×

Message

Please login first

Backcountry Pilot • cam guard

cam guard

Lycoming, Continental, Hartzell, McCauley, or any broad spectrum drive system component used on multiple type.
33 postsPage 1 of 21, 2

cam guard

I know you don't really have to ask for opinions on this forums, you'll get 'em anyways, but...
Just a few days ago, I finally bought my dream airplane- a Cessna 180. This one, a 1953 model, has a K engine with about 1150 since reman. The seller put on about 1100 of those hours, and has been doing 35 hour oil changes using Aeroshell W100 and Camguard. The engine has great compression, and goes through very little oil between changes. I've always used Phillips XC20-50 but since he's had such good results with Aeroshell I'll be using it also. But I'm not sure about the Camguard, so I thought I'd ask here about it. It's about $25 per pint-sized dose, so adds almost 50% to the cost of an oil change. Does it really help, or is it just another snake oil additive?
Last edited by hotrod180 on Sat Oct 25, 2014 7:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
hotrod180 offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 10534
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:47 pm
Location: Port Townsend, WA
Cessna Skywagon -- accept no substitute!

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Congratulations on getting your new wagon. 71cents per hour is cheap insurance. If you fly for shorter periods of time or infrequently, stick with it. What is the humidity like where you will be parking? If your flying long enough to get the condensation cooked out of the oil its probably not that important. Have fun spending and flying =D>
Blown56 offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 50
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 10:00 pm
Location: Cottonwood Id.

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Absolutely use the Camguard, especially so in your climate.
marcusofcotton offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 257
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:44 am
Location: Northern MN

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

My airplanes never sit-- I fly several times a week, but usually shorter flights. I'm in the Puget Sound area of western Washington, so it's damp & chilly in the winter (and sometimes in the summer!). I haven't heard of cam corrosion issues with the big Continentals like the Lycomings suffer from, but if Camguard really does improve or extend the lubrication qualities of the oil, it's probably worth the dough.
hotrod180 offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 10534
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:47 pm
Location: Port Townsend, WA
Cessna Skywagon -- accept no substitute!

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

CamGuard is indeed well worth the price. Best thing you can put in your engine.

Bear in mind that camshafts aren't the only things that can corrode in aircraft engines.

MTV
mtv offline
Knowledge Base Author
User avatar
Posts: 10514
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:47 am
Location: Bozeman

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

hotrod150 wrote:My airplanes never sit-- I fly several times a week, but usually shorter flights.


I'm a huge camguard supporter for most airplanes. That said, if you're flying several times a week, it's probably not necessary. If you're sitting for a week or two at a stretch, that's where you get the benefit.
rw2 offline
User avatar
Posts: 1799
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: San Miguel de Allende
FindMeSpot URL: https://share.delorme.com/LaNaranjaDanzante
Aircraft: Experimental Maule
Follow my Flying, Cooking and Camping adventures at RichWellner.com

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Various folks much smarter than me convinced me to start using camguard years ago. I'm far from an expert, but it seems like there's some science behind it. If you're on the fence, it looks like there should be some real data soon to show if and how it affects longevity:

http://www.aslcamguard.com/newsletters/cms-and-camguard-announce-joint-evaluation-of-camguard

Continental Motors Services and Aircraft Specialties Lubricants announce a joint evaluation program of CamGuard, an advanced aviation oil additive.

Fairhope, Alabama, September 4, 2014 – Continental Motors Services (CMS), a division of Continental Motors Group announced today they have entered into an agreement and established a joint evaluation program with Aircraft Specialties Lubricants (ASL) to verify the benefits of CamGuard, an aviation oil additive manufactured by ASL. This program will evaluate CamGuard in engines overhauled or repaired by CMS (formerly Mattituck). Both companies agree the time is appropriate to demonstrate merits of pairing the latest lubricant technology with the current engine technology resulting in less maintenance, lower overall operating cost and greater longevity.

“We believe the program could potentially benefit current and future customers by demonstrating and documenting the attributes of the CamGuard additive product” stated Bill Ross, Director of Product Support and Continental Motors Services. “In general, lubricant technology in aviation has not kept pace with other transportation industries. If this program can demonstrate conclusively the positive benefits of oil additive technology found in CamGuard, it could change the way engine manufacturers deal with oil product specifications”, continued Ross.

The evaluation period runs concurrent with the 18-month warranty period offered on overhauled or repaired engines. The standard warranty remains fully in effect during this evaluation. Specific information regarding the program will be provided to the Program Participants at signup. Camguard will be made available to the Participants for the duration of the evaluation. Participants will be asked to follow a specific break-in and maintenance schedule which is similar to existing guidance. Participants will provide an oil sample at each oil change for analysis. A small number of Participants may be requested to have their engines undergo “enhanced” inspections, during routine service at no additional cost.

Aircraft Specialties Lubricants, LLC is committed to creating additive products that provide a meaningful benefit to the end user. Ed Kollin, Technical Director at ASL says; “Aviation oils lack the latest available lubrication technology because they are essentially blended to Navy piston engine requirements from the middle of the last century. Market size and certification costs have been a deterrent for the industry to keep pace with lubrication technology. We look forward to working with Continental Motors on this promising evaluation program.”
Oregon180 offline
KB and Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 1259
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2007 10:37 am
Location: Ashland
Aircraft: C180B

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Edit Post: Beamer is right, Marvel Mystery Oil is not for certified aircraft #-o

Theres been other posts on here about oil, as everyone knows letting any engine sit is bad, and if thats gonna be the case cam guard has been proven to be a top notch product if not sitting long enough to warrant pickling. However, if you're flying regularly it won't really matter what oil you run according to studies like the ones done by Blackstone Labratories, maybe someone more computer savvy than I can drum up that link.
Last edited by Skalywag on Wed Oct 08, 2014 10:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
Skalywag offline
User avatar
Posts: 783
Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:52 pm
Location: Big Bend, TX

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Any other thoughts on MMO in aircraft engines, I use it in my Cummings...
Beamer pilot offline
User avatar
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2011 9:47 am
Location: Bluffton AB

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

MMO is essentially a solvent. When added to fuel it keeps lead from building up on valve stems. Because it is a solvent I wouldn't add it to oil. But that's just me.
Barnstormer offline
Posts: 2700
Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:42 am
Location: Alaska
Aircraft: C185

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Barnstormer wrote:MMO is essentially a solvent. When added to fuel it keeps lead from building up on valve stems. Because it is a solvent I wouldn't add it to oil. But that's just me.


Yeah, that's kind of my opinion also (in the absence of facts, all I have are opinions!). I mostly run avgas, so don't use it at all. However, my buddy with a Jacobs that says it's good in his oil to prevent sludging, which is more common in radials due to how the oil accumulates as it settles after a run.
rw2 offline
User avatar
Posts: 1799
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 1:10 pm
Location: San Miguel de Allende
FindMeSpot URL: https://share.delorme.com/LaNaranjaDanzante
Aircraft: Experimental Maule
Follow my Flying, Cooking and Camping adventures at RichWellner.com

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

On the 400 hours or so I put on my C-180 I haven't used Camguard. I flew regularly but have since slowed down. Always used XC20W-50. When I pull oil for my next change I'm going to sample the oil w/I Camguard. Then run Camguard and sample the next oil change.

I don't think I'll show any difference but from here on out I'm almost sure I'll always run Camguard. Unless I start flying more often again.
180BarkinWagon offline
User avatar
Posts: 14
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:49 am
Location: Attica

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Yep, I got talked into buying the snake oil. ;) I had researched it enough to try it and now I buy it by the case (4 pints) when I go to Oshkosh. I was flying 3 different planes at the time and one of them would sometimes get neglected. No scientific data but I will continue using it until I read otherwise.
WWhunter offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 2036
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:54 pm
Location: Minnesota
Aircraft: RANS S-7
Murphy Rebel
VANS RV-8

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Actually, there is a LOT of very scientific data to support the benefits of CamGuard. That's actually how it got approved for use in aircraft engines by the FAA.

Do a little searching around, go to CamGuard's web site, and you'll find a lot of test data.

MTV
mtv offline
Knowledge Base Author
User avatar
Posts: 10514
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:47 am
Location: Bozeman

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

I probably didn't write exactly what I was trying to get at. I meant to say I (me personally) can't give any scientific data. I had read a LOT of data on it as you say, and that is why I started using it. My post was mostly in jest, as you can tell by the 'snake oil' comment.
Not sure if you remember but several years ago on a similar post, I had made a comment about it being already added to a certain brand of oil and you posted a comment that I was wrong. Well, it was a 'snake oil salesman' of that particular oil that had told me this so I had no reason to doubt him. After reading a bunch of different data on it I found out, in fact, it was not added to their oil and that some guys will say anything to sell their wares. ;) Needless to say I do not buy their brand of oil.
Back to the Cam guard.... I am using it and will continue doing so
WWhunter offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 2036
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:54 pm
Location: Minnesota
Aircraft: RANS S-7
Murphy Rebel
VANS RV-8

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

And what brand is that WWhunter?
G44 offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 2093
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:46 am
Location: Michigan

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

I don't blame the manufacture so really would rather not say, but will say I currently use Philips with the addition of Cam-guard and occassionally Exxon. I actually used their oil exclusively up until that time and probably will use it again as it is a well respected brand. I may even have a few quarts still stocked away in my stash. I blame that particular over exuberant saleman for my decision to stop using it, somewhat on principal, but the need to switch to a multi-weight the main reason.
WWhunter offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 2036
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:54 pm
Location: Minnesota
Aircraft: RANS S-7
Murphy Rebel
VANS RV-8

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

Im still having a tough time following you. You use Philips now, you have used Exxon in the past but no longer use Exxon because of an over exuberant sales pitch but may return to it? When you say "their" do you mean Exxon or a different brand than Philips or Exxon. Im sorry but just a bit confused…..
G44 offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 2093
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 10:46 am
Location: Michigan

Re: cam guard-- opinions requested (hoo boy!)

G44 wrote:Im still having a tough time following you. You use Philips now, you have used Exxon in the past but no longer use Exxon because of an over exuberant sales pitch but may return to it? When you say "their" do you mean Exxon or a different brand than Philips or Exxon. Im sorry but just a bit confused…..


Kurt,

Don't try to understand him, itll just confuse him more.......he's from northern Minnesota.....yassir, youbetcha..... :D

MTV
mtv offline
Knowledge Base Author
User avatar
Posts: 10514
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 1:47 am
Location: Bozeman

Re: cam guard

Somebody once told me that Aeroshell W100 Plus was regular W100 with Camguard added. Don't think so-- there's a Lycoming approved/ recommended additive in W100+, but it isn't camguard.
hotrod180 offline
Supporter
User avatar
Posts: 10534
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 11:47 pm
Location: Port Townsend, WA
Cessna Skywagon -- accept no substitute!

DISPLAY OPTIONS

Next
33 postsPage 1 of 21, 2

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

Latest Features

Latest Knowledge Base