I’m planning on flying from Boise,ID to Warwick,NY this March. Any insight as to the best route (safest) over and through the mountains would be appreciated. Does it make sense to head south toward Albuquerque and then skirt the top of Texas (long way) or would it be better to overfly Rt 84 to Rt 15 through Utah and Wyoming.? I haven’t done this before, I’m trying to get a handle on the gotchas. Posted this on the Maule Pilots Forum as well.
Thanks in Advance

I have flown light GA airplanes from east to west and back at least a dozen times over the last 20 years. The best plan is to clear your schedule for maximum flexibility. Wait until there is a window to depart and make some good progress and accept that you might be grounded for a day or two over the course of your journey. I always plan my layovers at places where I don't mind sitting some weather out.

It is not necessary to fly way down south to avoid bad weather and high country. I usually plan a route that is more or less direct with a stop or two that seem interesting. This type of flight has gotten a whole lot easier with the availability of GPS, glass cockpits and tablet apps. Foreflight with the Stratus 2 is a VERY handy tool for picking up weather and traffic while en-route. There is a lot of merit to the old saying "time to spare, go by air", but trips like these are a lot of fun and give a great sense of accomplishment once completed.

I agree with Scolopax. Get Foreflight on an IPad or some other flight planning mapping program and draw a line from point A to B. Then, rubber band that line to avoid the highest terrain, and to accommodate fuel stops and overnights.

And, yes, be prepared to be delayed a place or two. Spring weather can change rapidly, but once you're out of the mountains, you'll have lots of options to set down.

One piece of advice: Really practice your crosswind technique.....you may have a need for that in spring.

MTV

mtv wrote:I agree with Scolopax.

One piece of advice: Really practice your crosswind technique.....you may have a need for that in spring.

MTV

X2 on the xwind!

Route 15 as far as Idaho Falls, but then track toward West Yelowstone and up to Bozeman before turning east. I use this route lots. I have been warned away from Monida Pass south of Dillon. Apparently the weather moves in there fast, and you might not see it coming. A friend in Twin Bridges with local knowledge offered me this.

If, on the day you leave, the weather looks better to the south, then possibly a trip through Cokeville WY will offer a better option.

From there, you're pretty much home free. My experience in the Great Lakes region is summer time only, and I am a bit intimidated by the stories of storms out there. Hopefully a BCP member who has local knowledge will share.

The Allegheny Mountains seemed pretty tame to me flying over them in summer, but again, I'm sure some locals will help.

As the others have said, in-cockpit graphical weather depictions are your best tool. Watch trends with the animation feature. Going east is a bit tougher, because you're travelling with the systems, but don't hesitate to land and let a system get ahead of you, then follow it. Weather behind a cold front will generally offer the best flying weather.

Thanks for the replies I do use fore flight already, I'll look into the stratus 2, I will definately allow plenty of time and enjoy the trip. I flew with Rick from Montanna by Air not to long ago and I'll fly with him some more before I do the cross country. He's in Cut Bank, great Maule Specific instruction and plenty of wind for practice. I'll also check out the suggested routes and appreciate the tips on the pass and weather fronts. Looking forward to making the flight.
Bob

Pinecone wrote:The Allegheny Mountains seemed pretty tame to me flying over them in summer

I flew over the Allegheny Mountains west of Luray Caverns, VA on the first day of this year. There was a 30-40 knot headwind that made the crossing pretty challenging. We flew through quite a bit of rotor that beat us up pretty bad. The territory looks absolutely beautiful though. I hope to go back and explore by land. Does anyone know if there are any good airstrips with fishing, hiking, camping etc...?

Pinecone wrote:Route 15 as far as Idaho Falls, but then track toward West Yelowstone and up to Bozeman before turning east. I use this route lots. I have been warned away from Monida Pass south of Dillon. Apparently the weather moves in there fast, and you might not see it coming. A friend in Twin Bridges with local knowledge offered me this.

If, on the day you leave, the weather looks better to the south, then possibly a trip through Cokeville WY will offer a better option.

From there, you're pretty much home free. My experience in the Great Lakes region is summer time only, and I am a bit intimidated by the stories of storms out there. Hopefully a BCP member who has local knowledge will share.

The Allegheny Mountains seemed pretty tame to me flying over them in summer, but again, I'm sure some locals will help.

As the others have said, in-cockpit graphical weather depictions are your best tool. Watch trends with the animation feature. Going east is a bit tougher, because you're travelling with the systems, but don't hesitate to land and let a system get ahead of you, then follow it. Weather behind a cold front will generally offer the best flying weather.

I have never heard that about Monida Pass, nothing much different about it that any other continental divide crossing other then it's more benign then most:real gradual and subtle. Your source most have hit it on a bad day, it's one of the easiest routes in my experience.

Heading to West Yellow and then Livingston through the park is a pretty scenic flight, and whatever it's doing in West is pretty much what it's doing on the other end. Jackson Hole through Sylvan Pass is another way "out", probably the most intimidating though, not my favorite. Cokeville route pretty easy not really scenic though compared to the other routes.

If the weather is cooperative, crossing on the north end is really easy and seems pretty safe.

I'd look at going Boise, Mallad City (KMLD), Kemmerer (KEMM), hit I-80 around Rock Springs, and head east toward Medicine Bow (80V). From there you've got it whipped. It's high country across that route, but the terrain isn't too ugly. The only time you'll be over much mountain terrain will be the 50-60 miles just west of Kemmerer. I just flew that route a couple weeks ago and it was a piece of cake at 11,500'. I had great weather and a tailwind going east. However, wind could be a deciding factor in March. I've been told that Wyoming is windy...

I think going the long way around the bottom would definitely be the alternate route. I've done that one several times as well, and there is just as much or more unfavorable terrain below you going that way...and it's a long way out of the way for you.

Ross

RWM wrote:If the weather is cooperative, crossing on the north end is really easy and seems pretty safe.

I'd look at going Boise, Mallad City (KMLD), Kemmerer (KEMM), hit I-80 around Rock Springs, and head east toward Medicine Bow (80V). From there you've got it whipped. It's high country across that route, but the terrain isn't too ugly. The only time you'll be over much mountain terrain will be the 50-60 miles just west of Kemmerer. I just flew that route a couple weeks ago and it was a piece of cake at 11,500'. I had great weather and a tailwind going east. However, wind could be a deciding factor in March. I've been told that Wyoming is windy...

I think going the long way around the bottom would definitely be the alternate route. I've done that one several times as well, and there is just as much or more unfavorable terrain below you going that way...and it's a long way out of the way for you.

Ross

X2 on Ross's recommended route. It also leaves you a good alternative to drop further south if needed.

Personally, I don't care for West Yellowstone route that time of year because of the typical variable weather, strong winds, lack of places to land, and deeper snow pack. I've lived and flown for many years in Southern Montana and Southeast Idaho and have experienced more than my share of unexpected adverse weather across that route, I reserve it for perfect conditions. I'd take Monida Pass any day over West Jellystone, the same as CG recommends since there are many more more towns with landing options if you stay in the valleys and near the highways.

blackrock wrote:

RWM wrote:If the weather is cooperative, crossing on the north end is really easy and seems pretty safe.

I'd look at going Boise, Mallad City (KMLD), Kemmerer (KEMM), hit I-80 around Rock Springs, and head east toward Medicine Bow (80V). From there you've got it whipped. It's high country across that route, but the terrain isn't too ugly. The only time you'll be over much mountain terrain will be the 50-60 miles just west of Kemmerer. I just flew that route a couple weeks ago and it was a piece of cake at 11,500'. I had great weather and a tailwind going east. However, wind could be a deciding factor in March. I've been told that Wyoming is windy...

I think going the long way around the bottom would definitely be the alternate route. I've done that one several times as well, and there is just as much or more unfavorable terrain below you going that way...and it's a long way out of the way for you.

Ross

X2 on Ross's recommended route. It also leaves you a good alternative to drop further south if needed.

Personally, I don't care for West Yellowstone route that time of year because of the typical variable weather, strong winds, lack of places to land, and deeper snow pack. I've lived and flown for many years in Southern Montana and Southeast Idaho and have experienced more than my share of unexpected adverse weather across that route, I reserve it for perfect conditions. I'd take Monida Pass any day over West Jellystone, the same as CG recommends since there are many more more towns with landing options if you stay in the valleys and near the highways.

Make that three of us. Monida Pass is a good one, and lots of low valleys and highways to follow......West Yellowstone to the east is all wild country for a looooong ways in March, and big rocks.

MTV

I'm glad others have contributed here, because it sounds like I was incorrect about Monida. If you look west of Monida, there's a lot of high terrain, so it made sense that weather coming out of that rugged area could be a surprise. Radar imagery over mountainous areas can be inaccurate, and that lent to the argument in my mind.

True to the intent of a forum like this, the knowledge being shared here is benefiting more than just the OP. Thanks!

I'm not the sharpest crayon in the box but I'm not sure what going over Monida gets you. You still would then have to turn east and fly over a bunch of terrain including most of whats around West Yellowstone. I'm a low time pilot and sometimes a dumb pilot but I'm pretty much in agreement with picking a mostly direct route. I'd go Boise, Idaho Falls ish, Alpine ish, cross the Wyoming range through Mcdougal Gap , Marbleton, then Atlanic City ish to swing south of the Wind River Range then head towards Casper ish. By that point you are east on the big rocks and can take whatever route you want.

Farthest east I have been is the Wind River Range but I have flown the route from Idaho Falls to Marbleton a bunch of times, several of those in lousy weather, and it was not a problem but I have a pretty high tolerance for being close to terrain. The Cokeville/Kemmerer route is a good one if having a highway under you makes you feel better. Lots of different routes that will work well. I'm envious of your trip.

A clarification on Monida. You are correct, it can be bad there, very bad. But if it is bad, so is the West Yellowstone route. Same with road conditions. I once spent several nights stranded at the Spencer Bar due to winter conditions when driving from Butte to Idaho Falls.

In VMC conditions, however it is my preferred route Spring, Winter, and Fall. If I get forced down, I will be near civilization and there are many places to safely land. Not so the other route; there are very few options available when there is snow pack, and that is some seriously remote country as MTV alluded to. The WY airport is closed through about mid April, too due to snow.

On a clear CAVU day, sure you can go high, catch a tail wind and enjoy the scenery over any of the routes, but even at that, I'd hedge my bets to give myself more options that time of year. After the snow melts, it's a great flight and there are many more roads open and options available when using that route.

Between Boise and say Idaho falls, my personal preference is to stay over the highways so as to avoid being out of gliding distance from a road when traversing the lava fields year round. They would be like landing on a cheese grater and I fear a forced landing on that surface more than trees or water, just as an FYI.

My apologies if any of this sounds negative in any way, it isn't. It is just local knowledge that hopefully makes your flight safer and less stressful.

It sounds like a fun trip, enjoy.

whee wrote:I'm not the sharpest crayon in the box but I'm not sure what going over Monida gets you. You still would then have to turn east and fly over a bunch of terrain including most of whats around West Yellowstone. I'm a low time pilot and sometimes a dumb pilot but I'm pretty much in agreement with picking a mostly direct route. I'd go Boise, Idaho Falls ish, Alpine ish, cross the Wyoming range through Mcdougal Gap , Marbleton, then Atlanic City ish to swing south of the Wind River Range then head towards Casper ish. By that point you are east on the big rocks and can take whatever route you want.

Farthest east I have been is the Wind River Range but I have flown the route from Idaho Falls to Marbleton a bunch of times, several of those in lousy weather, and it was not a problem but I have a pretty high tolerance for being close to terrain. The Cokeville/Kemmerer route is a good one if having a highway under you makes you feel better. Lots of different routes that will work well. I'm envious of your trip.

Whee, going Monida, to Dillion to Twin Bridges to Bozeman to Livingston to Billings following the highways keeps you over valleys, roads, and civilization. If weather is encountered or you need to land for any reason, there are many options available, that just aren't available on some of the direct routes. We were just point out that traversing remote country when there is a lot of snowpack means very few landing options are available.

No doubt you've been over remote terrain and uncomfortable, looking for what if's. Any flight is a lot more enjoyable when we know we can safely land if needed and have options; that was the intent of the Monida route, should the OP choose the northern route.

blackrock wrote:

whee wrote:I'm not the sharpest crayon in the box but I'm not sure what going over Monida gets you. You still would then have to turn east and fly over a bunch of terrain including most of whats around West Yellowstone. I'm a low time pilot and sometimes a dumb pilot but I'm pretty much in agreement with picking a mostly direct route. I'd go Boise, Idaho Falls ish, Alpine ish, cross the Wyoming range through Mcdougal Gap , Marbleton, then Atlanic City ish to swing south of the Wind River Range then head towards Casper ish. By that point you are east on the big rocks and can take whatever route you want.

Farthest east I have been is the Wind River Range but I have flown the route from Idaho Falls to Marbleton a bunch of times, several of those in lousy weather, and it was not a problem but I have a pretty high tolerance for being close to terrain. The Cokeville/Kemmerer route is a good one if having a highway under you makes you feel better. Lots of different routes that will work well. I'm envious of your trip.

Whee, going Monida, to Dillion to Twin Bridges to Bozeman to Livingston to Billings following the highways keeps you over valleys, roads, and civilization. If weather is encountered or you need to land for any reason, there are many options available, that just aren't available on some of the direct routes. We were just point out that traversing remote country when there is a lot of snowpack means very few landing options are available.

No doubt you've been over remote terrain and uncomfortable, looking for what if's. Any flight is a lot more enjoyable when we know we can safely land if needed and have options; that was the intent of the Monida route, should the OP choose the northern route.

Thanks BR, I caught on to your Monida route after your last post and it does make a lot of sense.

.
Whichever route you end up choosing, please take a camera like a Go Pro and make a video for BCP . I'm sure I am not the only one who would love to see aerial views of these fabulous places being discussed. Have a safe trip !

I like the idea of keeping the roads close for a landing option I'm going to spend some time now. with maps and sectionals and watch the weather trends. I do have a gopro so I'll do my best at getting some nice video although I'm probably lacking in the videography dept. Thanks to all for the advice and to BCP for being a fantastic sight for back country minded pilots

bowie wrote:I like the idea of keeping the roads close for a landing option I'm going to spend some time now. with maps and sectionals and watch the weather trends. I do have a gopro so I'll do my best at getting some nice video although I'm probably lacking in the videography dept. Thanks to all for the advice and to BCP for being a fantastic sight for back country minded pilots

I have found that the battery life on a gopro is terrible when the camera is moving through cold air at 150 mph. A trick that worked out well recently is to tape some of those hand warmers on to the back of the case.

I did SLC to NJ a couple years ago and mostly followed the I-80 route. The cumulogranite clouds are mostly out of your way. Wyoming can get pretty windy, as you know. I stayed south of Chicago and just clipped Southern Cleveland. My first attempt did not work out as the weather turned out to be much worse than forecast so I had to wait for another opening. Was not going to force it. Foreflight on my iPad and flexibility were valuable tools for me. Good luck