This could be kinda fun...

http://www.flir.com/uploadedFiles/0906- ... Sx_web.pdf

The camera looks pretty small, but it's only a camera. You still have to hook it up to a video display of some sort. And, to me that's the biggest annoyance, because cockpit real estate is so scarce.

I have to admit I like the idea, though. I used to be immortal and therefore afraid of nothing, but the older I get, the more things scare me. Something like that might be a real life saver if you lose the engine at night.

Mmmmm.... Mount the camera on your football helmet and attach one of those tiny LCD screens to the face mask over one eye! Bet that would be fun sneaking up on things at night!

Cool technology.... one thing to remember though: The camera at IR cannot look through anything but air. No pexiglass, no real glass.... etc.
Attended a pre-season meeting on fire fighting last week and they demo'd a low cost IR camera mounted in the nose of an Aero Commander. It simply attaches to the center of an inspection plate (with a hole in the center). Looks right through smoke, haze etc.
They used a simple car DVD screen mounted to the right side of the cockpit for viewing. Camera was supplied by FLIR.

I havn't seen anyone wearing a pair of these on the slopws yet, if so I plan to steer clear of them! I wonder how they'd work flying?

http://www.reconinstruments.com/

The FLIR website gives no clue to price. From the EAA website, I gleaned that the EVSx and possibly some accompanying stuff (they give the weight as 1 lb) goes for $3495.

Under $200 for the camera, they would have me hooked like the ATCxK cameras did. Under $1000, I would probably nudge and poke for a few weeks and then take the lure, like I did for the Sony HD camcorder. At $3500, I'd rather upgrade to WAAS or have a SL30 or ...

I chatted with a Flir rep at a meeting a few weeks ago. He said that they will be coming out with some consumer grade stuff that is well under $1000. He wouldn't elaborate, but if so, this may be some interesting products to watch for.

tom

http://www.navtv.com/product/102/pathfi ... wProduct=1

If you got $3500 jingling around and are willing to promise to be a good citizen and to use only for the benefit of all.
For $2500, you get the base model missing out on a $300 bracket, 3 other ways of looking at the image and a 2x zoom.

-Dick

It would be cool if ya could use the screen on your gps to view... Then all I'd need is the $3500..

If your talking a thermal imager (i.e. it sees heat) it is going to be BIG bucks, if your talking just night vision not so much.


MONEY

93K,

Nope, these little gizmos are indeed infrared imagers, NOT night vision. FLIR has developed a new technology which permits them to produce lower powered units for a LOT less money, like these.

Personally, I can't imagine what you'd use these for, other than to convince yourself to go somewhere or do something you shouldn't actually be doing anyway. I'm betting these things would increase the bravery factor significantly.

In a G-V on an instrument approach to Aspen with two crew--maybe. In a single pilot environment....close to the ground....in restricted visibility....really bad idea. And, if visibility isn't restricted, why would you need one of these things?

I'd rather have night vision goggles, my own self.

MTV

A few years back, a guy shot a Highway Patrol Trooper here in Nevada, then tried to hide out out in the desert. The Navy boys found his fire standing out like a sore thumb, with some kind of FLIR system. They could see his fire and him sitting by it from way up at altitude I guess, and they cuffed him that first night out, I heard. I think they might be good for other search and rescue stuff tho, or ya could use one for spotting cattle, horses, coyotes etc. or maybe counting deer, antelope, lions etc.
It would be fun to play with, and maybe a guy could eventually make a buck or two with one, but think I'll just buy gas instead... ha..

Oh, there are applications, for sure. The primary one these things are being promoted for in general aviation, though are "seeing in the dark and restricted visibility".

There's a local who has a contract to look at sugar beet piles a couple times a week during the winter. He uses a pretty old IR camera, though, which is aimable. These are intended to be hard mounted, with a view forward.

I talked to the FLIR folks about a trainable version, and they were pretty specific that a trainable mount would quadruple the cost, and they're not going there at the moment.

The full out IR units that FLIR makes are really pretty amazing, but the field of view on these things is generally pretty narrow, so searching large areas is pretty impractical.

Really interesting technology, though, and this advance of lower cost units is bound to open up some markets.

MTV

I have a friend who is an avionics tech on the predator UAV's in Iraq. They apparently have a LOT of interesting capabilities built into those toys, all of which are megabucks for the taxpayers. But everything slowly and steadily trickles down to the consumer level. Lithium cel phone batteries were hellaciously expensive originally, and all of us R/C model airplane guys were drooling over them. Now you can buy a little lithium rechargable battery that will run a small model airplane for half an hour for $9.95.

The IR stuff and thermal image stuff will sooner or later come down to a reasonable price. Look at the little "spy cameras" and eavesdropping equipment you can buy for $20 or $50 nowadays. This is stuff that the CIA and KGB spooks had to keep secret on pain of death 20 years ago.

Like the Coyote said, there needs to be a GPS screen interface for all this stuff. Actually, there ought to be one multi-function screen in the panel, which can be switched between several data input sources, GPS, mapping, IR, night vision, porno movies, whatever. I know that the megabuck Garmin 1000 glass cockpit stuff is already approaching this, but I'm talking about something less complex... the DVD player screen out of a minivan hooked up to a small "palm pilot" computer processor and solid state memory chip, and with several standard USB or RS232 inputs. And for GOD's sake a real QWERTY touch screen keyboard instead of having to mash down on the same !()$(*%^ micro-button 500 times to get to the letter K !

All that stuff is currently available in several forms. A screen is a screen, although inputs do vary some. Nevertheless, if it's not made by Garmin, it'll pretty much accept most normal inputs. A laptop will display the output of these devices easily.

The problem with little airplanes is where do you PUT that screen? Where to put it, where it's practical to use, that is.

For a screen to be really useful, it needs to be larger than the average GPS display, I'd think. And there are lots of medium size screens around for not that much money.

The Gulfstreams with IR have it displayed on a HUD, I believe. That would solve a lot of location issues.

MTV

There is a product, the Ifly700 that is produced by AdventurePilot.com that is a moving map, GPS overlayed on sectionals. It has a Video input, and while I was thinking of its uses in tailwheel aircraft with limited vis over the nose, It would do well in this case too. 7 inch screen should be usable, and it has the capability to display IFR approaches and they are working on geo referencing the approach plates for moving map capability on those as well. Taxi diagrams are in there too, I think. Interesting to look at...At least the single screen could be used for all phases of flight.


KB

Didn't GM have a HUD/IR set up in some of their high end cars about 10 years ago? I always thought it would be fun to scrounge one from a wrecking yard and try and adapt it to airplane use.

Bombing around in the dark on the deck, blacked out, terrorizing coyotes and boaters... Life would be good!

Gump

mtv wrote:93K,

Nope, these little gizmos are indeed infrared imagers, NOT night vision. FLIR has developed a new technology which permits them to produce lower powered units for a LOT less money, like these.

Personally, I can't imagine what you'd use these for, other than to convince yourself to go somewhere or do something you shouldn't actually be doing anyway. I'm betting these things would increase the bravery factor significantly.

In a G-V on an instrument approach to Aspen with two crew--maybe. In a single pilot environment....close to the ground....in restricted visibility....really bad idea. And, if visibility isn't restricted, why would you need one of these things?

I'd rather have night vision goggles, my own self.

MTV

MTV - as a couple of folks have already mentioned, something like this could be very helpful in an emergency situation in low vis conditions ... such as night-time engine-out, icing, closing weather, or in any other situation where you've got to get on the ground NOW! ... and worrying about whether you shoulda been there in that situation, or not, is something to argue with yourself (and/or your insurance company) about later on, in another less stressful time and place. After all, the argument that any particular avionics, nav, and/or situational-awareness tool only helps a pilot fly where & when he has no business flying could have been (and most likely was) appied to just about every instrument and radio in anybody's panel, at one time or another in aviation history.

Another situation where FLIR could be a godsend is when you're already on the ground, at night, at a backcountry airstrip, and you have to get back to civilization in a hurry (somebody's sick or injured, or maybe the weather is expected to deteriorate the next day). Being able to see the trees, wildlife on the runway, etc. before you start the takeoff roll, or even during your roll but before committing to the rotation, could prove to be a lifesaver.

Ditto with being able to see the terrain out in front until you gain enough altitude to clear all known (or unknown) terrain. Kind of like how you'd use synthetic vision - except better (synthetic vision only shows the terrain, and not the critters).