Tadpole wrote:

SixTwoLeemer wrote:http://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=46257&p=410688#p410688

http://www.beechtalk.com/forums/viewtop ... =7&t=47176

The post saying that Marble is 4600' long.....followed by...you Baron guys can even use it....just sends shivers down me.

Tad - are you saying that it's not safe for a Baron or a Bonanza to fly into and out of Marble?

4,600 feet can be plenty of runway, or not, for a low-wing retractable aircraft, depending, however, upon some key variables that affect every flight ... temperature and density altitude, obviously .. also aircraft loading, wind strength & speed, obstacles and terrain near the flight paths (landing and takeoff), runway condition (soft/wet/tall grass), runway slope, etc.
And of course, pilot skill is a very big determinant of the safety of any flight.

While there's lots to be said in favor of high wing taildraggers with STOL capabilities, the G35 Bonanza that crashed at Marble should be able to, under the right conditions with the right pilot, be more than capable of using that field.

Now if you're talking about some of the gravel bar or bush airstrips that some of the best-skilled and best equipped bush pilots on this board are accessing, that's a different story, due to the extreme short fields (under 1,000 ft long) and rough conditions (rocks, tall grass, soft field, etc.).

nmflyguy wrote:Tad - are you saying that it's not safe for a Baron or a Bonanza to fly into and out of Marble?

Nope, that's not what I'm saying, I said that post gave me shivers...the way it read in that thread.

Bob Conger, the former owner, once told me that he operated a C-421 in and out of Marble for a while. Also a Mooney, couldn't tell you what model. I wouldn't mind taking a lightly loaded Baron into Marble, a 421.. NO Way! I wouldn't do it often though, too hard on the gear.

flynbeekeeper wrote:Bob Conger, the former owner, once told me that he operated a C-421 in and out of Marble for a while. Also a Mooney, couldn't tell you what model. I wouldn't mind taking a lightly loaded Baron into Marble, a 421.. NO Way! I wouldn't do it often though, too hard on the gear.

What I was getting at if you read that thread, it came across as "well hell, it's this long, any old guy in a Baron can do it"...just the way I read it...I love Barons, and yes there's plenty of planes that can operate in and out of all kinds of places. It was more the attitude I got from that thread that gave me the shivers, not like the guy was saying load light and all the considerations.

Tadpole wrote:

flynbeekeeper wrote:Bob Conger, the former owner, once told me that he operated a C-421 in and out of Marble for a while. Also a Mooney, couldn't tell you what model. I wouldn't mind taking a lightly loaded Baron into Marble, a 421.. NO Way! I wouldn't do it often though, too hard on the gear.

What I was getting at if you read that thread, it came across as "well hell, it's this long, any old guy in a Baron can do it"...just the way I read it...I love Barons, and yes there's plenty of planes that can operate in and out of all kinds of places. It was more the attitude I got from that thread that gave me the shivers, not like the guy was saying load light and all the considerations.

Tadpoe - I completely agree with you that it's a very bad idea for pilots who are new to mountain flying to not take it seriously. I remember very well the shock at the degraded aircraft performance the first takeoff I experienced at a moderately-high-elevation (5,830 ft) field, after learning to fly at near-sea level airfields. And that shock was despite the fact I had a CFI flying right seat, and there was no high terrain crowding the runway, and it was in the winter.

As you well know, Tadpole, in the Rocky Mountain region, a 5,830-ft elevation field is considered "low country". Lots of airports not to mention backcountry airstrips around here are upwards of 7,000 to as much as 9000 feet! DAs well above10,000 feet are not uncommon in the summertime.

Even if the airstrip length, width, and surface condition are all OK for one's aircraft and one's skills, maneuvering at high DA for an approach, or takeoff and climb, with high terrain all around is not for the inexperienced.

Any pilot thinking of venturing into the high country for the first time should make it a point first to get some dual instruction from a local CFI. Taking a formal mountain flying course is even better. Even just the online course that AOPA offers on its Air Safety Foundation website will give one an idea of what you're dealing with in high country flying ... however, there's no substitute for experiencing it first-hand in the cockpit, with a competent high-country flyer sitting at your shoulder.

The GA field here is right under 7000'MSL...not in the mountains though. Right after I got my PPL, one of the first things I did was the mountain checkout with my CFI....bushwagon on this board...and that was more of an intro. I've done a bunch of flights up to Leadville and around, nothing that I would consider in difficult terrain. I've been into Leadville where the DA's have been 12k and above. It is very noticeable how much more runway I need to operate there. I went up there with 2 paxs before and had made the decision well ahead of time that I wouldn't do my normal visit into Leadville and instead just stay above and fly over for some photos.

Tadpole wrote:They're trying to find help to salvage / get money from the wreck since the owner / pilot / fatality wasn't insured. http://www.barnstormers.com/classified_ ... nanza.html

My condolences to the family and friends of the pilot! And a speedy and full recovery for the two injured passengers!!

I really feel bad for the wife that lost her husband in this unfortunate accident and now has to deal with the financial end of this accident because the pilot/husband didn't have insurance.

Maybe a lesson learned here? I know I'll never fly my plane without insurance, especially when flying passengers. For one, I can not afford any expenses related to an accident on my part. And two, I for sure don't want to burden my family with any expenses related to an accident on my part if I die.

The guys over at Beechtalk have already raised $13,500 that is going into a college fund for the daughter.

Bonanza Man wrote:The guys over at Beechtalk have already raised $13,500 that is going into a college fund for the daughter.

Awesome!

Tadpole wrote:

Bonanza Man wrote:The guys over at Beechtalk have already raised $13,500 that is going into a college fund for the daughter.

Awesome!

Very cool!!