Warning, this is long, but you just may learn something.

So I have just returned from a long weekend in Idaho.

Needless to say, from the smoke in the air, all of the new backcountry Lz's, my own trials and tribulations, Idaho and the many backcountry lz's are in a league of there own.

Honestly, after my own 30 plus years of living and flying around Alaska with my dad or whom ever, and now living and flyiing out of Truckee for the past almost 10 years, I was feeling pretty confident.

My recent trip to Idaho has brought me and my ego back to ground level and maybe even a bit below that.

I have never seen such rediculous places for landing strips....serioulsy!!!

One that comes to mind while flying over to Big Creek from McCall looked about 200 feet in length maybe...., for certain uphill and had 2 supercubs parked there with the wings pointing downhill for the total commited take off down hill for 200 feet that would send them out over the cliffs and over the river in a tight canyon surrounded by 9000' peaks. Who ever is landing there could only compete with Paul Kluas and what he is doing in AK. Unreal to see that. Has anyone seen this place?...you pass it on your way into Big Creek or Johnson.

So on with my story. Now having my very own experience into the Idaho Backcountry, all that I can say is you better be prepared!

DO NOT GO with out local knowledge of where you are intending to land. Period!

Many of the strips require you to land long or you will get caught in the down drafts, many of them require you to land short or you will end up in the sticks at the end. There are aircraft in balls of metal at almost all the strips it seems like.

Virtually all of the places we flew into where at the bottom (say around 4500- 5500') of the extremely tight canyons surrounded by 9000' peaks with downdrafts and crosswinds coming from every direction.

Thinking I had plenty of information prior to going into Big Creek, The few things I did not do: Get enough good local beta. Do not go into the Mts., at 230 in the afternoon like myself. Make certain to know where your touch down points are and make certain to do your low flyby for your own recon.

These are my 3 rules prior to landing anywhere always. Not so much the 230 part as I fly around the Mts., here in tahoe all day every day but Idaho is not the Sierras.

I came into Big Creek and should have touched down mid field but instead wanted to get the most out of the strip as I could (wrong) and end up getting caught in the sink/downdrafts at the end coming in (I am very lucky to even be writting this). I applied full power once I realized that I need to touch down mid field and not at the end on the down hill part (a flyby would have seen this) and
end up falling out of the sky from about 15'-20' up. I am very lucky as I could of balled up my aircraft. Instead, I only broke my nose gear, bent my fire wall and am now out of pocket a bunch of $$$ for a fix it job.

Bottom line no before you go and ALWAYS follow the 3 simple rules prior to going anywhere......obviously there are many more but these 3 can save your life.

1. Good local beta. Get your information
2. Always do a low flyby/drag
3. Where are my touch down points and why?

Getting out of Big Creek with my own ridiculous field repair is another story in itself as every pilot that came in and saw my predicament said I was crazy to fly the plane in the conditon it was. I basically had no nose gear to speak off and had to tie it off with ropes in every direction for the little bit of stability I could get out of it. The legendary Ray Arnold (Arnold Aviation) came in and I asked him of his opinion of my fix and he could only smile and say "I would take the wings off and put it on a truck". That response made my stomach turn into knots.

So what to do? Well the truck idea will keep my alive, cost me a ton of $$$ and all would be good. My fix it job and about 30 pilots telling me I am crazy to try and fly will save me a ton of $$$ if I make it or maybe total my airplane or even cost me my life......

Guess what option I took...talk about feeling like a bold pilot. (Something I have sworn I will not be) Well needless to say with everyone including the horses watching me take off out of Big Creek, I put my dad in the back to get all of the weight in the aft section of the plane as I knew I could get the nose up and off the ground and then take off. Simple wright? Well it turned out to be...I was again lucky.

So now its time to land in McCall. Simple....Dont let the nose well touch, make the best soft field landing I have ever made (thankfully McCall is paved and long) dont let the nose wheel touch. How much luck do I have left?

So we make it! Hurray!!! Mission accomplished wright?....Nope....

Many of the pilots we saw at Big Creek made it into McCall later that afternoon and saw that we had made it. They said awsome you made it. McCall is a great place to get it fixed, you can drive home from here.

Drive home?

We told them we were going to continue on to Minden....All they could do was shake there head and ponder how stupid we must really be?

We went into McCall air and did a thourough look over with there own mechanices and they said the engine mount looked ok and as that was my big concern. Having the engine fall off while limping to Minden would not have been a good thing....

Well again, feeling confident about our fix it job (I will post pics of it here) and against everyones opinions in McCall we took off with almost IFR conditons thanks to the smoke, on two wheels, pops in the back for the CG to be in the aft and we where off....

IFR type conditons almost the entire 4 hours home. All you could see was down and infront maybe 5 miles at best. I felt we were flying in a white box.

The experience has not ended yet.....

I have choosen to get it to Minden as I have a great mechanic there. This was where I wanted to get to while in Big Creek, pondering how that was going to happen.

So we approach Minden and listen to the ATIS only to hear wind is 240 @ 18, peak gust 26. My thoughts go into what the ^*^&^%#@#. Great, another challenge. How much luck do I have left? Now I have to land with a substantial crosswind, no nose wheel and my palms feel as though I am holding a sponge full of water.

To end this long post, I stuck the landing in Minden on one tire, then settled the 2nd, kept the nose in the air and drove over to Hutt Aviation and turned the plane off. We made it! I jumped out unloaded the plane, tied it up and immiediatly drank a couple cold frosty treats.....Mission complete.

I hope that by reading this post, you can learn from my very own mistakes and maybe share some of your own hair raising experiences. Many of us are good at reporting the good stuff and our egos dont let us discuss the misshaps....

This was my misshap that I can only hope will prepare someone to keep them safe from this happening to them.

After a bit of knowledge I have come to find out that most pilots flying for a part 91 or 135 up there has dinged up more than one aircraft. Idaho is for real and most likley one of the most challenging places to fly and land anywhere in the US. I say that in confidence.

No before you go........

wow...

...perhaps a delete .....before the FEDS read this??

z3skybolt wrote:wow...

...perhaps a delete .....before the FEDS read this??

Just don't post your name or N#, or photos of your N#. I have no idea who aktahoe1 is.

I'm curious to see photos of the fix.

The biggest thing you did wrong, in my opinion, was to put your Dad in the back. I think that everyone has the right to injure or kill themselves (another opinion), but that right doesn't include others. You should have put Dad in a rental car and rocks in the back.
I too want to see the pictures, but I would ensure there were no identifiable marks shown on the pictures.

ohhhhhhhh thats why we're not flying today

Dad would not take no for an answer and our thought was, weight in the rear. With Dad having close to 20,000 plus hours of his own, I was listening more than talking. We rocked his seat back and then once we had the power and nose up he was in postion up front back to normal.

For the landing he rocked his seat back as well.

obviously our concern was a prop strike and much more and then my expense would be a new engine, etc.....

Again, I feel as though this is not something I would ever recommend and feel pretty damn stupid it happened in the first place.

Great learning lesson for all.

Great, now to worry about the feds.....

Not certain how to post a photo here on this page....

I just put a photo in the main gallery.....

One last thing to think about.

There have been 4 to my knowledge, balled up aircraft at Big Creek this summer alone.

In the live to tell forum you can read about the mooney that took out a truck a week prior to us traveling there.

Not that this means anything, just more beta for all.

One pilot that lost his plane there, luckly not his life had over 20,000 hours of flying in the mts.

!

CAVU

aktahoe1,

Great story, I'm glad it all turned out ok.

I added the picture to your post.

Mark

Great story, aktahoe! I'm glad you and your father made it home safe. I hate to say it (but in a productive way), I enjoy reading stories like this being that I'm still a new pilot and I happen to being learning to fly up here in Idaho. I love to learn from other peoples mishaps (I'm sure I'll have mine someday, well I hope not actually!!) and always think and or try not to put myself into the same perticaments others have gone through. Like you said and I will gladly take your advice "know before you go!!" One tool that I think works really well when studying some of the backcountry strips before I go out there with friends or just looking at strips I'd like to go to someday, is GOOGLE EARTH. Most of the Idaho backcountry strips are on GOOGLE EARTH and you get a good idea what to expect when approaching the strips and what the surrounding terrian might be like. Again, glad you guys made it back home!! The plane can always be fixed.

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Dad, Lets go Flying? Dad where are you?

Glad to hear you made it home safe. We were keeping our fingers crossed for you.

Sometimes lessons get taught in a very humbling manner, glad you could get something out of this (other than a hefty repair bill.)

I enjoyed chatting with you, best of luck.

I believe the strip you are referring to is the Wiley Ranch. It's about 600', with a 22 degree upslope. That was probably a 170 on the ground. Stellar pilot.

John

Read it and I might learn something? You make one bad landing and then bust any number of FAR's. Yep I sure learned something. I learned you're a moron.

WOW, Glad you said it Bonanza Man...
I thought the new guy was going to have to say how stupid this was. Put your life on the line as well as your dads, to save a few bucks...the only luck you had was this happening at big creek instead of the next strip you were headed too. I am glad no one had to pull you out of the wreckage and put themselves in danger.

I had to check the calendar......

Nope. April fools was quite a while ago

I'm not sure about flying outta' Big Creek with a busted nose gear but I know the name calling is wrong !

Bonanza Man wrote:I learned you're a moron.

At least he has the balls to share a somewhat embarrassing experience instead of casting judgment from the comfort and anonymity of his lazyboy.

I like to hear tales like this, good idea or bad, now he knows he can rig the busted up nose gear in a pinch. What if he was at a strip with no roads? Walk 70 miles or soft field takeoff? And like he said, his dad wasn't exactly an innocent passenger uninformed of the dangers. He knew exactly the score.

The legendary Ray Arnold (Arnold Aviation) came in and I asked him of his opinion of my fix and he could only smile and say "I would take the wings off and put it on a truck".

That sounds just like him too!
Thanks for sharing.