Anyone have any experience or knowledge on this? I have a friend who approached me with this yesterday. Supposedly he may have an in and I'm intrigued.
Here's some of the basics Im not familiar with and curious about.
Are they true or false?
Work 4 months out of the year only (pretty much 7 days a week but only 4 months).
Most on stand by
Pay is way better than ag. Was saying something like $600 a day + per diem(whether u fly or not)plus a pretty fat hourly rate on top of that.
I really love ag work but this seems to good to be, which most times....
And I could still do ag other part of year.

Talk to Rob H., he has talked to the fire guys a time or two about employment.

Should of known.

Took the following pics from my porch last night. I may be hanging with the pilots tonight- if I get a chance I'll ask them.

-DP

Flying fire suppression pays good, 500 bucks a day plus flight time. Draw back is you are on 2 hour notice for up to a 5 month contract. That means no holiday trips or day trips for that matter, staying within cell phone range and be within 2 hour range to dispatch. Less if on Yellow or red alert. Can be out posted on remote fire bases. You better have a tolerant wife and family.!

Thanks Denali and exodus

Exodus. Are you involved with it anyway or just familiar with it? I could do that no problem. My family would just follow me around.

I worked the ground for 6 years and flew jumpers for the 7th year. I steered away from the suppression end of it because of the nomadic nature of it wouldn't be conducive to having a family life down the road. Of the fires I worked, the SEATs looked like the most fun flying...on the suppression side anyway.

That's great if your family will follow you around. I know for the larger tankers, mid-flight re-dispatching wasn't uncommon. I spoke with a pilot once whose wife followed him around with an RV. He'd get dispatched to Silver City, NM, the wife would start driving, then they would get a call while airborne to head north to Montana. Meanwhile, his wife was still southbound not knowing about the change in their destination. Then there was always the chance that by the time she got there, they would be sent elsewhere. So I'm not sure how practical that would be. During a slow season it would probably work. During a busy season, I think it could result in a lot of chasing and not much time together.

denalipilot wrote:Took the following pics from my porch last night. I may be hanging with the pilots tonight- if I get a chance I'll ask them.

-DP

Your porch looks like a pretty decent place to do a little porchin DP!

I'm with you scolopax! Holy smokes dp. Can I come over? You have a good zoom or are you on short final? What an awesome view!!
Nice pics!

There's two of those Fire Boss AT's in McGrath tonight. Sweet looking bird. The City of McGrath has a water truck to keep dust down on the roads in the summer months, this looks like the perfect replacement, twice the fun in half the time!

I've just retired from 30 years of fire fighting and air tankers, CL-215 and Twin Otter on water-bombing floats. The idea of your significant other chasing you across the continent will never work for the reasons already stated. I've seen many relationships and marriages collapse because of this lifestyle. In one case I worked with six pilots and three were getting divorced at the same time. There will always be problems at home, roof leaks, basement flooded, car broke, hot water tank quit, kids sick, relatives in hospital, it just never ends and you are too far away to do anything. Stress level is very high as you know when the season ends you will have a hard time finding other work. No one wants to hire you as they know you won't be around long. Summer wages just don't seem to last very long either. When the bush is burning you will work til dark most days. You will eat a lot of cold clammy pizza and other fast food because that is what is brought to the fire base and you never seem to be there when it arrives. Your Lady will have to get used to living and eating alone. You will miss all family occasions, weddings, birthdays, anniversaries, kids graduations, the list is endless. You can plan nothing and if you do the stress will increase because you just know you will be deployed to some distant fire base. Some places expect you to be at the airport every day even if it's rained for a week. I have had fire seasons where I have flown less than 30 hrs and never dropped a load of water in anger all summer, just sit at the airport and try to hang onto your sanity as your flying skills evaporate before your eyes. The pay is usually reflected on the size of the aircraft and I'd be surprised to see someone get $600/day on a single engine airplane unless there is high flight pay which disappears when your not flying. Some outfits hold back some pay which you don't get if you bolt before the end of the contract. I could go on all day but I think you get my point.

DHC-6 wrote:I could go on all day but I think you get my point.

Why'd you stay at it so long?

I was flying for a small connector airline that was going to close down when the Ontario Gov called me. They were having trouble getting people to move to where the water-bombers were stationed which happened to be where I lived. They had just bought six CL-215's to add to the three they already had. They wanted people that like living in the north and would stay there, So I thought I'd give it a try. Years flew by and there I was............

BTW, I live in the town where some of the planes are based but the planes go where the fires are. They go anywhere in Canada or the USA. We have many satellite bases all over Ontario. Each day rain, lightning and other things are taken into consideration and the planes are sent where there is the best chance of fires starting. As has been mentioned, I've been rerouted many times while in the air, you never know where you will be when the sun sets. This lifestyle can wear on you as the years pass but I'd drifted through many jobs by this time and this one had some security and a pension so I stuck with it. My last 14 years was on the Twin Otter on water-bombing amphib floats which is operated single pilot. Probably one of the most enjoyable, adrenalin pumping jobs there is but again, lots of waiting and very little flying.

DHC-6 wrote:BTW, I live in the town where some of the planes are based but the planes go where the fires are. They go anywhere in Canada or the USA. We have many satellite bases all over Ontario.

DHC-6,
I had a broken tach cable back around 2005 in your neck of the woods. I spent a very enjoyable day on the ramp in Dryden waiting for some help, and watching CL-415s practicing from the field.

Totally cool planes. Like the overflow holes behind the cockpit that discharge water to indicate when the tanks are full. Isn't it about 45 seconds that it takes to fill the tanks through twin louvres the size of shoe boxes? Can they also drop jumpers from the door in the rear?

-DP

I flew the CL-215, this had radial engines not turbines. When we traded these in for the turbine CL-415's I decided to move onto the Twin Otter as it flew single pilot which meant I fly it all the time instead of half. The pay was also better but you have to fly during winter months also on wildlife surveys. On the CL-415 you are off all winter as it can't do anything but fires. The CL-215 can scoop six tons of water in 10 seconds. When we do airshows we go by the crowd with the probes down so you can imagine how much water is being blasted out the under wing vents as we go by, the tanks, of course would explode without them. The vents are also there so air can rapidly enter when the load drops to hold it together. We have never dropped fire fighters from these planes and I've never heard of anyone that has. No one has every scooped up a scuba diver and dropped him on a fire either,

The picture that Denalipilot pilot posted is a CL-215 and I'm pretty sure its one of those we traded in. Some of them were bought by Aeroflight in Kingman Arizona and they do a lot of work in Alaska. Rumor has it they just bought four new CL-415's. If anyone is interested in this life I highly recommend this company. They hired some of our guys when they got into water-scoopers and treat their people very well.

55wagon wrote:Anyone have any experience or knowledge on this? I have a friend who approached me with this yesterday. Supposedly he may have an in and I'm intrigued.
Here's some of the basics Im not familiar with and curious about.
Are they true or false?
Work 4 months out of the year only (pretty much 7 days a week but only 4 months).
Most on stand by
Pay is way better than ag. Was saying something like $600 a day + per diem(whether u fly or not)plus a pretty fat hourly rate on top of that.
I really love ag work but this seems to good to be, which most times....
And I could still do ag other part of year.

I am as far from an expert on this field as you can get... However most everyone I fly with is carded and some still fly seats. I initially got in to flying ag with the notion of flying a seat for the operator in my (then) home town. He has since offered me a seat on several occasions, as have others. Having found the position I am in now, it's just not currently in the cards for me....

Work schedule... ya, I'd say you're pretty spot on...

Pay? well there are SEAT seats, and there are SEAT seats, there are ag seats and there are ag seat.... comparing them loosely will get you no where, you need to compare specifics... beyond that, as you already know, ag seats tend to lend themselves better to people who are willing to diversify, and 'work' the 'system'. SEAT gigs work best for those that want to park somewhere and let someone else handle their job security...
More to the 'pay' point, it's been my experience that in the current market the loose 'average' for an aggie is about $200./hr hobbs... where you fit your paycheck depends on where and what you fly. If you fly the national average of 300 hrs a year, and are on the low side of the average, this may not be so appealing... conversely like you I know many ag pilots turning 1100-1200 hrs a year, and many earn way, wayyy beyond the average hourly figure. I know SEAT drivers turning the same dollar for dollar, and I know SEAT drivers making much less...

Almost all the SEAT guys I know that no longer fly SEATS quit for the reasons guys stated above... It far better suits a single nomad than a married or family man...

I'm sure you're aware that at one time it was almost a pre-requisite to have flown ag prior to flying a SEAT. Then with much Govt. intervention, that changed, to the point that it was pretty well detrimental to have flown ag prior to applying for a SEAT slot... Communication skills and regulation structuring dictated that they lean more towards the airline type.. I personally know a couple guys who went from being recreational pilots (glider pilots to boot) to flying AT-802s... just like that!...
I *think* that the nature of the flying, and the environment has brought them back full circle and they are now leaning once again to ag pilots... of course all of this only matters in getting that first seat, and it sounds like you already have that option...

In the end I think the only thing that really matters is why you are flying what you fly. It is pretty far removed from the flying you are currently doing. If you are doing what you are doing because you love the flying, you'll be sorely disappointed in a SEAT. If you're doing what you are doing because the money then it probably won't matter a lick

Gimme a buzz in a few days, I'll be home and can turn you on to some really, really cool SEAT drivers...

Take care, Rob

For any who are interested, Todd Underwood is training Forest Service Pilots in an AT-802 on floats. I think his company owns it. I entered him in the flight instructor list. He is also the best young instructor I have ever flown with. I met him for the first time when I was doing a clinic in Prescott, AZ. He didn't learn it from me, but he has been doing the same kind of flying as me all his young life. He is also the local DPE. Hover taxi was a nada for him.

Thanks for all the replies guys.
This was something I knew almost zero about other than a hearing about it here and there.
I have to admit the $ part is what got me thinking. But like usual the line I'm hearing is not quite what I was being told. $300k in 4 months w 8 months sounded real intriguing.
I'm over it already. No money (and I know now that's not quite the full story) is worth the family issues.
And your right rob. I love what I do. Love it!! Feel like this is what I was made for. As much as I love it tho I'd love about 500 hrs a year @ $350hr guaranteed. Lol!
I've got a great seat where I'm at just don't care for my location. That's all I'd change. Just finished 23k acres in June in the worse drought here since 50's. bought 50k ac on the year to date. Most others down here are around 5-10.
Went off subject a little but guess just saying I love my job. Beats the hell out of working for a living!
Thanks again guys. Hittin the sack for another good day tomorrow. Take care