I think I am ready to get some skiis for our C-180, and was wondering about the good and bad of different types, and what else might be out there.

I am most interested in retract skiis, they seem like they are the best choice for the snow conditions we usually have here, and our runway/hanger location.

What skiis are the best bang for the buck--it seems like used ones sell in the neighborhood of 10k, what does a person need to look for? what wears out, etc?

Can you get by with wheel skiis in crusted snow, or on nice warm days with soft snow(this seems like the days I prefer to fly)

Thanks, Lance

lancef53, I've ran my Super Stinson on Fly Lite 3000's last winter and part of this. In my biased opinion, they are one of the best for deeper powder ops as far as retractable's go. As opposed to AWB's, you have a lot more surface area as the "hole" through which the wheel goes is completely closed when the skis are pumped down. I just sold my Stinson, and now have the ski's for sale, complete with hand pump and a tail pentration ski that fits a Scott 3200.. Fly Lites are certified on a C180, and lots of other planes. I bought a well used set, and proceeded to invest a small fortune into a complete rebuild. I now own a better than new set, which I will never come close to getting out what I have into them. They are listed on Barnstormers.com, search skis, or pm me. I have better than $18,000 into them, and am hoping to get $11,000. They are perfect in every way. Don't do what I did and buy an $8000 "used" pair. When I was shopping there were some that were in excellent condition for $12,000. I would have been money way ahead to buy nice ones right away. Don't try wheels in crusted snow, or too much soft snow. Nose over waiting to happen. Also, you may want to consider some of the penetration skis such as Aero's. The benefit is you don't have the complexity of the retracts. Downside is performance is much poorer in sticky snow or deep snow since the tire is always down below the ski. There is no perfect ski, especially if you aren't going to use straights. Every type of ski has some tradeoff, just like planes. Russ

Ryppa is correct, for a C-180, it's hard to beat the Fli Lite 3000's. They are great skis.

IF you NEVER think you'll get into deep snow, I would rank, in descending order, C-3200 Fluidynes, then Federal AWB 2500's.

The Fluidynes work okay, but don't have the floatation that the Fli Lites have. The AWB's are about the same. Both these skis are tough as all get out. Frankly, you probably won't find a really good set of C-3200's for much less than that set of Fli Lites. Both the Fluidynes and the AWB's are HEAVY.

The Fluidynes and AWB's MAY, depending on which model they are, be able to run with 8.50 x 6.00 tires, though frankly I don't recommend it, if you're apt to get into deep snow with the AWB's.

I would stay FAR away from the Aero 2800's with this airplane, due to the weight of the plane. Those skis are fine skis for a smaller airplane, but in my opinion, at least, they just aren't tough enough to work on a 180, particularly if you ever get into rough snow, and in your home state, you will.

If twas me, I'd jump on those Fli Lites. They are great skis.

MTV

Thanks for the replies, keep 'em coming.

Does anyone know anything about Ski Fernandez 8001's? There is a set for sale on Barnstormers for what seems to be a great price(especially if you have a 206).

Is the company still around? How can you contact them?

Rhyppa-I pm'd you

Thanks, Lance

MTV--is there someone around here that has any experience installing skiis for the first time?

Lance,

I presume that the Fernandez skis you found are pretty old, as in fifteen plus years old??

If so, those were the old Fernandez (no 8001 model number-that's a different ski) retractable skis. Those are good skis on a Cub size airplane, but one of the problems they saw in southcentral Alaska with those skis is that, when installed on larger aircraft, they tended to be damaged with any rough use. If those have been on a 206.....guess what?

That company is no longer with us, and there is no direct support for those skis. That said, I think a good mechanic could do most of what you'd need done on them. I'd be skeptical of using those skis on a 180, particularly in North Dakota...due to rough snow.

There is a NEW ski type called the Rosti Fernandez 8001 ski, currently produced in Germany, that is similar in some ways to those older Fernandez skis. Many folks think these new skis are just a warmed over version of those older skis, and they do look a bit alike, superficially, but they are FAR different skis. Structures, materials, rigging, etc, are ALL very different. THOSE skis have been field approved on a Cessna 180 in Alaska.

With a set of Fernandez wheel skis, you WILL have to get a field approval. Good luck doing that with Fargo FSDO.

If I were going that route, I'd want to look at those skis VERY close, AND talk to mechanics/FSDO first to verify I could get them approved.

As to ski installations, get in touch with Jeff Faught in Bismark, if that's fairly close. Jeff works for Game and Fish, and does their maintenance. He's rigged them. Depending on where you're at, there are folks around with experience in that.

Let me know if you need contact info.

MTV


MTV

Yes, they are 1980's vintage, according to the ad. They are on Barnstormers right now, in Maine.

If I were to purchase the ones that Rhyppa has, do I have to get the axles and etc. right from Wipaire, or is there another source. I understand the STC can be had for a few hundred bucks.

Lance, as I said in the pm to you, if the Stinson axles I have are equal diameter or larger, they will work - simple to machine them down. What is the inside diameter of the 180 axle? That's all I need to know. Otherwise, I'm betting the Fluidyne axles for the 180 would work, all that matters is length, and diameter of thread in the ends of the axles. If the fluidyne axles are longer easy to cut them down, if they're shorter, you're SOL. I will measure mine tonight. Like I said, I went the save a buck route, and its gonna cost me a bunch. If you look at other skis, look very carefully at the tunnels for cracks, patches, the metal bottoms for the same, the plastic bottoms for cracking, the cylinders for leaking, the rear axles for bending, the rollers & plates for smooth operation and wear. All things I didn't do. Most of these ski's rattle like a bag of bolts when you shake them because they are so worn out. I can double check, but as I recall I had to run 7.50's on mine to fit, as the 8.50 doesn't clear the hole. I think Wip is the only source. You don't just find parts for most of these skis on a shelf. Its a make, modify type of deal.

Thanks for the info--the C-180 is spring gear, and the axles are solid, with a 4 bolt flange that attaches them to the gear leg with bolts. I think that the way they are setup is a similar axle stub, bolted on the inside of the gear leg. Maybe I am wrong, but I thought I had seen something like that. Your skis sound like the perfect setup for me, I just want to figure out what else I have to purchase/fabricate to make them work. The location is also a plus, I am about 40 miles south west of Grand Forks. Not too far away from you--

Lance Fugleberg

Lance,

I suspect you're going to have to go to hollow steel axles to use those skis. The C-3200 or AWB 2500's could use your axles, but you'd still have to buy the ski axle for the other side of the gear leg.

MTV

MTV--so does that 13" long shaft go clear thru the axle and gear leg, and thru the inside stub axle?

I called wipaire and asked some questions, and the tech guy said he would send me the installation drawings, but he must not have gotten around to it this afternoon. He said the STC transfer was $350, and the inner axle stubs were $600 a side. I was waiting for the picture to find out what other pieces I needed.

Does anybody have a decent picture of how they attach? I am having trouble figuring out exactly what I need.

There is a set of Airglass skiis on ebay for a 180 if you are interested.