I know alot of pilots would like to find an inexpensive plane to have fun in the backcountry, with good performance. I purchased my 26" Bushwheels from a guy who had bought a 150 hp Piper Pawnee for $25k. He was upgrading to BW 31's. I talked to him for quite a while and I was impressed with what he said about the plane. I never would have thought about using one for backcountry flying.

First off he said the single seat issue isn't a problem for him because the places he goes he wouldn't take his family or friends anyway, nor are they interested in coming along. He enjoys flying out with his buddies in Cubs, who are usually alone anyway. Its easy for him to get mods approved since there have been several throughout the years, such as a 180hp conversion.

Second its a low wing Super Cub. Same basic wing, and tail in addition to excellent visibility. It's built very rugged, with the fuselage designed for crash protection and rollover protection, like a typical Ag plane. The gear is bomber. With a 800lb payload, the hopper allows for a huge gear/baggage/aux.fuel bay. You can take a lot of gear/fuel, in addition to a gear bay behind the seat. He is able to fly in and out of any Cub strip or river bar. He simply loves the plane for what it can do. With VG's, a Borer prop and big Bushwheels increasing the angle of attack the takeoff and landing performance is fantastic.

The downsides? Its hard to find a good, corrosion free plane. Its low wing can limit the brush clearance in some places. Metal flaps is a good mod along with the big bushwheels raising the height, which all but eliminates rocks and tears to the flaps.

I just thought I would share this info. A $25,000 Super Cub??? Anyone else thought about using one for a cheap backcountry plane?

Neat Idea!

I have about 1000+ hrs and close to 3000 landings in a PA-25 and they are indeed a great plane (for towing). Amazing visibility, lots of useful load, extremely stout gear, easy plane to work on and our 260hp Pawnee would climb like a helicopter off tow. Good x-wind plane too. If a single seat is all you're looking for I consider one just for the coolness. Only downside is that they were SLOW and with our 4 blade prop you would have to pitch down to get 100mph.

I used to haul diesel fuel in a Pawnee, a long time ago, out to coal mine sites up in the hills southwest of Barrow and east of Point Lay, AK. Great airplane empty, great airplane at/above gross to takeoff and fly around. But let me tell you, it was a bugger to land at the heavy weights. Directional control was always an adventure once those wheels touched the ground. Never groundlooped (and it was way more luck than skill that saved me) but I sure came close a lot of times. And it didn't help with the built in crosswinds at the Herc strips we used.

Gump

I know were there is a tandem traner model with 250hp, might be for sale too.

Got a little time in a few 260 hp Pawnees. Great airplanes. Gump's right about landing heavy. Most of the time I was only heavy on takeoff.

Never thought about them as back-country airplanes, but it's not a bad idea.

--Tony

I hate to be a stick in the mud, but don't most of these agplanes have a restricted airworthiness certificate? I guess you could say you were headed for a spray season in the high country, and planned to camp out between jobs to explain all your gear.
How big of a job would it be to get one of these legal for sport flying? Seems like a Pawnee or Agwagon would make a good semi-aerobatic airplane. I glanced through a book about the histopry of Cessna aircraft that had an article about the Agwagon entitled "The Poor Man's P-51".

Eric

There's a guy on our field who's done that. I'm not sure which year/model/engine he has, but it's been converted to a backcounty plane. Lots of room for stuff in the hopper and he put 31" bushwheels on it. I'll try to find out more about it. I don't know the guy and I've just seen it and heard others talk about it.

Amacbean,

Yup the guy you saw is the one I talked to, and I bought my tires from him. I cant find the photos he sent me of the plane. See if you can get some photos of the plane, and post them. It really is a cool plane.

Hotrod150,

The Pawnee was Certificated as Normal and Restricted. As most in service now are used as tow planes, not restricted to spraying.
As per the flight manual and placards=

"THIS AIRPLANE MUST BE OPERATED IN THE NORMAL CATEGORY IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE OPERATING LIMITATIONS STATED IN THE FORM OF PLACARDS, MARKINGS, AND MANUAL. ACROBATIC MANEUVERS
(INCLUDING SPINS) PROHIBITED. FOR RESTRICTED CATEGORY OPERATION, REFER TO ADDITIONAL LIMITATIONS."

The Model PA-25, (Restricted Category) is the same as the Normal Category PA-25 except for installation of spray or dust dispensing equipment. Conversion from sprayer or duster configuration may be accomplished using Piper Instructions Section XVI of Report 1019. When operating in the Normal Category, FAA Type Certificate Data Sheet No. 2A8 will apply.

The Pawnee used spring gear?

If you look closely, it looks like it on 7.00's. Haha. The tires.

Ain't got no time flying the Pawnee but I got lots of time hooked onto the back of one with a 200' rope. It is indeed a low wing 260HP Super Cub with the largest cargo compartment imaginable. Not exactly an efficient cruiser though... 100-120 mph on 260HP.

Some of the real STOL addicts could possibly make use of the low wing by using ground effect to shorten the TO and Landing distance. All other factors equal you will get shorter TO/LDG using ground effect than without.

A 260 Pawnee with VG's, big tires, the big droop wingtips, and no cargo could possibly embarrass a lot of folks up at the Valdez STOL event...

Probably carry a moose or bear out of remote places in fewer trips than a Cub. And the cargo compartment is above the CG so you could get more weight in safely without trim or pitch stability problems.

You could make a good case for a Pawnee as a specific back country cargo airplane for stuff instead of people... mail delivery, fuel drums, food, cement bags, whatever. And CHEAP compared to an -18 !

ccurrie wrote:I know were there is a tandem traner model with 250hp, might be for sale too.

I know someone who might be interested in that two place Pawnee for glider towing. If it's for sale, please let me know.

1SeventyZ wrote:
If you look closely, it looks like it on 7.00's. Haha. The tires.

I have some time in one of those, looked almost just like that. Handles pretty good and soft around the edges. You have to stay in control and ride it out until it is done or it will bit you. It tell you, when you are done, you are worn out, takes lots of input to get it to do everything you want it to, but worth it in the end.

I keep trying and trying but I still cant see what those dog tags say

low rider wrote:I keep trying and trying but I still cant see what those dog tags say

Remove Before Flight.

Here's a Pawnee landing at Mile High. I was there in my Cub and took this picture as he landed.

The Pawnee is a very capable STOL machine. I have been towing gliders in 235 and 260 hp models for years, and it takes effort to keep the tug on the ground until the glider is up. The visibility is great, the cockpit = very roomy, and the landing gear is super stout. I have never flown one with a loaded hopper, but I have always felt that they are easy planes to handle in all scenarios below gross weight.

Personally, I find it difficult to accept struts on the upper wing surface. The intersection acts like a big speed brake, and the effect is very noticeable, as it's nearly impossible to get out of the yellow arc, even in a full power dive. It definitely uses a lot of extra energy, dragging the thing through the air.

mr.helix wrote:Here's a Pawnee landing at Mile High. I was there in my Cub and took this picture as he landed.

Yup, thats the guy I bought my 26's from! Looks like he got the 31's he wanted,... and using them Wonder if he finished all the mods he planned. A cheap single seat Cub, cool

bumper I PMed you the info.

low rider wrote:I keep trying and trying but I still cant see what those dog tags say

WOOF,WOOF