pay for itself Monday through Friday. Function Check Flight on the wifes 550 206 tomorrow. Fun for me!!

I totally understand now. The Piper with two less jugs would be cheaper. And I think I missed the part about wanting a fun plane to have for the personal flights.

If you don't know him already Eddie Trimmer in Willow is a wealth of information on shortwing Pipers.
http://trimmeraviation.com/
He has a lot of the STCs you might want.

$15K for a flying plane that needs a lot of work, $20k in engine and airframe parts. Already have 4 cyl JPI with fuel flow. I have the heated shop work space and labor already for the winter project. Just enough hanger space for it also. Will the built up aircraft have a resale value equal to the parts invested when Im finished with it? This looks like the biggest question to me. I average $250 gross per tandem so that is at least $500per hour with a Pacer. Not bad revenue for a Pacer. My wife is the pilot, Im the Tandem master, Im the aircraft mechanic and parachute rigger so almost all the money stays in house (also my airstrip).

Skydive206 wrote:$15K for a flying plane that needs a lot of work, $20k in engine and airframe parts. Already have 4 cyl JPI with fuel flow. I have the heated shop work space and labor already for the winter project. Just enough hanger space for it also. Will the built up aircraft have a resale value equal to the parts invested when Im finished with it? This looks like the biggest question to me. I average $250 gross per tandem so that is at least $500per hour with a Pacer. Not bad revenue for a Pacer. My wife is the pilot, Im the Tandem master, Im the aircraft mechanic and parachute rigger so almost all the money stays in house (also my airstrip).

That sounds workable.

Unless you figure your labor at zero value, I doubt you'd come out money ahead doing a tailwheel/180 horse/exteded wing conversion to an existing airplane. But it would make a cool airplane: fun to fly, good short-field performance, plus the revenue producing aspect. Go for it. Svenn's Aviation, Trimmer Aviation, Steve's Aircraft, & Univair all have useful mods for a project like this.

I also think there will be fewer buyers of a Hot Rod Pacer in the future. The way I look at it is, Hard money for Hard parts and dont loose on them, My time and labor is the fun of a new puzzle and sense of accomplishment and joy of flying my own build. Building my Long Eze from scratch took a lot of time that I could have used for something else but I still wouldnt have traded the experience for anything else.

Skydive206 wrote: I also think there will be fewer buyers of a Hot Rod Pacer in the future.........

I don't know about that. It'd be a very versatile airplane, a 4 seat STOL airplane still in the 180hp-and-under class -- should be very desirable, esp if the self-certifying-medical proposal goes through, along with hotrodded 170/172's & Stinsons.