I'm embarrassed having gone a few years without knowing the real answer to this question. I'm familiar enough flying out of towered airports and even trained at a class C for some time, and I guess some how I've gotten by this long by fudging it. Well, no more!

Someone please answer me this question: When clearance or tower gives the instruction "proceed on course after departure" or something similar, when should the turn be initiated? I'm thinking the possible answers are:

A - As soon as practicable
B - At the end of the runway
C - Within 300' of pattern altitude
D - B or C, whichever comes last
E - Something else entirely

I generally turn somewhere in between all of those and no one's ever said anything

Well?

I don't know the answer but I usually tell them when I'm done with my run up that I'm ready for departure and "request _____bound when clear." If they forget, I request again when I'm ready to turn.

Tower always chews me out and says the answer is B. Only a few times tower sounded impressed when I made the turn at pattern alt passing the tower.

I think you know the answer, if you just think about how you go about departure in the first place.

Example: You contact clearance delivery and request your VFR departure, heading 270 to Ashley river, cruise at 1500ft.

1) After doing the run-up, you call tower.they tell you to" position and hold", then clear you for departure runway (33), "fly runway heading....contact departure @ 122. whatever."

2) "Departure control, Cessna 19344 with you 0500ft, for 1500ft."

3) "Cessna 19344, Turn heading 270, squawk 0412..maintain VFR at or below 1500ft as requested."

Basically there could be a few variables, but pretty much you turn to your destination as directed as soon as you have contact with departure control and you are ready for the turn. Its been my experience that if you are VFR and you have a local destination or general direction that you requested they will turn you towards it. Once you are beyond their airspace they usually turn you lose and tell you to resume own navigation, squawk 1200 , good day.

They will not TELL you to turn, only clear you to turn, unless they have a traffic conflict. In the case of traffic conflict they will tell you step by step turns to headings and hopefully not forget about you, then turn you as you requested.

I am no expert.....but as i recall this is how it generally goes. I have made climbing turns after departure and zoomed right past the tower. I think to wait until the end of the runway would be maybe a local thing if your instructor prefers. In my experience(s), I was departing a 12,500 ft runway in a Cessna 172. When departure was contacted..i proceeded to turn to the assigned heading. So in many cases thats 1/3 or less of the runway i am up, turning and going about my way.

lownslow79 wrote:1) After doing the run-up, you call tower.they tell you to" position and hold"

Busted, now Line up and wait.

Cheers...Rob

I don't know the right answer but around here you seldom hear anything from the tower after your cleared for takeoff. I wouldn't turn towards downwind before the end of the runway unless I asked since there is usually a lot of traffic (students). Anywhere else I usually figure 500' agl and I'm good. I usually do a cruise climb on takeoff from a controlled airport just to get out of there anyway.

At my Class D airport they want us 700' AGL and at the end of the runway.

If you want an early turn they always approve unless there is a conflict.

The reason for the 700 is so you aren't blowing the roofs off nearby homes and businesses.

A lot of airports have local procedures for noise and whatever. I use Flight Guide they do a good job of informing you of local procedures.

When the east wind is blowing 35MPH and I take off on RW 7 I will get "early turn at pilot discretion". I will be at 1000AGL at mid field of a 5400' RW

So many variables.

Good day

Justine,

The FARs don't give any rules for departing the airport pattern after takeoff, but the AIM provides procedures that it states pilots should follow. Section 4-3-3, "Traffic Patterns", suggests that at controlled airports departing aircraft should maintain runway heading until they reach the end of the runway, after which they should depart the pattern along the runway heading, or turn left (if left traffic; turn right if right traffic) at a 45 degree heading once pattern altitude is reached.

A lot of pilots don't follow the FAA pattern departure recommendation, and there are no rule violations involved as long as the pilot properly observes "see and avoid" in and around the pattern, and otherwise follows the published rules.

Duane

Ditto what Rob said. I get about 600-700 AGL and clear of the airport fence before I begin my turn unless the tower says different. This is the same thing I do at uncontrolled airports. Again, unless there are different published departure procedures. One time the tower asked me to make my turn as soon as practical after I took off. As the tower was right on my way I took this as an invitation to fly past the tower cab and wave. The controller got and the radio and started to yell at me but then he stammered and then thanked me. Ha!

I called back and said "just doing what I can to help out, boss."

Great question. Thanks for posting.

NM is right, I had to look it up. In my old Jepppesen book it says: "The standard procedure is either to fly straight out or to make a 45 degree turn in the direction of the pattern after you reach pattern altitude".

I fly out of ADS, busiest GA airport in Texas, fifth busiest in USA... ATC is adamant about holding to pattern altitude before "turn out". DFW just a few miles to the west and DAL, just to the south, kinda messy at times depending on departure heading. Congested/populated areas 1,000' AGL/2,000' horizontal, sparsely populated 500' AGL, I always adhere to pattern regardless...

Well, good old IDA is only a class-d, but i'm always requesting an early turn, and almost never get told otherwise. could be though that i always simulate shortfield take off, push the nose over, and then get 1000' agl damn quick, for a number of reasons...

If you are in Canada (even in the northwest US), it is 500' unless told otherwise.

My instructor taught me no turns until 600ft. AGL unless tower commands an earlier turn. FWIW

One of my low level pipeline routes parallels Port Columbus (class C) runways about three miles north. This one day I dropped a buddy off for a commercial flight while on route. On departure, they gave me clearance for an immediate intersection departure, saying traffic was a landing 737. As soon as my wheels left the ground they said when able make that 90 degree turn on course.

I did a climbing right turn passing in front of the new 300 foot tall tower, not much more then 500 feet out from the tower. I always expected a photo of the bottom of my plane to show up in the mail, but never heard anything.

Rooster Cogburn wrote:I fly out of ADS, busiest GA airport in Texas, fifth busiest in USA... ATC is adamant about holding to pattern altitude before "turn out". DFW just a few miles to the west and DAL, just to the south, kinda messy at times depending on departure heading. Congested/populated areas 1,000' AGL/2,000' horizontal, sparsely populated 500' AGL, I always adhere to pattern regardless...

I used to get to Addison a bit to visit my daughter at school... first time I did it Regional Approach gave me a 15 mile straight in from the North... easy for me in the cub but it sure screwed the traffic behind me as I beat into a headwind while they dis S-Turns! Once on the ground I called to see if there was a better way and they politely asked me in the future to have approach bring me in on base anymore I usually go into Mesquite to avoid the ramp fee and/or $7.35 fuel

Used to fly out of KPOC they had 2 parallel runways 26 L & R. The tower was mid field north of 26R we used to take off 26R and initiate a right turn just passed the tower (this sometimes was barely higher than the top of the tower cab). At some point they stopped that and only cleared a turn at the end of the runway. It was all industrial to the north of the airport (within 1/4 mile or so). I personally use 400' as my guideline to turn crosswind.

Thanks everyone, I'm not alone! Waiting 'till the end of the runway unless ATC instructs otherwise sounds good to me.

If you travel the length of a 10,000' runway in a cub before you turn, it would seem that you "tie up" the runway for at least a minute or probably closer to two. That seems like a long time at a busy airport.

I turn whenever it feels "comfortable" unless advised otherwise by ATC.

Bonanza Man and kase are tower personel and members on this site, maybe one or both of them could chime in on what they expect from pilots....