I'm not trying to turn this into a Hot Air topic, but this seems crazy to me. Our tax dollars at work, dispatching SWAT teams based, essentially, on FlightAware profiles? I don't have anything to hide in my plane, but that's beside the point under the 4th Amendment.

http://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-aircraft-searches-20140415,0,7828658.story#axzz2ywgCEPCx

I find this an amazing article. What about those private pilots who say legally have a concealed carry permit and wish to carry a revolver. I can't imagine the furor that might arise if during one of these random searches, a firearm was found right next to the golf clubs. Maybe my ham radio equipment would be "very suspicious ." as well.

I love this country, and I have a great deal of respect for the laws and the public safety professionals who serve. I am however beginning to think this homeland security idea is turning into a massive bureaucracy with precious tax dollars being used that might better be used elsewhere, be it for our armed services or cancer research at NIH.

So... what recourse does a person have who is surrounded by a swat team at the Detroit airport, and a Homeland Security or Police official demanding to search the aircraft? Some rookie disassembling parts of the aircraft for an inspection is not that comforting either. I'll retract that comment if he/she can flash an A&P certificate. .

This posting really gives me pause to think. We do still have that Constitution for now...yes..??

I haven't filed a VFR flight plan in over 20 years, fly almost exclusively from small airports, and I don't have a transponder so they don't know my altitude, aircraft registration, etc. by looking at a radar. Does that mean all of my flights may be suspicious?

The guilty until proven innocent mentality of law enforcement is totally at odds with the intent of the constitution.

The only time I got approached by Government officials was that they wanted a ride. They liked the amphibs.

My flying Karma is good.

One more reason to mount video cameras on our planes. Scary.

"This looks like an agency in search of a mission."

Add 'em to the list.

The only people that succeed in organizations like that are the lowest common denominator of paranoid ladder climbers. Paranoia gets you promoted, and rational smarts gets you drummed out. This is an example of what is left after a decade or two of that unnatural selection.

Take away their black pajamas and guns, and frankly, not very many of them would have a shred of faux patriotism or desire for the job left. That's not me talking...that is what a guy who was getting ready to retire as a GS-99 from one of these creepy idiocy circuses told me.

Actually, I believe that for the most part (US Border Patrol on the southern border excepted) Homeland Security is a HUGE bureaucracy with a mission that's so general that it's hard to figure out what it is they're supposed to be doing, and frankly, I think most of them are bored to tears.

DEA is the agency tasked with chasing down drug dealers.....and they don't belong to Homeland Security.....but because of the incredibly general mission of DHS, they can claim almost ANYthing is a threat to the security of the homeland.....

And, when DHS personnel call up a local municipal law enforcement agency and says "We've got a potential bad guy inbound, and we want assistance in the take down", how do you suppose the locals are going to take that?

The worst part of this whole deal is that DHS, because of the Patriot Act, actually gained some search authorities that are probably not constitutional, but nobody so far, in Washington has had the spine to pass legislation to limit those authorities. Until that happens, people's constitutional rights are going to continue to be trampled by these guys.

Frankly, what is likely to change this is if DHS winds up shooting someone in one of these deals....but then the coverups will begin.

Just hope it's not me. And, as to CCW, if you're legal in that state (better check the regs for that state before you carry in that state), there's no federal law says you can't carry in most places. Now, if you show up inside the security perimeter of a TSA airport with a gun, and it's discovered, it MIGHT get interesting, but assuming you got there legally.....who knows?

MTV

I think laughter would be the best medicine in an encounter of this type. I could not keep from bursting out laughing anyway, and for sure would not act elusive, angry, or otherwise suspicious.

That approach worked for me when last dealing with armed gov agents, at the INEL nuke test site in the SE Idaho desert. I flew over at a legal height, and noticed flashing lighted vehicles below seemingly following my flight path (40 mph cruise, it wasn't hard to keep up, back in the ultralight days). When I left the site boundary's I got low enough and parallel to the road to make eye contact with the guys in the vehicles, and when they made the "land right now motion", I did, in a more or less clear of sagebrush area. They came out with guns drawn and I started laughing out loud, while putting my hands up and asking them not to shoot. They responded in kind, laughed that is, and the situation quickly cooled off. I did however make a very firm point of my known altitude over the Site, and I had just set my altimeter in Howe so felt I had my ass covered. They agreed, thanked me for my cooperation and we parted ways.

This was late '80's but I'd still laugh in their faces today, partially to defuse the situation, but mostly because i find it hilarious they would be wasting their resources on me and my experimental aircraft. They could search, no problem, if they started taking inspection panels off without my permission or other wise messing with HONEY, I'd quite laughing I guess.

now that we live in the only state in the union that has decriminalized marry-g-wanna I wonder if I'm going to be met at every adjacent state podunk municipal airport - cause I fly low, too slow and got no electrico. I must be a trafficko.

soyAnarchisto wrote:now that we live in the only state in the union that has decriminalized marry-g-wanna I wonder if I'm going to be met at every adjacent state podunk municipal airport - cause I fly low, too slow and got no electrico. I must be a trafficko.

We have two interstates criss crossing here in Pocatello, and the state troopers have gotten very skilled at pulling over out of staters for a "routine traffic stop", and then discovering quantities of illegal drugs. They are especially alert for Colorado plates, or so the guy who is suing them for a recent illegal search without probable cause is claiming. He seems legit and not a rabble rouser, an older guy anyway, just really pissed they seized his car (after not finding anything in the roadside search) and after hauling it into headquarters for more searching, STILL didn't find anything.

I too have flight profiles that could be considered "extremely suspicious", and this whole subject crossed my mind when considering flying down to the recent Llano fly-in, and possibly passing through Colorado on the way, sad to have to think that way! Luckily we pilots don't have (yet) license plates with our state names on them. And, anyone with 12" N numbers is just asking for trouble, mine are 3" and legally displayed, though very low on the vert fin so mostly screened out by the lower tail feathers once aloft, I have done this on all my planes

courierguy wrote:

soyAnarchisto wrote:now that we live in the only state in the union that has decriminalized marry-g-wanna I wonder if I'm going to be met at every adjacent state podunk municipal airport - cause I fly low, too slow and got no electrico. I must be a trafficko.

We have two interstates criss crossing here in Pocatello, and the state troopers have gotten very skilled at pulling over out of staters for a "routine traffic stop", and then discovering quantities of illegal drugs. They are especially alert for Colorado plates, or so the guy who is suing them for a recent illegal search without probable cause is claiming. He seems legit and not a rabble rouser, an older guy anyway, just really pissed they seized his car (after not finding anything in the roadside search) and after hauling it into headquarters for more searching, STILL didn't find anything.

I too have flight profiles that could be considered "extremely suspicious", and this whole subject crossed my mind when considering flying down to the recent Llano fly-in, and possibly passing through Colorado on the way, sad to have to think that way! Luckily we pilots don't have (yet) license plates with our state names on them. And, anyone with 12" N numbers is just asking for trouble, mine are 3" and legally displayed, though very low on the vert fin so mostly screened out by the lower tail feathers once aloft, I have done this on all my planes

Can you not use 2" letters on older planes?

tim

I would recommend you guys watch and follow this you tube video. It is long, but totally worth it. Great information.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wXkI4t ... e=youtu.be

qmdv wrote:Can you not use 2" letters on older planes?

tim

I think so. FAR 45.29 and 45.22 cover this. Too complicated to provide a synopsis - see the fars.

http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?rgn=div5;node=14:1.0.1.3.22#14:1.0.1.3.22.3.363.6

Like Dale, I have always kept a low profile. That can now cause suspicion as well as a transponder. Most 1200 squawks are turned off by ATC anyway.

I was a high school history teacher for several years. I always started with King Solomon's advice that if you knew history you could predict the future. "As it was before, it will again be. There is nothing new under the sun."

Governments and their bureaucracies need a reason to be. Where they do not have one they will make one. It is simple economics. That poor pilot was harassed and others may be economically ruined, but paper is created. Right, wrong, or otherwise, paper is created, men and women are hired, and empires grow.

Read in the Book of Samuel where all Israel asks for a king. Samuel reluctantly agrees with God's command. But he also relays God's warning about how things will be with a King and the resultant bureaucracy.

As it has been before, it will be again. This is just human nature. We want protection and until we get in the situation similar to Ukraine, we will put up with bureaucratic oppression.

Going back to Russia's historic need for controlled buffer states between herself and Europe, Ukraine, like Crimea, will become again Russian or at least again under Russian control.

FBI has perfected "face recognition". Maybe the next trick is an "airplane recognition" database. Based on sounds, speed, shape, colors and locations etc....

I gotta say this whole situation makes me think of an old quote from the Duke.

"You boys must think I'm a reeeeeeal dangerous man."

8GCBC wrote:FBI has perfected "face recognition". Maybe the next trick is an "airplane recognition" database. Based on sounds, speed, shape, colors and locations etc....

OH geez....................... I am SOOOOOO screwed.......