Helo all,

Without getting into too much detail, our current airport manager may be moving on from the position. It is a county/city airport owned by our post district (we have no sea port, just a few airports)
There seems to be alot of debate and worry about getting federal funding for this or that. Right now they want to move a runway, tear down a bunch of hangars, and put a big unfriendly fence around the whole place so we can squeeze a few more dollars of federal funding. I am wondering how we can go without goverment handouts, and excessive rules, keep the place friendly, make it more desirable for air campers (we are a resort town) light sport, ultra lights (we are already poluted with paragliders and hang gliders)

I am looking for advice from someone who has ran a privatly owned airport, or small airport that does not recieve much federal money. I would be happy to hear any comments or opinions though.

D.

I own and run a private airport...

I guess I have several questions for you.

1- How many planes are based there?
2- What is the make up of the based fleet. ie. Jets. turbo props, twins, singles, LSA's, ultralights, others. ?
3- What is the 'common' feeling toward the future of the airport from based plane owners, port authority, neighbors. etc?
4. Can you be openminded enough to hear all sides and make logical decisions based on the majoritys feelings ?


Ben
2WY3

http://www.airnav.com/airport/S10

The info in the link in pretty close to acurate. I would say more than 44 flights a day in the summer, but far less in winter.

I can hear all sides of an argument, I have always been good at that.

The non pilots who care anything about the airport have think it could be bigger an attract more corporate and commercial aviation. The pilots at the airport don't think many changes are really necessary and don't really see more jets flying in as a benifit. It seems if they have a need to come here, they do.
It is the head of the local pilots association (I am told they have a lot of pull with the airport board) who is recomending me for the job. I asked questions like "why don't we do this, or that here" and stuff like "why has that been INOP for 10 years" and it was suggested to me I go after the job.

One thing I don't understand that has been happening at this airport is actively try to drive away any extra business that wants in to aviod making more work for the current manager. For instance, the ultralight place wants to have a fly-in. He got permission but there is to be no camping on field (we have 2 camping spots) because there is no resources to smooth out and clean up the spots. The ultra light shop owner spent an hour, spots are clean now. I would have had a process in place to request using the airport for events like this and had nominal fees structured to deal with the extra work. Seems easy.
There is an anual air race. Like a time, speed, distance, navigation sort of event. No pylons or anything. I am not sure how this would be much different than any busy Saturday for the current manager, but he says he does not have the time to deal with the excess traffic.

It is silly basic things like that, plus letting things go as far as maintenance around the airport. I think they like me for the job because I am both an A&P and a pilot. I also am looking into buidaplane.org and would like to start a program for kids from the local schools to learn aviation. There is a county owned unused GIANT hangar that was once a forest service hangar. Plenty of room for that sort of thing, and maybe even a small working museum. I would like to create an area of the airport that is for the community to discover and experience aviation, maybe we can make some more pilots so this business has a future, rather than put up fences and scare all the kids away.

Best of luck. I hope you find some way to make it work. I don't know what's wrong with the feds but I really cringe when I hear about tearing down hangars. It's really tough to find anything even remotely affordable and, while I can't speak for everyone, there's no way I would want to keep my airplane tied down outside for an extended period of time.

If you do end up with the fence who's to say right next to every one of those required "FAA KEEP OUT" sings on the fence you put an equally big sign with an arrow pointing at the FAA sign that says, "that sign is required by the US government and is meant for the bad guys. If you are not a bad guy and are interested in cool airplanes please call 555.1224 or come on in! We're located just down the road at Big Wings Aviation."

That might be a good sign at a lot of airports.

Just look at the numbers..how many millions of dollars to allow a few extra larger aircraft operations occur? It means each landing in a large airplane can end up costing tens of thousands of dollars *each*. This happens at a lot of smaller communities...the line is always, "We'll collect more in taxes". In reality, it means use taxes will be raised for *everyone* to support the landings and takeoffs by a small number of larger aircraft. It will, however, mean a few more trucks of kerosene to flow through the local FBO's cash register.

These things rarely pan out. By pan out, I mean perhaps break even one time out of ten. After paying attention to two small airports with $5 million and $9 million improvements each here in Colorado, two things happened at each airport: the avgas prices went from average to some of the highest in the area to try and support the 10% the county kicked in for the project, and leases on the same size hangars went up for the same reason. End result for traffic numbers: an initial bump, because there were fly-ins at each airport to commemorate the new asphalt, followed by *nothing*. $5 million in asphalt is now in need of sealing at one, and the second one is simply empty. Very sad. In terms of jobs- don't bet on it. The contractors will be from out of the area most likely. They will buy some of their lodging and sandwiches while they are there, which was significant in both communities, but thats about it.

The things that make the difference to traffic for GA airports in my view are: transport availability (I plan around courtesy cars where needed), fuel prices, hangar availability for locals, AWOS, published approaches of any sort, and service/maintenance. Most of these are pretty easy to make available, but larger runway may make a full time FBO/service/maintenance more viable; that comes at a heavy price for everyone most of the time.

Wider runways are another canard. When was the last time a wider runway or better separation from taxiways made a difference for 99.8% of GA? Millions of $$ for the other .2% on improvements that another airport 30 miles away has seems like a waste to me.

These things are always part of a bulleted list on proposals, and they are there largely to take up white space on a page.

Lesluther,

After attending the airport meeting yesterday, I see all of these thing happening, with no way to stop them. There was actually a person from the city council that was literely wearing rosed colored glasses, and figurativly too.
All these people are set on spending A LOT of money to get even more federal money. They seem to have fallen charmed to a overdressed lady from some big contractor who is spending money like crazy on this study or that.
I am not really sure I am cut out for this kind of job. Not really sure I could deal with the people, and not sure I would be happy being this tied down, espescially for what it pays.

D.

DavidB. wrote:Lesluther,

After attending the airport meeting yesterday, I see all of these thing happening, with no way to stop them. There was actually a person from the city council that was literely wearing rosed colored glasses, and figurativly too.
All these people are set on spending A LOT of money to get even more federal money. They seem to have fallen charmed to a overdressed lady from some big contractor who is spending money like crazy on this study or that.
I am not really sure I am cut out for this kind of job. Not really sure I could deal with the people, and not sure I would be happy being this tied down, espescially for what it pays.

D.

Can we say Kickbacks or Large Campaign donar?!? I will.

The more research I do, the more disgusted I am. I really need to just move even more out to the midle of BFE than I am now, build a little airstrip and be a hermit.
So, the ONLY reason to tear out a perfectly good runway and move it 500 feet to the north, and tear down 10 prefectly good hangars, is to get FAA funding to pay for the work that the only purpose of is to get FAA funding. So, if we did nothing, where is the loss?
So the FAA will pay 95% of the purposed costs of all this. That does not include overruns, or continued maintenance. So where will that leave us in 10, 20 years? The hope of the city and port distric is to attract more fancy jets and turbo props. I see King Airs, Citations, Pilatus's and the like all the time. It would be nice if there was a little more room for them to park, but we make do. (sometimes we have to taxi accross the grass to go around the big ones, but oh well) None of them seem to have a problem with our 3450 foot strip, I don't thing having a 4500 foot strip will get more of that type of use, better golfing nearby might, but thats about it.
I heard one of the best things they had going on was the fire fighters being based out of here, but I am told they were ran off for creating too much work for the current managment (rumor only, which there is a lot of)
I was excited to pursue airport managment as a carreer, but I should just keep on a track that will lead to personal happiness, fyling, making old things new again, and vacations (or fun work travel, same thing to me) and not take a job that will lead to me having gray hair, smoking again, and other possibilities I wont put in writing as they may lead one to think I can become unstable.

D.

No need to move to BFE. The local airport is an asset- a great bargain.

Generally, when people understand they're getting sold a shaggy dog story to upgrade the airport, they'll pan it. This is happening at the Ravalli County airport in Montana, where they have a few wealthy users (think Microsoft and Cisco ex-executives) want a longer runway, and the local FBO wants to sell them kerosene. The county commission finally had to stop a public vote last week because people wised up to the real consequences. Now the commission gets to help their friends out, and get invited to all the right xmas parties the following winter. And the local pilots will pay for it dearly.

The real benefit to users in Hamilton came with RNAV's and a local FBO that is hands down great for service. The funds would come at the expense of raising the incredibly reasonable gas prices, a shutdown of the airport for over a year, and ticking off a less wealthy subdivision from being aligned with the new runway. It's a shaggy dog in my view. If the Dean Wittier, Cisco, Costco, and Microsoft execs who own an overpriced gated community want to land their jets there once or twice a year, they can land at Missoula a mere 40 minutes' drive away- another facility you and I and the rest of us have kindly provided with all the bells and whistles for them. If they are in a hurry, they can get a heli ride to their castles (some already do).

I have to agree with lesuther....
your airport is a real asset, and worth saving. I'm based at Susanville, NE Calif. where we have been fortunate to have two Airport Mgrs. who love aviation, and have made our local airport a great place to be.
I have flown my hang glider at Chelan, which offers tremendous soaring for us lightweight gliders, but haven't flown the Cessna 170B in there yet.
I'll encourage you to dig in and make your own little slice of heaven... I'll bring some burgers for the BBQ in your beautiful town on the shores of Lake Chelan!
B.R.

This country could use good airport managers. A good airport manager can make or break a place, always could but more so now with the social networking. One rude encounter spreads to a million pilots overnight. I empathize with your political distain but I'm not convinced all the pie in the sky fed funding will occur. If we don't stop ourselves, China might cut up our credit cards for us. The government is going to have to stop spending money like drunken sailors (apologies to drunken sailors)and small airports are going to come out hind tit to our deteriorating roads and bridges. As lesuther mentioned, courtesy cars are huge. I'm incredulous at the number of airports that won't dedicate one of their retired police cars or work crew vans as a courtesy car. A $500 car and insurance is the cheapest improvement they'll ever do at the airport. A good example of bad strategy is the interesting town of Alpine WY, they spent a guzillion dollars on a new fueling system and they sell it cheap but you're pooched on the ground unless you want to walk 2 miles. Good airport managers could really make a difference in places like that. Good post, brings up a lot of good comments.

They way I understand the improvments is that they are going to happen, the funding is secured. From additonal conversations I have had with long time locals, the members of the city government have made careers out of seeking grants and to go against them is frowned upon. I used to like a fight, a chalenge, to stick it to the powers that be at every turn, and my only goal was to "be free to ride my machine, without being hassled by the man"
I think I may be getting old. I feel passionatly about the future of the airport, but don't know if I have it in me to fight these people for the next 10 years (some are old, at least they will die before too long)
I wonder if what we really need in this town is to just completly over throw the city government. I don't think that would be too hard. Old white ladies don't represent underpaid resort workers or Hispanic Orchard workers. I think some young people, and a few Hispanics (is that the politically correct word? My neighbors just say they are Mexican) anyways, younger, some hispanic, toss out the old liberal white ladies and rn the town like a business. I know, off the subject of the airport, but there seems to be more to it than I know.
I will keep researching and trying to talk to the "right" people. I will also try to get info on some of the other airports mentioned. Maybe I can make a difference and influence the direction a bit. As far as airport manager, seems everyother airport has a real "manager" like a business has a manager. Our "manager" is a guy who does not fly, does not know a Kit Fox from a 150, and is a crappy grounds keeper at best. Damn, I better watch it, this is a public forum. I may edit and delete tomorrow.

D.

Interesting...like many I've seen airfields I'd like to go and kick ass at.
However the reality of putting 'the money/ideas where your mouth is' can be difficult...

This little cautionary tale has stuck in my mind...scroll to the Clewiston Airfield and read the saga of dealing with councils...

http://www.airfields-freeman.com/FL/Airfields_FL_OrlandoSE.htm

On a somewhat related subject, when in small towns spending money on lunch, mogas, or if I'm done flying, beer, I always mention to the local business owner that I flew in. I brought new money into the local economy that would not be there if not for the podunk strip down the road. The more podunk the strip is the more I mention this. Can't hurt to leave them with that thought.

Our podunk little strip would be an almost perfect location to lure little planes in. It's right on the Henry's River, cheap gas, in town, earthy, and 8 restaurants within a half mile. The fly in the ointment is the crop spraying operation that doesn't want to trip over a bunch of hamburger chasers. Our airport is all about ag and a few of my friends have commented on encounters with the guy in the airtractor. He's a nice guy, just busy making a living. Some places get a reputation for being prickly and it's like a TFR around the the town.

Nosedragger wrote:Our podunk little strip would be an almost perfect location to lure little planes in. It's right on the Henry's River, cheap gas, in town, earthy, and 8 restaurants within a half mile. The fly in the ointment is the crop spraying operation that doesn't want to trip over a bunch of hamburger chasers. Our airport is all about ag and a few of my friends have commented on encounters with the guy in the airtractor. He's a nice guy, just busy making a living. Some places get a reputation for being prickly and it's like a TFR around the the town.

One thing I really love about my airport is that it is surounded by orchards, no homes except for the flight instructor who owns most of the orchards right around the airport. The Town is used to airplanes flying over since there are two towns up the lake the are only accessable by boat or plane (Stehekin and Holden)
Today we have a Beaver on floats flying from downtown to a winery up the river. The lake and downtown is 5 miles from the airport, the Columbia river is less than that. I also like that when you are departing via runway 20, you get 800 or more feet of free altitude as soon as you cross the end of the runway (big hill)
On any given day there are turbo props twins, ultralights, helicopters, vintage this and thats, Maules with big tires and stuff that lands in water.
I am warming up to the job and am pretty sure I am going to go for it, crappy politics or not. I guess I need to stay a grown up for a bit longer. Damn it.

It is a seriously nice area. There is a lot of land with cheap land lease prices to put more hangars on as soon as an infrastructure issue is delt with. It is also pretty cheap to live around here as long as you can hack out a living.

D.

Great fly-in there next weekend! See ya there if there if i can get over the rocks.