To All,

I've been approached by some to trade my PA-18 for an older C180. I was reading the International 180 website and it mentioned in 1959 they changed the panel. They also said this change resulted in a higher panel, thus poorer forward visibility, which I understand is a matter of perception. I thought any pre 61 panel essentially was the same basic shape, just arraigned differently. The only 180 I've flown is a 56 model. I thought it had a great view out the front, rivaling the one I had in my 53 C170. (it did have a 10" tail wheel).

So the question is which panel gives the best visibility? I'm looking at a 58 and a 59 model (go figure nothing comes easy for me) I haven't seen either one yet. Obviously there are other factors to consider, just want to know technically where the cut off was.

Thanks!

Steve

1959 serial 50356 and on had the bigger more square panel. Don't think the control "T" changed until later allowing center stack.

I know you are asking about the panel, but a couple other things to consider is the higher useful, I believe starting with the 1957 A model. Also, those old cowlings are a pain, frankly. I would avoid any of those old buggers, (like the '55 I have) just for that reason. I think the better cowl started around '61.

You'll get used to working with whatever panel you end up with. Having a cowling that doesn't take half the day to get all the screws back into is worth the price of admission in my opinion.

gb

is your super cub for sale?

Visibility over the nose is something you adapt to fairly quickly, so to me wouldn't be an issue affecting sale.

What WOULD be an issue to me is the old T-Bar control setup. I just went through this with my 170.

All the older Cessna aircraft have a T shaped control column behind the instrument panel. One leg of the T connects to the pilot yoke, the other to the copilot yoke. Problem is that this arrangement blocks putting anything with any depth in the center of your instrument panel---like radios for example.

The later airplanes have a Y shaped center yoke, which permits center stack radio arrangements. These controls also place the control yokes in a position closer to the pilot's legs, which is why the older Cessnas have a yoke that is a loop, extending DOWN from the control column, and the later ones have a yoke that extends UP from the column. This lower column also permits the installation of the "standard T" arrangement of basic flight instruments, which is impossible in the older airplanes.

If twas me, and I even THOUGHT I might consider an IFR panel, I wouldn't consider one of the older airplanes, unless you want to do a lot of shuffling of the instrument panel. The later ones are sooooo much easier to get things to fit...

But, there are other differences that may be more important to you. Everyone is ga ga over the very early 180's, and they do fly nice, but structurally, they aren't as stout as the later ones.

Lots of other criteria in any case.

MTV

patrol guy wrote:is your super cub for sale?

I guess when it comes right down to it everythings for sale huh? I have a pretty nice plane now. Always wanted a 180. I'm afraid of what happened to a friend of mine. He found a buyer for his plane then the deal he was working on another plane fell through. He ended up with nothing. For what Supercubs are selling for I know once this is gone I'd never be able to afford another one like it. Plus I hate paying sales tax With trades it is minimized or eliminated. You can PM if you want

Steve

Joe Stancil has a website, I think it is skywagons.com In there is a section that gives all the dif's in 180/185's over the years, by year. You might even be able to put joe's favorites in your search engine to get you there.

My understanding, alot of people prefer the early years for a better (lighter)feel of flying. I have a '56, and my dad has '79, and there is a definate difference. I have had 3 '56's, and think they are great. I would say fly each, and make up your own mind.

I have the pponk eng. which I think is a BIG plus. Can carry anything I want.

Gary

shortfielder wrote:Joe Stancil has a website, I think it is skywagons.com In there is a section that gives all the dif's in 180/185's over the years, by year. You might even be able to put joe's favorites in your search engine to get you there.

My understanding, alot of people prefer the early years for a better (lighter)feel of flying. I have a '56, and my dad has '79, and there is a definate difference. I have had 3 '56's, and think they are great. I would say fly each, and make up your own mind.

I have the pponk eng. which I think is a BIG plus. Can carry anything I want.

Gary

Gary is yours the one for sale on Barnstormers? Looks like a nice airplane.

gb

Yes, and I think it is.

shortfielder wrote:Yes, and I think it is.

Gary we chatted last year when I was looking at a 56 in Texas. Hopefully you'll still be in the 180 scene.

Steve


PS. I'd trade for that one!

I have a 54 with the avion panel mod, and the panel isn't what blocks the view in mine, it is the cowl that I am usually trying to see thru when taxiing.

Lance

[quote="cabinflyer"]To All,

I've been approached by some to trade my PA-18 for an older C180. I was reading the International 180 website and it mentioned in 1959 they changed the panel. They also said this change resulted in a higher panel, thus poorer forward visibility, which I understand is a matter of perception. I thought any pre 61 panel essentially was the same basic shape, just arraigned differently. The only 180 I've flown is a 56 model. I thought it had a great view out the front, rivaling the one I had in my 53 C170. (it did have a 10" tail wheel).

So the question is which panel gives the best visibility? I'm looking at a 58 and a 59 model (go figure nothing comes easy for me) I haven't seen either one yet. Obviously there are other factors to consider, just want to know technically where the cut off was.



I've got a 56 180- basically a 180 with a nose wheel. When I got it it had that radio space on the bottom which was the norm until the late 1950's.
I did a panel like a 1959 182 with a center stack radios. The "T" control column behind the panel. I later received a 185 "U" control column in a trade. I did a field approval -although I've seen quite a few done without
anything other than a logbook entry. The Avion panel STC is great but delivery takes for ever. Late model Cessna control yokes really look good .
Good lighting is a bit of challenge -a Dennis Ashby glare shield works good.
While you've got the windshield out is a good chance to do the panel like you want. I'd do the Electricial panel with all new wiring for everything.
Been there done that. I've got pictures-paperwork etc. contact me if anyone is interested at [email protected] Bill Reid

182 STOL driver wrote:......I later received a 185 "U" control column in a trade. I did a field approval -although I've seen quite a few done without
anything other than a logbook entry. The Avion panel STC is great but delivery takes for ever. ...........

A friend of mine has a "U" shaped control column & a set of Avion panels (LH,RH, & lower) that came with a 180 he bought, all in new unused condition. He's not gonna use them so they're for sale. If anyone's interested, PM or email me for his phone number. His 180 (a 54 model) is kinda sorta for sale also.
Oh yeah, "FS 180 & 180 stuff" (don't zap me Zane!)

Eric

I did go and see the 59 180 today. Lance I think you're right the cowling is the big obstacle. I didn't say that 56 I flew had a 10" tailwheel. I would've never guessed, but that might have raised the tail up enough to give better forward visibility. Snow storm was moving in so we never got a chance to fly it. If the cowlings are all the same once in the air that should be the same too.

Steve