Came across this cub knock-off the other day, "Savage Cub" by Zlin aviation based out of the Czech Republic. It's a clip wing version that sells for about $60,000, seems to have reasonable performance, folding wings, good fuel consumption, and a (barely) acceptable useful load of 596lbs. I've put it in my "airpanes to consider at some future point" box.

Anybody know anything about this model? Is it worth considering? Is it crap? Are parts, such as tires easily replaceable? Are the brakes up to snuff or are they on par with skis? Are the performance numbers any more laughable than most? It's not a real cub, I know that.

I've also been tossing about getting a Pacer (PA 20/22). While it's too soon for me, I noticed one pop up for sale locally out at Camas 1W1(barnstormers, I think, or maybe trade-a-plane). Anyone know anything about this particular plane?

I hear the Pacers, in general, can be squirrely but that may be more due to improper conversion of a PA 22. Should a rank beginner take on this model as a first airplane?

Craig

If I can handle one, I'm sure anyone can.

I had about 25 hours in a Champ and about 100hr total when we bought our PA22/20-160. There were a few times during the transition when the instructor saved my hide, but after a through checkout and the appropriate caution, it was no more of a problem than any other tail wheel.

In general, wouldn't say they are squirrelly, but they are spunkier than the Champ was. A good check out will prepare you for that. If it actually is squirrelly that might be an indication of a tire tracking issue, like you indicated.

I had checked out their website when I was looking for a smaller plane (bought a Champ) and they looked OK but I really would like to see one up close. Maybe there will be one at Oshkosh this year. If you are looking at the smaller planes there are quite a few good candidates out there.

Just aircraft's Highlander is a good little plane....I visited their factory and it looks fairly well built.

Ran's S-6 and S-7 are nice little planes and have been around for quite awhile. You can buy them already built also.

EIther of these is not going to be cheap though...expect $70,000 and up.
I've seen Pacers for 20K and up.

GroundLooper wrote:I hear the Pacers, in general, can be squirrely but that may be more due to improper conversion of a PA 22. Should a rank beginner take on this model as a first airplane? Craig

We had a Piper Colt that we stuck the Univair gear kit on. It was a delight to fly, and extremely docile on the ground. Improved the looks of the milk stool by about 500%.

For a first airplane it would be cheap, which is a relative term, and easy to fly.

Gump

The same question on www.shortwingpipers.org
Lot's of good answers over there also.

GroundLooper wrote:Came across this cub knock-off the other day, "Savage Cub" by Zlin aviation based out of the Czech Republic. It's a clip wing version that sells for about $60,000, seems to have reasonable performance, folding wings, good fuel consumption, and a (barely) acceptable useful load of 596lbs. I've put it in my "airpanes to consider at some future point" box.

Anybody know anything about this model? Is it worth considering? Is it crap? Are parts, such as tires easily replaceable? Are the brakes up to snuff or are they on par with skis? Are the performance numbers any more laughable than most? It's not a real cub, I know that.

I've also been tossing about getting a Pacer (PA 20/22). While it's too soon for me, I noticed one pop up for sale locally out at Camas 1W1(barnstormers, I think, or maybe trade-a-plane). Anyone know anything about this particular plane?

I hear the Pacers, in general, can be squirrely but that may be more due to improper conversion of a PA 22. Should a rank beginner take on this model as a first airplane?

Craig

Craig--


THe planes (savage) are pretty nice and they seem to performe pretty well, I will have Pasquale respond to any major questions you have if you like. The tires are pretty easy to replace ..... they are ours (29" Airstreaks)

As for the Pacer .. A highly Under-rated airplane in my opnion.

I've got about 20 hours in a Savage Cub. They are neat, but they have their little quirks. I've found it's actually more challenging to 3 point than it is to wheel land - when it's done flying, it's done flying. Since I normally do all power off landings, it could be quite challenging, especially in any x-wind. Although it is very well behaved when all the 3 are on the ground, even if you happen to touch down with a little cockeyed.

Gas consumption (what little it is) is great, and it sips gas, even if you run it up in the yellow arc of the RPM range.

Parts from what I've seen seem to be easy to replace, although I wish they had put some tundra tires on the one I flew.


Here's a few pics:

Hottshot wrote: As for the Pacer .. A highly Under-rated airplane in my opnion.

I agree based on everything I've read. Currently the pacer, or the tripe, is on the top of my list. I'm planning to get my tailwheel endorsement within the next year, then decide if I will graduate to a TW or stick with a training wheel. In the meantime, I'm keeping my options open and checking out what's out there.

Great feedback everyone, thanks.

there was or is a very nice 180 hp pacer for sale in the SLC area. I do not know if I can find who had it.

It was a plant that I would have bought if in the market.

180 HP Pacer??? I bet that would be a fun toy!

Sticknrudder fella above has the best clue, apparently there is no impending stall feedback from the Savage Cub, it just savagely quits, and does not care how far ya are above the surface.

There is one of them at Amelia Reid Aviation in San jose Ca. ( RHV )
Even with an "experienced" instructor, the thing quit in flare and DROPPED to the runway. It is also easy to step through the front floor if you are not carefull. I need a more "comprehensive" floorboard.

Took severall months to get all the parts imported. It hit hard enough to damage landing gear, motor mount, prop, etc.

There is a new CubCraftrers LSA cub on the same line and I like it a lot.
IF my medical "condition" gets marginal, that is the plane I would replace my 170 with. It is SOO easy to push around. It would be like having an updated version of the old 1939 Piper J-5 which I flew for several years, including all the way Alaska and back with a hand held radio.

I get to see most all of the new LS planes as the FBO I now use is also the major work center where most all versions are trucked in to be assembled and flight tested. The Rotax has a few quirks of it's own.

wanabe wrote:

There is a new CubCraftrers LSA cub on the same line and I like it a lot.
IF my medical "condition" gets marginal, that is the plane I would replace my 170 with.

Cubcrafters makes some pretty sweet planes. They come with some pretty stout prices too but, I guess, you get what you pay for. The thing I don't like about the SportCub is it has a useful load of only 495lbs. Add full fuel, two 150lb people and there's only enough left over for 51lbs of baggage.
I'll bet CC makes their planes stout enough to handle a higher load than the allowed maximum (or not) but one ramp check would ruin your day. Stupid FAA and their ridiculous 1320lb limit.