Anyone here have a Gar Aero tailwheel on their 180/185? I've been thinking about getting one. I've got an 10" XP Mods t/w on there now, the Gar is about 1-1/2" bigger OD so should climb over stuff a bit better, plus it's a lot wider for better flotation in sand etc. The baby bushwheel kit has the same attributes, but it's about half again the price of the Gar ($1100 vs $750). The less expensive Gar is more attractive to me, esp since I don't really feel the need for the integral air bladder feature.

The BBW is STC'd but apparently the Gar is a field approval show. Anyone have an approved 337 I could use for "accepted data"?

Also, does the 3400 series t/w use the same fork as the 3200 series? I've got my t/w torn down now to clean & regrease as part of the annual, and it is set-up somewhat differently (with an big upper Timken bearing) than the 3200. I do see that the 8" 3200 fork is a different Scott p/n than the 8" 3400.

The primary differences between the Baby Bushwheel fork and the Gar Aero fork are the clearances between the fork and tire, and as you noted, STCd BBW and no approval for the Gar fork.

I know some folks have had rocks caught between the fork and tire on the Gar Aero setup. Whether that would be an issue in your application I don't know.

As to approval via field approval, first thing I'd do is get with an IA and have him run it by his Inspector. If the Inspector says yes, with previous FAs, or just yes, I might go for it. But without prior blessing from an Inspector, you may be wasting your time even typing messages....

MTV

3200 and 3400 forks are not the same.
I learned that the hard way when I bought a used kit that had the Gar Aero 3400 wide fork and not the 3200 (although the owner thought it was the 3200 fork). Anyways, I still have the Gar Aero 3400 wide fork in consignment at Stoddard's (http://www.stoddardairparts.com/parts.htm) in Anchorage.
If interested, make me an offer (I think Stoddard's is listing it for $250) and I'll send it to you. You'll still need the spacer and longer bolts, but those are cheap.

Also they're so common up here, there's no problem getting a 337 for it, at least in Alaska.

https://www.backcountrypilot.org/me/my- ... toid=14396

I'm sure you know this, but the AKBW baby bush tailwheel fork kit can be run with the ribbed tire and tube. It might be worth it to call Airframes Alaska and see if they will sell you the baby bushwheel fork kit with that tire and tube set up and not the actual bladder type baby bushwheel... That might drop the price since I think one of those baby bushwheel replacement tires is over $400.

FYI Seaplanes North no longer sells the gar aero TWs anymore. Went by there to pick one up a couple months ago and they said there manufacturer went way up on the costs.

Just buy the BushWheel kit and put a ribbed regular tire on it. It will wear like iron and the hardware is well proven as well as the paperwork is all approved an a done deal. By the time you're done with all the hassle of a field approval and not as good of a tail wheel as the BW, you will of just about spent as much as much for the BW. Somethings are just worth paying for upfront the first time. Ya, I bit my lip when I wrote the check for my ribbed tire BW. I look back and don't regret it one bit because IT'S WORTH IT!

robw56 wrote:I'm sure you know this, but the AKBW baby bush tailwheel fork kit can be run with the ribbed tire and tube. It might be worth it to call Airframes Alaska and see if they will sell you the baby bushwheel fork kit with that tire and tube set up .....

I did just that this morning. Gabe at Airframes Alaska got right back to me and said that yes, the ABW wide fork t/w kit is available with a "404 glider tire" (that's ABW-speak for a 400x4 ribbed tire). The esp good part is that the price for that kit is $696-- about $50 less than the Gar kit, AND it's STC'd. I think if I go for it, that's the route I'll take.

MTV, one possible reason for less tire clearance on the Gar Aero kit might be that the 400x4 tire is called out as 11-1/2" OD, while the baby BW is called out at 11". Could be that the 400x4 tire gives the BW fork a bit of a clearance issue too.

hotrod180 wrote:

robw56 wrote:I'm sure you know this, but the AKBW baby bush tailwheel fork kit can be run with the ribbed tire and tube. It might be worth it to call Airframes Alaska and see if they will sell you the baby bushwheel fork kit with that tire and tube set up .....

I did just that this morning. Gabe at Airframes Alaska got right back to me and said that yes, the ABW wide fork t/w kit is available with a "404 glider tire" (that's ABW-speak for a 400x4 ribbed tire). The esp good part is that the price for that kit is $696-- about $50 less than the Gar kit, AND it's STC'd. I think if I go for it, that's the route I'll take.

MTV, one reason for less tire clearance on the Gar Aero kit is that the 400x4 tire is called out as 11-1/2" OD, while the baby BW is called out at 11". Could be that the 400x4 tire gives the BW fork a bit of a clearance issue too.

That's good to know, thanks for checking it out and posting it here.

Ran Gar Aero on 180's. Mostly sand bars, grass, and beaches, no big rocks. Never hung any rocks in one that I recall. Made the Forest Circus happy because it didn't cut up the sod. The stock 8" is fine too, just sinks deeper in the soft stuff. Forward yoke and liberal use of the brakes and flaps takes the weight right off of it if need be. BBW is cool I guess but I wouldn't lose sleep if I couldn't swing it.

I bought my bastard child with 8:50's and a 10"xp, on the gravel bars here the tail would leave a trench axle deep. The 8:50 mains mostly worked ok but would sink in fairly deep and the tail wheel was an anchor.
Never dinged a prop dragging that through the rock though.
29's and a baby bushwheel I leave a compacted trail....no trenches.
If I was only going to do one end I would stick with the 8:50's and a baby bush wheel on the tail.
Picked up some pretty good horizontal dings with the 29's, they do float a lot better, but that's a lot of tire to get spinning on touch down. Touching down on the water first should be mandatory with bigger mains.

Terry wrote:.....If I was only going to do one end I would stick with the 8:50's and a baby bush wheel on the tail. ....

That's what I'm thinking. 850's and even 800's have worked out OK with most of the soft stuff I've encountered, but the tailwheel always sinks.

I remember talking to Canadian dude at the Orcas Island fly-in several years ago who had 600's or 700's on the mains, with a 400x4 Gar Aero on the tail. he said he landed on the beaches of Vancouver Island all the time, never had a problem with the smaller mains sinking in but the fat t/w was really a big improvement over an 8-incher.

hotrod180 wrote:
MTV, one possible reason for less tire clearance on the Gar Aero kit might be that the 400x4 tire is called out as 11-1/2" OD, while the baby BW is called out at 11". Could be that the 400x4 tire gives the BW fork a bit of a clearance issue too.

No, the clearance issues I referred to are between the sidewall of the tire and the fork. Look at one of each and you'll see what I mean. I know of a couple that have had that problem and won't use that fork again. Depends on your use, of course.

MTV

N300RE wrote:FYI Seaplanes North no longer sells the gar aero TWs anymore. Went by there to pick one up a couple months ago and they said there manufacturer went way up on the costs.

If Seaplanes North / Alaska Tundra Tires isn't selling the Gar Aero fork kit anymore, it's kind of a moot point.
And even if they were, the ABW kit with a 400x4 tire is less expensive.....plus it comes with an STC. Kind of a no-brainer.

I ran the Gar Aero mains and tailwheel for many years in my Skywagon. Never really had any problems. I recommend running 2 tubes in the tailwheel. Plenty of room inside the tire and adds alittle piece of mind having a backup tube back there.
Mike

RoughAir wrote:I ran the Gar Aero mains and tailwheel for many years in my Skywagon. Never really had any problems. I recommend running 2 tubes in the tailwheel. Plenty of room inside the tire and adds alittle piece of mind having a backup tube back there.
Mike

Interesting idea. How do you do that with only one hole for the stem?

Never heard of doing that before. Like Rob asked, where does the 2nd valve stem go?
It seems that when one tube goes flat, there wouldn't be enough air in the second one alone and you'd roll the tire off, have it slip and damage the valve stem, or something similar. Think if I go for it I'll stick to just one 400x4 tube.

.

What tube are you guys running on your 404 tire and wide Bushwheel fork ?
I just had one put on my Pacer , went out and did five landings and went to the hanger.
I was opening the hanger doors and heard the sounds of a failing tube - “ phisst”
Flat tire. I have the stock aero classic tube
I have heard some people use a Beaver Tube
Anybody got a part number for the beaver tube ?

ABI knows about the beaver tube and will give you part numbers or sell you one if you ask. They will include it when ordering if you ask as well.

Beaver tube, I thought that may be a belated april fools joke