Hi y'all,
Don't know if you can follow this link, but it goes to a rather unique 170 that's not only for sale, but located in my part of the country. The last 170 I was interested in was in NC, which I thought was somewhere around Texas. My wife straightened me out on that one...somehow I never cared a damn about any state east of New Mexico.

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/specs?clsfdnum=785175

Anyway, it's a 170B with the 180hp Lycoming engine and a 3-blade prop. Looks like it has a 170 panel in it, along with a pretty good IFR set-up, which admitadely I don't need, though if I bought it I'd probably get my instrument license. Good and bad there...

I'm interested in hearing what other knowledgable people, or even people like me, think about this plane. If the planets align I might fly up to see it next week.

thanks
ravi

That looks like a really nice, albeit expensive, 170B. I'll assume you already know all the advantages of a big-engined 170. Even if this thing has been meticulously cared for over the years, there's no way around the fact that it's a 55 year old airplane. That means it's possibly been wrecked, restored, corroded, frankenplaned, who knows what.

I can't stress enough the value of taking along an IA knowledgeable in old Cessnas, or 170's in particular, to check out the plane with you. A pre-buy inspection should make sure the logs are in order, inspect the airframe for corrosion, or repair work that is not corroborated by the logs. That means opening all inspection covers and poking around with a mirror. But where do you stop? You can look at the guy's log entry from his last annual, but that tells you the condition at the last annual. What's happened since then?

You might as well just have it annualed by your own IA. You can't afford not to with an old bird. Plus, it gives you bargaining power that can svae you a lot of money, far eclipsing the money spent on the IA's time. Otherwise, you just throw money at it on your first annual as owner.

The big player is engine condition. 850 SMOH is roughly, what, 60% of TBO on that motor? The modernized panel counts for a lot, cuz it would cost you a lot to upgrade an original panel to that. Considering an overhaul costs ~ $20K, time SMOH is a huge bargaining chip.

That said, I'd love to get my hands on that 170.

Go to the Cessna 170 site and read all you can on pre-buys and annuals. So many guys have asked this question over there and been lectured by the great George Horn on this topic specifically that you can't afford not to absorb the knowledge that's available.

Thanks for the good advice, Zane. Personally I think it's more panel than I want to pay for, but it does look nice. I have a good mechanic, familiar with the 170's. He's also interested in taking a 140 in trade, which might work out well.

we'll see.

Ahh I forgot you already have a 140, so you know old Cessnas somewhat.

That may be one of the nicest panels I've ever seen in a 170.

You have to consider resale value a little, but also the value of the plane to you. That is an awesome plane. It's had every single upgrade a 170 owner would want save for the Bushwheels.

Just make sure it's $72,000 worth. I see a lot of 170 advertised for that, but I'm not sure what the final sale price actually is when they sell...if they do.

Ravi while your checking it out, it appears to have modifications done to the panel. Make sure their approved and signed off. You wouldn't be the first to buy a thing of beauty that wasn't legal in that department

If it all checks out it looks like a real good ride. Hard to duplicate at that price. The only thing left to do is put in the fold up rear seats.

Is the O-360 lyc a 2000 hr engine? Think that Peterson has a Mogas stc for that engine.

Tim

Only took 6 posts this time for someone to suggest a Maule when you asked about this particular Cessna.

ya maules are ok but they are not cessnas good luck overhauling a franklin at any price. the 170 looks good like zane said get a good pre-buy . take it from someone who knows you couldn't build it for that money if you had to pay for labour.

That looks - on paper - like a very nice plane and well worth taking a look at. Assuming the airframe is in solid condition, the engine, prop, and avionics would certainly justify the cost. As mentioned, you probably couldn't build it for that.

There's a guy on the field here who is putting a O-470 in his 170 and doing other extensive modifications. At last check he was headed over $100k. Maybe crazy to some, but he's building the plane that he wants to fly for the rest of his life (though aren't we all, at least until we see another one we like better?).

Some folks on this list should consider switching over to the Maule site, if all they want to respond on EVERY post is "Buy a freakin Maule, Man" to every post where a guy asks legitimate questions about another type airplane as well as throw out insulting comments to anyone who doesn't think Maules are just the coolest thing since sliced bread.

I know of two 180 hp 170's that sold for low 70's/high 60's in the last year. That is actually SOLD for that much. This is an asking price, which I'd bet is somewhat negotiable.

It is a very nice looking airplane. The panel is obviously a large part of the price. There is no doubt he's got wayyyy more money in this thing than $72 K. That's an Avion panel, I'd bet, and it also has the 172 style control system, to permit the center stack radios. Consider that a Garmin 430 by itself costs over $10K right now.

My only hesitation would be the three bladed prop. Lot of weight out front, for performance that's not as good as a two blade, I'd bet.

But, it's a gorgeous airplane, with a fantastic panel. It would be a great airplane to get instrument rated in.

You have to decide what it's worth to YOU.

MTV

maulewaco wrote: You want something fun and cheap. Stop asking about planes and go fly a 220M4 or come up here and fly mine and get on with it.

OK I am thinking about a 180. Remember, I am the guy that started tail wheel starter plane thread.

Were can I go to fly an M4-210 or 220 so I can get convinced. Any instructor with one. I have .6 tailwheel time. That is point 6. Wouldn't an M4-180 be a good one.

With insurance cost for a low time maul guy as apposed to a 170 guy, how many years would the cost of a maul be higher. I remember Rob at 600 per month for insurance. Can you take the differance in a maul and a 170-180 price and invest in an anuity to pay insurance differance.

It is true that a guy should try a few different flavors before you can pick a favorite.

Tim

Good post MTV

Ravi. That could be a great plane. Very important to do your homework. Check the logs and paperwork on mods. Fly the plane and/or have someone fly the plane that is familiar with these. If it flys right,has no or minimal corrosion, and everything is in order and makes sence, you will have a lot of fun with it and hopefully relatively low maintanence costs.

That should be a good engine if flown properly and with some frequency and good maintenance. Not uncommon to reach 2000hr TBO and beyond.

As MTV said, don't know about the prop, pretty uncommon for that combination of plane and engine. Maybe good, maybe bad. But that is getting to be a hard plane to find in good condition. If everything else was good, I would consider buying the plane and selling that prop, and buying one that would be a little lighter and/or a little better. Gary

mtv wrote:Some folks on this list should consider switching over to the Maule site, if all they want to respond on EVERY post is "Buy a freakin Maule, Man" to every post where a guy asks legitimate questions about another type airplane as well as throw out insulting comments to anyone who doesn't think Maules are just the coolest thing since sliced bread.

Couldn't have said it better myself. It gets old. Every thread turns into the same thing. Cessna vs Maule vs Stinson vs etc... If you're not going to make an effort to answer the OP's actual question, keep lurking. I'm sure there's an open ended "What PLane is Right For Me" thread you can add to.

maulewaco wrote:Ok, I guess I can see the guy is trying to find a plane and asking a lot about different ones. I was there and this is no bullshit I have owned over 29 airplanes in the last six years and if I did not like it I sold it. Flown a lot of them. I will just keep my own research to myself. I have no buisness on this site or others. I fly with my own group of pilots that share information reguardless of type. This is a cyber world of bullshit pissing matches anyway of say what you want. Say it to my face and it will be a different story. Give yourself a pat on your backs . I am going flying in the real world. Deleted

Don't let the door hit ya from behind.

I asked the seller what that three-blade prop did for the plane, and he said "nothing, really, but it sounds like a turbo-prop!" Perhaps a slight overstatement, but as close as a guy like me is likely to get to one. He did think the ground clearance was a bit better (?) with the three blade. Does anyone out there know if changing the prop is as simple as buying a two blade prop and sticking it on?

MTV, you are exactly right about the non-standard panel and why they can put in a center stack. It does look like a good IFR plane (back up vacuum pump!), though around here IFR generally means ice, which is not something I never plan to play around in.

Maulewacko brought up a good point, albeit in an unfortunate way. Most of us end up buying a plane with very little idea whether it's the right plane for us. I don't know of many people who are fortunate enough to be able to fly a variety of planes long enough to know how they really feel about them. If you gave me five hours in each of my top 15 picks, I'd be able to make a pretty good decision. And I'd probably pick a different plane than you would. As it is, I'll end up spending a fortune on a plane I know very little about, while discounting planes I know nothing about. I guess that's why I ask other people what they think.

In reality I don't think there is one right plane out there (except a 220 M4, of course ). Each one is a different compromise. I'm trying to learn what those compromises are without going through the pain of ownership again and again and again.

All intelligent input to my questions is GREATLY appreciated.
ravi

which is not something I never plan to play around in.

Ok...I was raised in Idaho. There, it's out.

3-blade props are smoooooooth.
Usually.

Newer 182 with a 3-blade on it was the smoothest, quietest plane I've ever flown. If it's an approved installation it might be a good score.

With insurance cost for a low time maul guy as apposed to a 170 guy, how many years would the cost of a maul be higher. I remember Rob at 600 per month for insurance. Can you take the differance in a maul and a 170-180 price and invest in an anuity to pay insurance differance.

qmdv,
Interesting idea regarding the insurance and the cost difference on the plane...

If my insurance experience is anything to go by, you will ALWAYS pay more for the Maule verses the Cessna, because they consider it a higher risk regardless of how many hours you have.

One other thing to think about is how many hours of dual instruction the insurance company will require you have before solo. My guess is it will be at least 10 hours in either plane. Those ten hours will have to be provided by an instructor who has at least 25 hours in the same make and model of airplane, regardless of how much tail wheel time they have. If there is no instructor available in your area for plane X, it might not be the right one for you.

People I know who have flown a variety of tail wheel planes all report that larger planes (Cessna 180 for example) are significantly harder to control than smaller planes. One person I know had 1000 hours in a Cessna 120, and when he bought a Cessna 180 he didn't feel comfortable in it until he had around ten hours of dual instruction. Something to think about.

quicksilver wrote:3-blade props are smoooooooth.
Usually.

Newer 182 with a 3-blade on it was the smoothest, quietest plane I've ever flown. If it's an approved installation it might be a good score.

Bingo, I went from a two blade to a three blade on an other than a Cessna type plane. It gained 16 lbs. which moved the CG foward nicely in my case, lost just a little bit in cruise performance, but really is almost as smooth as a turbine. I dynamically balanced it to .04 IPS. It took a little while to get used to it because it sounded like the engine was turning faster, but there is less noise.

ravi, that is one sweet looking plane. If it is as the owner claims you will be happy with it. As others have stated be diligent on the inspection. Unscrupulous people are always trying to hide stuff.

You know I fly a Maule, and I said before buy what makes you happy. I stick by that. I'll tell you before Hottshot does. It need bigger tires. But thats another story for another day.

But what do I know anyway, I'm the retard paying 600 bones a month for insurance. Thank goodness, not much longer.

Now go buy that plane!

As for brother pilots who can't help but say buy a Maule. It's just we love them so much we want to share the joy. Please forgive us.

Cheers...Rob