Darn,

When this thread appeared to be heading south, I kinda' checked out and didn't see the part about our fearless leader having a birthday.

Happy Belated Birthday Zane !!!

BTW, Some users (not mentioning names) may want to follow the old adage POTAAYOR (piss off the admin at your own risk);-)

Yeah, Happy Birthday!

Since I haven't figured out how to embed a video in the posting, here's the birthday link. Enjoy.


http://tv.jubii.co.uk/video/iLyROoaftMjy.html

GumpAir wrote:

AntiCub wrote:I just called Avemco this morning to suspend my insurance for the winter. But at least I have the heated hanger now!

Phil

Damn... You're missing out on the best flying of the year up there.

Gump

Don't remind me...
That's why I just ordered plans for this http://www.doubleeagleairplane.com/
Aught to be a real kick on skis

Phil

One point that hasn't been mentioned again here is DO NOT, under any circumstances, duct heat from a combustion heater into the cabin of your airplane to try to warm IT up. That is, unless you are using a Herman Nelson, in which case the combustion gases don't go out the heat hoses.

Combustion products include huge amounts of moisture, and you'll do a lot of damage by sticking a Red Dragon heat hose into the cockpit to warm it up a bit.

I've had to pre-heat many times away from electricity. For years I did so with a catalytic heater, I've now got a Northern Companion, I've used a Red Dragon, and a Honda generator. They all suck, frankly, but in very different ways.

The generators won't start if THEY are cold, by the way, so figure on bringing them inside where you're sleeping. Also, plan on a LONG time for them to do ANY good, like several hours in very cold temps, PARTICULARLY if all you have for engine heat is a small heat pad on the oil pan.

Frankly, I now prefer the Northern Companion over the Honda Generator. That generator is bulky and kind of heavy, and won't start if the temp is around zero. That's when the flying is just getting good....

MTV

It appears this has been pretty well discussed , but for my two cents I just installed a brand-new o200 in my taylorcraft and had one of the reif Turbo XP systems installed it has the pad type as well as the cylinder band heaters. And I think it is excellent, I previously had the hot pad that Bubba is talking about, and it is great as well. But I don't think it is as efficient. Just takes longer to get heat up into the cylinders when just using the pad heater it was roughly 25°. Last week, and I had my oil up to 60° and the cylinders were at 56. After 45 minutes.
Also, I use one of the little Honda EU 2000 generators I have been able to start mine at eight below zero, yes you have to crank on it a few times. This is because I have been told that the Honda has a shutoff switch in case of low oil pressure. So when the oil is extremely cold. You have to crank and crank approximately 8 or 10 times, depending on the temperature until you establish an oil pressure to trip this pressure switch, which turns on the ignition to the generator.

At the last JC fly in, I watched three people go to start their planes and noticed a lot of frost on their wings and windshiels. It was arround 35 at the time. Their answer was to start up cold and taxi to the opposite side of the ramp to face the upcoming sun then shut down and waight for the frost to melt.

After the melt they sarted up again and took off. What is wrong with this picture. Maybe to cold starts. Not too smart.

Tim

Personally I never start my plane unless I intend to take off with it. As far as the Frost issue, one person can turn a plane into the sun without ever having to start their engine. I personally use heat on my engine at anything under 40. Today, it was 26, and I heated my plane for about an hour it fired on the third blade with no priming or anything. The case was 60° and the cylinder showed around 70 with the oil being about 58. Thanks to my trusty point-and-shoot thermometer, I sure am liking my reif heater

qmdv wrote:At the last JC fly in, I watched three people go to start their planes and noticed a lot of frost on their wings and windshiels. It was arround 35 at the time. Their answer was to start up cold and taxi to the opposite side of the ramp to face the upcoming sun then shut down and waight for the frost to melt.

After the melt they sarted up again and took off. What is wrong with this picture. Maybe to cold starts. Not too smart.

Tim

I used to see this all the time at JC during the 180/185 fly-in and I always cringed. However, this may not be as bad a technique as it seems.

IF the OAT is 35 at 7am, it may well have been 38 or so at 5am, as it often reaches it's minimum just after sun-up, long before the sun gets over the ridge. Engine oil usually lags the actual temperature by an hour or two as the temp slowly cools during the night if conditions are calm, so the oil temp likely was around 38 to 40 at the time the OAT read 35. This is a reasonable minumum for an unheated cold start.

IF the pilots had waited at idle power until they had needle movement on the oil temp before adding taxi power to move to the sunny side to melt the frost, they likely did no damage whatsoever to their engines, and definitely would not have done two cold starts because the engine had time for the oil temp to come off the peg and taxi-ing even 100 feet would have generated enough heat so that the engine would have been reasonably warm an hour later for the second start.

Those are two big IF's, however, and I have seen many pilots fire up, wait less than a minute, and use 2000 RPM or more to break loose and taxi across the strip. This is definitely in the category of engine abuse!
LET THAT SUCKER IDLE FOR SEVERAL MINUTES IF IT'S THAT COLD!

Rocky

ya agree totally heating is so easy nowdays with a gen or outlet when in dout plug it in

I plugged in my 115v patch heater for the first time this weekend. It works very nicely...about 45 minutes and the whole oil pan was warm to the touch, but only from about 48 F.

Anybody know what kind of wattage these things draw? 40w? Could my pet hamster run it with his wheel?

mine draws 600 watts total 200 at the pan and 100 per cylinder it is the large model
http://www.reiffpreheat.com/product.htm

Whatever happened to the light bulb under the cowl and a blanket? or is that just a poor red neck thing?

What ever happened to putting a couple blow torches in a length of stove pipe? I've never tried it, and a lot of things are easy until you try to do them, but it looks amazingly simple and fairly effective.

I have no doubt that electric heating systems are superior, but even I fly to airports that don't have electricity. A couple plumbers pots and a bit of pipe is a whole lot lighter and cheaper than a generator, plus you wouldn't have to listen to a generator drone on while you're drinking your coffee.