Kinda cool. Frankly, I'd rather see a DC-3.

http://www.gillesvidal.com/blogpano/cockpit1.htm

Boy, the seats really don't look that comfy. But very cool looking panel.

I'm just curious what those dome looking things are on the center console ?

That looks just like the inside of the 701 we are building! I think the front dash is a little higher though.

Sad reality,

The days of the Aviator is rapidly dying within the airline industry. It has been the intent of Airbus from it's earliest days to engineer the pilot out of the cockpit.

More than 20 years ago when the A-320, with the sidestick controller was being built, the Air Line Pilot's Union magazine did a cover story on the aircraft entitled..."HERE COMES THE ELECTRIC AIRLINER" An American airline pilot was in France to review the aircraft and author the article.

When he expressed concern that pilots would have difficulty getting comfortable with the sidestick controller.....the Airbus engineer answered:
"Captain...you can fly this airplane with your left hand, you can fly it with your right hand, you can fly it with your big toe." "Captain....you don't have to fly it at all, this airplane will fly it's self"

How true....demonstrated a couple years later when the Air France chief A-320 pilot did a demonstration fly by at an airshow. When he firewalled the throttle and tried to go around.....having improperly "programed" the computers....the aircraft refused to climb and decided to slowly decend into the trees; ending up in a fireball. All the while the Air France captain was pushing on the throttles, pulling on the stick and trying to climb.

When Airbus first designed the A-320 they designed it without any yoke or even a sidestick. The intent was to fly the aircraft 100% via programing the autopilot. The French pilot's union advised Airbus that if they built the airplane without a "stick" that they could just park the airplanes as the French pilots would refuse to fly it. So....Airbus gave them a little thumb to suck....in the form of a sidestick.

I have a friend, retired from an airline and now with the FAA who was the first American to be type rated in the A-380. He had flown the little A-320 at his airline. Said that the check out was simple. "....it's just thousands of computers flying in loose formation." "Virtually identical to flying the 320."

I am not suggesting that the Airbus are not fine airplanes. Just saying that they are engineered in a way to bump the captain from the top of the aviation pyramid and replace him/her with a computer.

Bob

Bob, I agree with you about the sad reality of technology and the waning physical role of the pilot in the cockpit. I also think though that there may be some silver lining to the more autonomous, technologically advanced aircraft coming out now.

In my opinion, in every aircraft, C-140 to A-380, the primary role of the pilot is that of decision maker. Piloting skill and technique should be assumed, but the decisions that are made, and the situational awareness in the IFR environment, are the real things that bring everyone home safely. The human consciousness can only digest and execute so many decisions at a time in a given situation, so why not make it easier on pilot at every juncture? Take some load off.

I realize you know this, and I don't presume to enlighten a 35,000 hr captain to the concept of human factors, but I'd just like to interject that probably hundreds or thousands of engineers have objectively studied this environment and the statistics of accidents. The consensus seems to be toward more automation. Consider orbital missions and the thousands of systems and tasks that 2 men would have to manage to pull that off...it just wouldn't happen.

I hope the design trend continues toward something that aims to alleviate interruptive tasks for the pilot while keeping him in the role of sovereign decision maker.

I definitely disagree though with a cockpit that lacks direct controls. There has to be a failsafe, something a pilot can revert to in the event that automation of systems fail. Those early tests of the A320 were tragic.

1SeventyZ wrote:Bob, I agree with you about the sad reality of technology and the waning physical role of the pilot in the cockpit. I also think though that there may be some silver lining to the more autonomous, technologically advanced aircraft coming out now.

In my opinion, in every aircraft, C-140 to A-380, the primary role of the pilot is that of decision maker. Piloting skill and technique should be assumed, but the decisions that are made, and the situational awareness in the IFR environment, are the real things that bring everyone home safely. The human consciousness can only digest and execute so many decisions at a time in a given situation, so why not make it easier on pilot at every juncture? Take some load off.

I realize you know this, and I don't presume to enlighten a 35,000 hr captain to the concept of human factors, but I'd just like to interject that probably hundreds or thousands of engineers have objectively studied this environment and the statistics of accidents. The consensus seems to be toward more automation. Consider orbital missions and the thousands of systems and tasks that 2 men would have to manage to pull that off...it just wouldn't happen.

I hope the design trend continues toward something that aims to alleviate interruptive tasks for the pilot while keeping him in the role of sovereign decision maker.

I definitely disagree though with a cockpit that lacks direct controls. There has to be a failsafe, something a pilot can revert to in the event that automation of systems fail. Those early tests of the A320 were tragic.

Remember......


....first and foremost: I am a dinosaur. That being said, as one whose career took him from airliner's little more sophisticated than a DC-3 to the early generation, highly advanced/automated B-767 and B-757....perhaps a bit of perspective is reasonable,

1. Technology really doesn't unload the pilots. It just gives them new responsibilities. Just go back and listen again to the video of the Virgin Atlantic crew. They were blabbering all of the time. Repeating rote memory items. Pretending to be in the loop.
a. You should see my personal video of manually flown airliners from an earlier era. The cockpits were incredibly free of chatter and the airmanship was surperb. I might add that the accident/incident rates were no higher back then either.

2. Humans are terrible system monitors. We are action orientated, decision makers. Give us an active role requiring physical skills, give us multiple tasks, give us complex decisions and watch us shine. Thoughout airline/military aviation history only those highly skilled aviators who could deal with complex, multiple tasking, decision making survived the selection, training and upgrading process. Modern automated flight is more about system monitoring than flying.

a. Give an aviator/human a monitoring roll......and we fall asleep!

3. Young airmen of the video generation who are raised on high tech. automated equipment really can strut their stuff....until the magic fails: then hang on. This is of course a general statement as there are always exceptions

a. About 10 years ago a "Southeastern".... Asian Airline who had a cadre of aviators which flew mostly long haul flights,with the emphasis on technology and automated flight, approached multiple disasters. The airline contracted for auditing by an outside U.S. aviation firm which discovered that .......MANY "******" AIRLINE PILOTS WERE UNABLE TO SUCCESSFULLY COMPLETE EVEN A MANUALLY FLOWN VISUAL APPOACH!! In other words they couldn't FLY the airplane. A complete overhaul of their hiring, training and standards was conducted and experienced, western,contract captains were hired in even greater numbers.

I flew for one of the world's most prominent airlines who bought into the technology myth for many years. About a decade ago the V.P. of flight noted that technologicaly advance pilots were burning holes in the earth all over the globe and rapidly losing their airmanship skills. He coined a new phrase.....

"Click, Click. Click, Click....turn off the autopilot, turn off the autothrottles....FLY THE AIRPLANE" Airmanship is once again being emphasised at that airline.

As for design ideaology... when Boeing designed the 777 they put a switch on the panel that will overide the pitch and roll limits. As Boeing said...."If our captain wants to roll the airplane....the 777 gives him that ability."

Try that with an airbus.

But this is all to no avail. The future is written. Airmanship and "old aviators" are going the way of the dodo bird.

Bob

P.S.
"A pilot is a mere technician." "An aviator is an artist in love with flight".

quote ...Ernie Gann

Good points. Interesting to hear it from someone who's seen it through the decades.

z3skybolt wrote:You should see my old video of manually flown airliners in an earlier era. The cockpits were incredibly free of chatter and the airmanship was surperb. I might add that the accident rates were no higher back then either.
Bob

I really enjoyed your comments. The cockpit discipline comment above reminded me of the comments a B-17 pilot I know made after the movie "Memphis Belle" was aired. He said when he flew, he did not put up with lots of chatter. I guess this is all part of the "sterile cockpit" concept. My friend Taylor is no longer with us, but thanks for the memories.
tom

That thing has eleven cupholders!!!!

I like the red duct tape door stop--pretty high tech!

1SeventyZ wrote:Good points. Interesting to hear it from someone who's seen it through the decades.

And the FAA invented a new weight class for this aircraft. It is not a heavy, it's a Super.

If you ever get the chance watch a short video called"Children of the Magenta" a training flick done by I believe American Airlines. Very enlightening
and entertaining.
Dave

z3skybolt wrote:....demonstrated a couple years later when the Air France chief A-320 pilot did a demonstration fly by at an airshow. When he firewalled the throttle and tried to go around.....having improperly "programed" the computers....the aircraft refused to climb and decided to slowly decend into the trees; ending up in a fireball. All the while the Air France captain was pushing on the throttles, pulling on the stick and trying to climb.

I don't know if this is that exact event but I found this.

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