Hi all, I have used backcountry pilot as a great resource for a little while now and just joined up so forgive me if this topic has been covered, I was having a little trouble navigating the forum's.

I just finished fixing up an old 74, 8GCBC Scout over the winter to upgrade from my 7ECA Citabria. I have a set of old 29" Goodyear Airwheels on the Scout at the moment. They are really in need of replacement but I didn't have the cash when fixing it up and I got a few punctures with the 8.50's so they were the best option I had so far.

Now I'm looking at some 2nd hand 31" bushwheels and I'm just wondering if anyone knows if they will fit on my standard Scout wheels? When I talked with Airframes Alaska in the winter they said no problems but I seem to remember reading about a few guys having problems with the standard wheels?

Also wondering if anyone has run the old Airwheels and the difference between them and the bushwheels. I'm pretty low time and find the Airwheels fine off airport but a real handful on pavement unless you come in super slow which is fine but the just seem pretty far out of balance and I'd like better handling if I'm dropping that much cash.

Thanks for any help!

I have 26" ABW on my 7GCBC stock wheels and they fit fine. Just put on new brake pads and still fine.

Were you at Tipella last weekend? Bunch of us did the golf course lunch at CYPS a while ago but didn't see your plane around. Nice job on the Scout, cool looking mid-span spades, like a Sukhoi.

You could ask Rick Church in Langley too. He's tinkered with different tires and wheels for those landings on rocks the size of a baby's head, and he's repaired his share of Champion products.

Hint: When landing on pavement with tundra tires, spin them up first before touchdown. Do a bounce in the unpaved overrun before the threshold if theres no lights. Otherwise bounce them on the pavement and then set down the second time.

I had 31" ABWs on my citabria 7GCBC and they fit just fine on the stock wheels. You shouldn't have any problems with the Scout.

They should fit no problem. Worse case scenario would be having to add brake disc rotor spacers for caliper clearance.

As to a comparison between the old Airwheels and the Bushwheels, the Bushwheels are a far better product, in many ways. I don't think you'll be disappointed...they are great tires.

MTV

They work great.

NEGATIVE!
Original Scout wheels are 8:50 x 6. (I hear the brand new ones have 6x6....dunno)
Unless someone already swapped your wheels (and axles) they will not work. (Maybe that swap happened tho. Measure them)

#1 stc reqs 6x6 wheels
#2 when u try to stomp on the brakes the wheel will spin inside tire not necessarily at the same rate as the other wheel. Then things can get exciting. And u damage your bushwheels.

AK-HUNT wrote:NEGATIVE!
Original Scout wheels are 8:50 x 6. (I hear the brand new ones have 6x6....dunno)
Unless someone already swapped your wheels (and axles) they will not work. (Maybe that swap happened tho. Measure them)

#1 stc reqs 6x6 wheels
#2 when u try to stomp on the brakes the wheel will spin inside tire not necessarily at the same rate as the other wheel. Then things can get exciting. And u damage your bushwheels.

A guy I know went through that last year to mount 31's. New wheels, axles and brakes.

AK-HUNT wrote:...Original Scout wheels are 8:50 x 6. ....

When I read this, I thought to myself that it sounded like bullshit. I've never even heard of 850x6 wheels.
Well AK-HUNT, I apologize! You were right on the money.
I checked my Univair catalog, and sure enough-- the Scout uses Cleveland p/n 040-047 wheels, which are 850-6.

Thanks for all the reply's guys, appreciate it!

AK-HUNT that sounds about right, maybe it's just the older Scouts but mine still has the stock 6 x 8.50 wheels and double puck brakes, so I guess I'll have to wait until I can afford wheels and axles hey. I wonder if the brakes will still fit with 6x6 wheels as well? I'll give Airframes Alaska another bell and see what they say.

Keep rocking the vintage boots for now I suppose.

Karmutzen, yep that was us at Tipella a couple weekends back we did a late night pack run into the hot springs, camped out for the night, ran back the next morn and we were having bacon and eggs in Pemby before 10am, good start to a weekend. Give us a holla next time your around I just got the Scout back together about a month or so ago so she's only just moved out there. I've talked to Rick about a champ I was looking at, great guy, forgot about him to be honest but yep he would probably know, I'll have to dig out his number and give him a shout.

Thanks again for the info guys, great tip on getting the wheels spinning first, maybe those 8.50 wheels are making the Airwheels a bit more of a pig as well. Thinking on it they are 29x6x6, someone has retrofitted ABW type tubes with the stem out the sidewall but they still don't seem to slip on the wheels even down around 5-6psi, but I guess I wouldn't want to try it with an expensive set of tires and risk ruining them.

8GCBC or anyone with Scout experience, I would love to know around what speeds you commonly use to come in at for short landings? I've been using around 55 mph longer final, pull it back to 50 for short until I know how windy it is at the ground then start slowing it up as much as possible depending on the conditions. I'm still getting comfortable with her and the old Citabria rarely got down as slow as the Scout so I'm just going by trial and error at the moment, any help would be appreciated.

Rogue wrote:
8GCBC or anyone with Scout experience, I would love to know around what speeds you commonly use to come in at for short landings? I've been using around 55 mph longer final, pull it back to 50 for short until I know how windy it is at the ground then start slowing it up as much as possible depending on the conditions. I'm still getting comfortable with her and the old Citabria rarely got down as slow as the Scout so I'm just going by trial and error at the moment, any help would be appreciated.

Hi Rogue,

Glad you have a Scout. I joined this forum too like yourself to gain knowledge. I have owned only one 8GCBC and have almost 400 hours PIC. I am not on AB wheels at the moment. The ACA factory is also very friendly, ask to speak with Dale if you have any engineering/ops question too.

I'll comment on my current flying configuration/operations with Wip 2100As. Below are some general numbers on a "good" day...paved runway in good condition 0-15 KT steady state winds. Water operation speeds are "about" the same.

Amphib MPH IAS:

Downwind (one notch flaps) 80MPH IAS
Base (two notches flaps)70MPH IAS
Final (two-three notches flaps) 65MPH IAS touchdown 50-60

The above IAS MPH are for normal operations, not short field. When going slower there are many more variables that need to be considered. The Scout on straight gear will land very (very) slow depending on the skill of the pilot. Best to be conservative, practice, practice, practice....pilot skill is the ultimate factor

delete duplicate

we did a late night pack run into the hot springs

What are you, some kind of triathlete? That's 16km, uphill! More like electric bike range for me. I drove the west Harrison to Sloquet last summer for a soak. Easier to fly into Skookumchuck and walk a few hundred yards to their hot tubs.

I find our valley strips have wind shear and turbulence with any kind of wind, so am a little careful on the slow side. After a gust it can quit flying suddenly and drop, maybe not exactly where you intended. The numbers you are using are about what I use on the Citabria. Then again, being too fast on a one-way (like Skookumchuck) has its disadvantages too.

Thanks for the numbers, I'm guessing floats are little different than straight gear.

I've never flown anything as capable so I was more just wondering what numbers other Scout guys are flying at in different conditions on wheels to get a sense if my safety margins are too low but I guess that's going to vary a lot as well. In my 7ECA my margins were always super tight to get in and out which is why I got the Scout. For the most part with me, fuel and a bit of gear it doesn't seem to want to quit flying until very low 40's with full flaps so I feel pretty comfortable at 55 when mildly gusty and 50 when its calm but you're right it does get a little windy in the valleys here especially close to the lakes so I should be airing on the faster side not the slower. I guess my IAS could be a lot different to another as well.

No definitely no triathlete just training for a half marathon, it was a bit of a mission. I didn't check the distance when going in but I figured it to be around 13k's each way. Going back, downhill, was a lot easier! It is definitely worth a trek, if you get the place to yourself or at least when its quiet. I hate driving the logging road in from our end so flying and running or even taking a bike is a much better option and doesn't take up the whole weekend.

I only just found out you can fly into Scookumchuck, I thought it was a private strip until just recently. Did you just call the hot springs there before going in?

"Stock" wheels? While I understand they fit, what is the certification basis? I know that when I did my 7GCBC dual brake conversion in 2012, the only legal way to get ABW on the Citabria was the dual puck brakes. While that may have change, those are also a 'factory' wheel for the Scout, the drawing comes straight from American Champion. Of course, there are plenty out there that are field approved, or just doing it without approval.

Does someone have an STC for the single puck ones?

WorkingWarbirds wrote:"Stock" wheels? While I understand they fit, what is the certification basis? I know that when I did my 7GCBC dual brake conversion in 2012, the only legal way to get ABW on the Citabria was the dual puck brakes. While that may have change, those are also a 'factory' wheel for the Scout, the drawing comes straight from American Champion. Of course, there are plenty out there that are field approved, or just doing it without approval.

Does someone have an STC for the single puck ones?

I had 31s on my 7GCBC and double puck brakes weren't mentioned anywhere in the STC.
The problem with the stock scout wheels is that they are 8" wide. So they do need to be replaced to run ABWs.

Rogue wrote:Thanks for the numbers, I'm guessing floats are little different than straight gear.

I've never flown anything as capable so I was more just wondering what numbers other Scout guys are flying at in different conditions on wheels to get a sense if my safety margins are too low but I guess that's going to vary a lot as well. In my 7ECA my margins were always super tight to get in and out which is why I got the Scout. For the most part with me, fuel and a bit of gear it doesn't seem to want to quit flying until very low 40's with full flaps so I feel pretty comfortable at 55 when mildly gusty and 50 when its calm but you're right it does get a little windy in the valleys here especially close to the lakes so I should be airing on the faster side not the slower. I guess my IAS could be a lot different to another as well.

No definitely no triathlete just training for a half marathon, it was a bit of a mission. I didn't check the distance when going in but I figured it to be around 13k's each way. Going back, downhill, was a lot easier! It is definitely worth a trek, if you get the place to yourself or at least when its quiet. I hate driving the logging road in from our end so flying and running or even taking a bike is a much better option and doesn't take up the whole weekend.

I only just found out you can fly into Scookumchuck, I thought it was a private strip until just recently. Did you just call the hot springs there before going in?

Do you have VGs Rogue? If not, they are well worth the $$ on that wing. I would highly recommend them.

David

A1Skinner wrote:I had 31s on my 7GCBC and double puck brakes weren't mentioned anywhere in the STC.
The problem with the stock scout wheels is that they are 8" wide. So they do need to be replaced to run ABWs.

Whose STC? I could never find one. Up to 29" ABW are factory approved on the double puck installs. But those wheels and brakes add $2k to the upgarde cost. Either way, I already have them, so whatever, but honestly, the singles were nicer to land with. Couldn't lock them.

WorkingWarbirds wrote:

A1Skinner wrote:I had 31s on my 7GCBC and double puck brakes weren't mentioned anywhere in the STC.
The problem with the stock scout wheels is that they are 8" wide. So they do need to be replaced to run ABWs.

Whose STC? I could never find one. Up to 29" ABW are factory approved on the double puck installs. But those wheels and brakes add $2k to the upgarde cost. Either way, I already have them, so whatever, but honestly, the singles were nicer to land with. Couldn't lock them.

Alaska bushwheels STC. Maybe I just didn't read it properly, but I never saw anything about double puck brakes for my 31s. I wanted to out doubles on because the singles didn't hold all that well I thought.