Just an FYI.

If you are lurking here and have always wanted to start your training, just a heads up... The new rules for student pilots/medicals goes into effect on April 1st. Super short notice, but if you can make an appt and get your medical before the 1st it will be a bit easier. New rules will require you to first go to the FISDO.

Good luck!

bigrenna wrote:Just an FYI.

If you are lurking here and have always wanted to start your training, just a heads up... The new rules for student pilots/medicals goes into effect on April 1st. Super short notice, but if you can make an appt and get your medical before the 1st it will be a bit easier. New rules will require you to first go to the FISDO.

Good luck!

Actually, Greg, the new rules don't require a prospective pilot to go to a Flight Standards Office. That is one option. Another option is to apply via your flight instructor. The flight instructor verifies the student's nationality and applies to the FAA for a student pilot certificate. The FAA claims (I know) they'll turn those requests around pretty quick. We'll see.

And this has nothing to do with the medical, which remains the same as ever, EXCEPT that the new medical will not serve as a student pilot certificate, like it has for many decades. This is all Homeland Security mandated stuff, by the way. Or rather the FAA's response to Homeland Security. If it were up to Homeland Security, the FAA wouldn't issue ANY pilot certificates.

MTV

Some days it is not so bad being an OLD Pilot!

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Regarding visiting the local FSDO, I went to the Washingtonm DC area office, and they were very nice and helpful. The worst part was driving there though the traffic since the office is located in Herndon, Virginia just south of Dulles International Airport (KIAD).

I am not sure what it is like at other FSDO offices. I went there to get interviewed for TSA permission to fly into the FRZ, which is this little circle inside the SFRA (formerly called ADIZ) surrounding Washington, DC. The lady was very nice. I had to wait while they checked to see if I had any outstanding books due at my library, or missed dental appointments. It was over in 10 minutes.

I was expecting a grilling, but it was all very low key. Not sure what this new student stuff will be like, or whether most student pilots now will apply through their instructor. Hey...what's another hundred or two for assistance with the paperwork and filing eh .

Curious--why did you go to the FSDO for permission? I thought all that was required was to take the online SFRA test for the certification to fly in. Or did I miss something?

Cary

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Cary wrote:
Curious--why did you go to the FSDO for permission? I thought all that was required was to take the online SFRA test for the certification to fly in. Or did I miss something?

You are right about just taking the SFRA online course ( which is good for FAA Wings credit by the way ) to be okay to fly within a 60 mile outer radius zone surrounding Washington. It is flying within the inner circle or “bull’s eye” that is called the FRZ or Flight Restricted Zone, where the extra hassle comes in.

The DC SFRA stands for the D.C. Metropolitan Area Special Flight Rules Area. Inside of the SFRA is the DC FRZ, or flight restriction zone. The FRZ is the airspace within roughly 15 NM of the DCA VOR and encompasses Hyde Field (W32), Potomac Airfield (VKX) and College Park Airport (CGS). In addition to the requirements for the SFRA (above), the PIC must have a special PIN number which is obtainable ONLY after successful completion of FAA and criminal checks. The process is evolving, but at present you still have to come to the DC area in order to complete it. This is true even if you have an existing DOD, airline or other clearance. The bottom line is that this isn’t something you can do over the phone the night before your first excursion into the area. Here are links to some interesting summary articles.

http://aviation.about.com/od/Flight-Safety/fl/The-Airspace-Over-Washington-DC.htm
http://www.aopa.org/News-and-Video/All-News/2008/December/22/Into-the-deep-FRZ

As you said Cary, GA pilots flying within a 60-nautical mile radius of the Washington, D.C. VOR/DME must complete a special awareness program designed to educate them about the area’s limitations and restrictions. To enter the FRZ requires additional credentialing.



To fly within the FRZ, I had to apply to TSA and pass a Criminal Background Check. As part of this process one needs to :

1) Have Official Fingerprinting done and submit this to the National Air Transportation Association (NATA) Compliance Services (NATACS). 2) NATACS sends them to TSA
3) A TSA FRZ form needs to be completed and signed at the local FSDO. (Either the Baltimore and Washington FSDO Office is okay).

Anyway, it was the FRZ application process that required an interview and personal visit to the FSDO. As you said Cary, if you are just cruising around the outer areas you are right, it only requires completion of the SFRA exam. Hey, I figure if you are going to enjoy Back Country Aviation inside the DC Beltway, you might as well fly inside the FRZ eh

mtv wrote:...the new rules don't require a prospective pilot to go to a Flight Standards Office. That is one option. Another option is to apply via your flight instructor. The flight instructor verifies the student's nationality and applies to the FAA for a student pilot certificate. ...

I wonder how many CFI's are on top of this new twist? Esp the old-timers, who often are the best ones to actually learn from. A couple years ago, I asked a couple long-time CFI's at my airport something about LSA / sport pilot -- this was at least 5 years after LSA / SP rules came into play, and neither one of them knew anything about it. Didn't want to know either.

This latest requirement of having to apply for the student's ticket, as well as check their identity, nationality, and ethnic / religious leanings (just kidding...maybe) is why some CFI's no longer want anything to do with primary instruction, and will only do BFR's and t/w training. That's too bad, it's aviation's loss.

hotrod180 wrote:

mtv wrote:...the new rules don't require a prospective pilot to go to a Flight Standards Office. That is one option. Another option is to apply via your flight instructor. The flight instructor verifies the student's nationality and applies to the FAA for a student pilot certificate. ...

I wonder how many CFI's are on top of this new twist? Esp the old-timers, who often are the best ones to actually learn from. A couple years ago, I asked a couple long-time CFI's at my airport something about LSA / sport pilot -- this was at least 5 years after LSA / SP rules came into play, and neither one of them knew anything about it. Didn't want to know either.

This latest requirement of having to apply for the student's ticket, as well as check their identity, nationality, and ethnic / religious leanings (just kidding...maybe) is why some CFI's no longer want anything to do with primary instruction, and will only do BFR's and t/w training. That's too bad, it's aviation's loss.

Actually, the only thing in this that's new is the requirement for the student to acquire a plastic "student pilot" certificate, as opposed to the medical certificate serving as the student pilot certificate.

The requirement to verify citizenship has been a requirement for ~ 10 years or so, but don't quote me on that number. If you're applying for a new certificate, the CFI has been required for some time anyway to verify the citizenship of the applicant prior to giving instruction. That verification has to be kept in the instructor's logbook for 3 years. If they're not a US citizen, they have to be fingerprinted, vetted by FAA/TSA and given an authorization prior to flight instruction commencing. In my experience, that process takes about three weeks. So, I doubt this business of issuing a plastic certificate will take long.

Note that all this is only required for an applicant for a "privilege", ie: a certificate or rating. Not required for a flight review, aircraft checkout, etc.

As to CFIs not keeping up on the regs, that's their prerogative, of course. But, this one could bite you when the "student" goes to take his or her checkride. I'm guessing the FAA wouldn't be real friendly to a CFI who put someone through training without the proper documents.

Nevertheless, the requirement to verify citizenship, as I said, is nothing new.

MTV

mtv wrote:...the only thing in this that's new is the requirement for the student to acquire a plastic "student pilot" certificate, as opposed to the medical certificate serving as the student pilot certificate. ...

That's pretty minor. I thought the new big deal was the CFI having to apply for the student ticket, or the student doing it at the FSDO, as opposed to the old way where your AME-issued medical certificate also served as your student ticket.

From my reading of AC 61-65F, para 11, the biggest differences are:
1. Must go to FSDO to apply (IACRA completed) for Student Certificate.
2. Medical Certificates (if required) will still be obtained from AME.
3. Applicant will not be eligible to solo until Plastic Certificate is in their possession...***

***. From experience, Plastic Certs are usually 90-120 days to arrive...
Regulation specifically states that a Temp Airman Certificate will not be issued....

Disappointing that this seems to be another hurdle to make flying harder to get started with.....

Instructor: "Hey, you are getting close to solo... Let's get your Student Certificate..."
New flyer: "How long does it take?"
Instructor: "Just 3 MONTHS !"

Most guys who walk in for their first lesson are already behind the 8-ball on this....

MS Pirate wrote:From my reading of AC 61-65F, para 11, the biggest differences are:
1. Must go to FSDO to apply (IACRA completed) for Student Certificate.
2. Medical Certificates (if required) will still be obtained from AME.
3. Applicant will not be eligible to solo until Plastic Certificate is in their possession...***

***. From experience, Plastic Certs are usually 90-120 days to arrive...
Regulation specifically states that a Temp Airman Certificate will not be issued....

Disappointing that this seems to be another hurdle to make flying harder to get started with.....

Instructor: "Hey, you are getting close to solo... Let's get your Student Certificate..."
New flyer: "How long does it take?"
Instructor: "Just 3 MONTHS !"

Most guys who walk in for their first lesson are already behind the 8-ball on this....

Must not have read section 11 very carefully.......

Here is the opening paragraph of section 11 from the Advisory Circular which you refer to:

11. STUDENT PILOT CERTIFICATION. Specific knowledge, flight proficiency, flight experience, and endorsement requirements for the student pilot certificate are located in part 61 subpart C.
a. A person may apply for a student pilot certificate with one of the following authorized individuals: a CFI, a DPE, through an FAA ASI or AST, or with an Airman Certification Representative (ACR) associated with a 14 CFR part 141 pilot schoo. All student pilot certificates will be issued by the Civil Aviation Registry (AFS-700) on a high quality plastic card stock containing tamper- and counterfeit-resistant features.

So, the prospective student goes to a flight instructor, school, etc and says they want to fly. I always have prospective students get a medical before we do more than a fam flight.

They come back with the medical, The instructor has them create a file on IACRA (the FAAs online records system, which they'll eventually need to take a checkride) then the instructor logs on to IACRA and verifies that the student is a US citizen (birth certificate or passport required) and that they are English proficient. They click the enter button on the computer, and it's done. According to the AC that you reference, the FAA says they'll issue the plastic certificate within three weeks. All done on line, in about ten minutes. A later paragraph spells out the procedure to apply via a form 8710-as in on paper.

That's it. These days, hardly anybody solos in three weeks, so I hardly think this is an issue. And, flight instructors have been required to verify citizenship of students for a number of years. In my experience, going through THAT process for FORIEGN students takes about three weeks once submitted.

This is a tempest in a teapot, frankly, and if an instructor can't figure this out fast, the student really needs to go down the road.

MTV

I realize this thread is a few months old but regarding the Student Pilot Certificate. It was painless. I did this with my CFI in June. He verified my citizenship, he enrolled me on the FAA website. I received my plastic student pilot card in my mailbox 7 days later. I was suprised it was that quick.

Did my medical with a local AME.

Just thought I'd post this for any guys starting out and stressed about the situation. However, your experience may differ and I would plan for the worst and hopefully you can get the process rolling as soon as possible.

Bill

I've done two student licenses so far and the FAA is getting them back quickly. It is an extra step but not hard. Try training an "alien" student. That is a lot of hoops to jump through and any mistake will get you in hot water with the TSA.

billjesstaylor wrote:I realize this thread is a few months old but regarding the Student Pilot Certificate. It was painless. I did this with my CFI in June. He verified my citizenship, he enrolled me on the FAA website. I received my plastic student pilot card in my mailbox 7 days later. I was suprised it was that quick.

Did my medical with a local AME.

Just thought I'd post this for any guys starting out and stressed about the situation. However, your experience may differ and I would plan for the worst and hopefully you can get the process rolling as soon as possible.

Bill

Bill,

Thanks for the "real life" update. I'm glad it went well for you and I hope your flight training is going equally well.

MTV