Backcountry Pilot

[skybobb offline]

Split from thread "Bent Airplanes."
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A great thread and some real good stuff posted. I am taking a medical this coming thur. and I am already on a special issuance. I am sweating it because my flying is what gives me a reason to get up in the morning and If I loose my medical I will be a lost soul. I have been very fortunate to be able to fly, I shouldn't be able I don't have the money to have a 182 Cessna and fly into the beautiful backcountry of Idaho. I have worked and saved to be able to do it and it keeps me going. I love to share my love of flight with others. That is why I have all of my videos on you tube. That is why I fly others into Big Creek,Sulphur Creek, and others. I hope I will know when it is time to call it a day with my flying. I didn't start until I was 47 years old and so I am trying to catch up. I don't think I am a danger to myself or to others. I hope to keep my record in tact of never hurting anyone and not damaging an aircraft. Bob

[Green Hornet offline]

Bob,
If there is any reason that you have a specific concern regarding your medical failing. You may want to consider not taking it and let your ppl laspe. Then you could get a sport license. My understanding is that as long as you have never failed a medical for any reason you can get a sport license without a medical. You may have to get a different airplane but you still can have that reason to be enthused that I can relate to so well!
you may have done this already but if you are " sweating it" go to a regular MD to check the specific detail prior to your flight medical. BTW I got my PPL @56 years old so you are not alone!
Good Luck
Bill

[skymaule offline]

Bob,
Some excellent advice from Bill. I think we all have some apprehension when this time rolls around. You know every day is a gift from Jesus. It all rests on him. Every breath of air we breath, every dollar we spend. Same source. It's him. Not us. So don't worry. Be happy.

Mark

[hicountry offline]

Iceman, I'm with you! Hell of a stress reliever!
HC

[a64pilot offline]

If you examiner is worth a flip, he or she will look at you and tell you your'e not going to take this medical. I have that understanding with mine. Of course he cannot guarantee that I wouldn't pass, that's up the the medical review board, but he has been an ME for so long, if and when that time comes, I will take his advice. It couldn't hurt to try to have that understanding with your ME if possible.

[mauleace offline]

I am taking a medical this coming thur. and I am already on a special issuance. I am sweating it because my flying is what gives me a reason to get up in the morning and If I loose my medical I will be a lost soul.

I too have a Special Issuance medical. The hard part was getting it the 1st time. Now that I have it, it is no big deal to get it renewed each year povided that there has been no change in the Special Issuance condition. The FAA has come a long ways in issuing these. The process was a bit slow, but for the most part, the FAA was helpful and courteous. Dare I say, even empathetic.

So, if there has been no change in your condition and you have been seeing a regular physician you should be good to go. I don't know what your conditon is, but it is a good idea to see your regular MD and get a written statement from him of your current medical condition. This has great weight.

If your condition has changed, then I would read the regs, talk to OK City and get a plan before you see the AME. Legally, once there are only 3 outcomes that an AME can do.

1. Issue the certificate
2. Deny issuance
3. Defer to OK City

If the information you bring the AME is not complete, or he is willing to wait for another test, like a series of BP readings, he can only wait a week or so and then he has to make one of the 3 determinations.

So, if you want to see the AME as a regular MD, then don't fill out the form. Make an appointment, see the AME and get his opinion before you start the clock.

My issue was cancer. It was an automatic grounding, which I did not know. I was doing everything I could to beat it and now that I have, I continue to be seen every 90 days and have a variety of tests. So it is easy for me to document my condition to the FAA.

Get the current medical condition letter from your regular MD, it will smooth out the process.

[skybobb offline]

Thanks for the concerns and info, I had a bout with Prostate cancer about 10 years ago. then The doctors got my heart into de Fib durning a colonoscopy, while I was under anesthetic. That has caused the special issuance. I don't think there is any change. I have to take two meds.for it. I probably have no reason for the worry, but for me there is a lot a stake. I do appreciate all of your replies. Bob PS I would hate to have to part with old 9054November. I retrieved it from near death. It was an airport Queen.

[Green Hornet offline]

I am taking a medical this coming thur. and I am already on a special issuance. I am sweating it because my flying is what gives me a reason to get up in the morning and If I loose my medical I will be a lost soul.

I too have a Special Issuance medical. The hard part was getting it the 1st time. Now that I have it, it is no big deal to get it renewed each year povided that there has been no change in the Special Issuance condition. The FAA has come a long ways in issuing these. The process was a bit slow, but for the most part, the FAA was helpful and courteous. Dare I say, even empathetic.

So, if there has been no change in your condition and you have been seeing a regular physician you should be good to go. I don't know what your conditon is, but it is a good idea to see your regular MD and get a written statement from him of your current medical condition. This has great weight.

If your condition has changed, then I would read the regs, talk to OK City and get a plan before you see the AME. Legally, once there are only 3 outcomes that an AME can do.

1. Issue the certificate
2. Deny issuance
3. Defer to OK City

If the information you bring the AME is not complete, or he is willing to wait for another test, like a series of BP readings, he can only wait a week or so and then he has to make one of the 3 determinations.

So, if you want to see the AME as a regular MD, then don't fill out the form. Make an appointment, see the AME and get his opinion before you start the clock.

My issue was cancer. It was an automatic grounding, which I did not know. I was doing everything I could to beat it and now that I have, I continue to be seen every 90 days and have a variety of tests. So it is easy for me to document my condition to the FAA.

Get the current medical condition letter from your regular MD, it will smooth out the process.

Bob, I too have a special issuance that took me about a year to get for high blood pressure from Oklahoma City. The Maule Ace's advise is extremely important. I also get a letter from my personal MD who is a cardiac specialist. I have never had a heart problem but when the ME's see his approval stating that my BP is under control with a treadmill stress test with graphs, charts, etc, it carry's weight. I also supply BP readings for 60 days, blood test , and anything else I can think of prior to the ME visit. In other words a lot of data to make it not so much the ME'a decision. The reason he passes the decision to Oklahoma City is he really does not want to tell you no you can no longer fly. However if you know you will not pass then do not take the examine. If you fail you will not be able to get a Sport's License. The bottom line is you never have to "hang it up" if you don't want to but you will need to make the change to Sports flying.

[mauleace offline]

A lot of this depends on what your Special Issuance Letter says. Mine is a two year medical with annual update of the SI directly from OKC. I can actually submit my current condition report directly to OKC on the off years I don't need a medical exam. As long as I submit to them 90 days before the expiration of the SI, my 3rd class certificate is valid.

There is also a class of SIs that are AME issued with assistance from OKC. Basically that means that the AME can issue the certificate but OKC takes a look over the AME's shoulder. The link below has some valuable information.

But if nothing has changed, then you are probably good to go.


http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/hea ... eneral/si/

[Zzz]

Regarding flying Light Sport:

If you let your medical lapse with the intent to fly under the Sport Pilot/Light Sport Aircraft rules, can you begin to operate under those rules using your Private certificate? It doesn't seem like you'd need to get a Sport Certificate, given that your certification/training level theoretically supersedes Sport Pilot.

I would think you can just operate Light Sport Aircraft under those rules with the Private certificate. Am I wrong, or is this something that the FAA expressly prohibits? I can imagine that scenario too, as it would be simply be old pilots with lapsed medicals taking advantage of it.

[mtv offline]

Zane,

Nope, you are precisely correct. If you have a PPL or Commercial, or ATP, for that matter, you may at any time operate an LSA or E/LSA aircraft as a Sport Aircraft without a medical.

The critical thing is that you cannot have been denied or failed a medical. So, if it looks like you're not going to pass the next medical, don't go there.

a64,

You want to make certain you talk to your AME BEFORE the flight physical actually starts. Once you start filling out that application, according to AME's I've talked with about this, you have made application, and the AME must proceed with the exam.

Every flight physical I've ever taken, you walk into the office and the receptionist hands me an application. My understanding is that once you've filled that out, the exam is on, the doc can't just dispose of it, and pretend it didn't happen.

Some folks have a physical exam done BEFORE they take the flight physical, asking the (non AME) doctor to check for common disqualifiers like diabetes, heart, etc.

MTV

[Skylane offline]

Yep I'm sweating it! Due Feb next year. When the 182 sells, if there is such a thing with this market. I'll be going ultra light.

Rans s-4 or something as such.

C ya, Bub

[Green Hornet offline]

Z,
I think you are correct!
See Sport's Pilot

http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificate ... ements.pdf

http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificate ... ochure.pdf

It appears that if you have a PPl and "have not failed the medical examine then you can get a Sports license without a medical? What say you?

[mauleace offline]

It is also a very good idea to understand the AME guidance they are supposed to follow. The FAA does not have much faith in these guys for the most part. Some of this is deserved. The regs are complicated and the method of determination by the FAA is not completely clear. It is done on a case by case basis.

With my doctor, I had questions for him about the process, mostly to see if he really knew what to do. They screwed up my submittal and I waited not wanting to bug the FAA. But when I finally called the FAA, they suggested next time I call earlier to get a status report. To see if they had my submittals and if the initial review had been completed and did it appear to be complete.

Data, data, data, these beauracrats love data. Burry them in paper, valid good paper, but lots of it. I gave them every blood test, doctors' exam notes, imaging reports, surgery reports, I had. And I wrote a summary for them chronicling the entire process. A summary paragraph with dates, etc or each attachment.

And don't be afraid to call. I found the folks who answer the phones to be very helpful. But call OKC, not the region.

The FAA has come under some heat for being so slow and rigid in these medical issues. It is no wonder people lie on their medical certificate applicaitons. But the FAA has stepped up enforcement to include some jail time. I was thinking... in the 38 years I have had a piliot's license, I have never been asked by anyone for my license or medical. Only when I have gone for a new rating or BFR. So, I thought I would just fly and take my chances. After reading some of the stories about stings by the FAA and the prosecution of some of those who lied, I thought better of the idea.

I am glad I did, it was worth it. I am enjoying flying and plan on going as long as I can. Actually puts $5.60 a gallon fuel into perspective.

[Zzz]

It appears that if you have a PPl and "have not failed the medical examine then you can get a Sports license without a medical? What say you?

Bill, from those documents, and from what MTV says, it looks like you can operate an LSA with your PPL. There is no special "Sport Pilot license" that a previously certificated Private pilot has to get or qualify for, other than a current flight review.

So, with these things:

1. Private certificate
2. Current flight review
3. Drivers license

You can legally operate an LSA.

[Green Hornet offline]

Zane,
Agreed I just like other inputs so the advice is correct to anyone pursuing this approach. Now all we have to do it get Bub's Airplane sold!
Bill

[a64pilot offline]

OK, some of you will think these statements are a little dishonest, so be it.
1. do NOT use your ME as your regular doctor. That's what mine told me and he is not hurting for money, he's the older weatlhier Doctor type that owns a couple of hospitals and loves flying and pilots, so he is an ME for that reason. I assume if he is your regular doctor, he may know more than he wants to, or more than you want him to.
2. I'm sure MTV is precisely correct, that is once you fill out the form the ME has to complete the physical, and if it is completed, I'm sure it has to be sent to Oak city. I'm also sure that my ME if I all of the sudden came down with an un-waiverable condition would misplace mine. Have you never taken a check ride that turned into a training flight?, or was that a military only thing?, but you get my point.
3. Hang around with the old Crop Dusters, banner towers or whatever your older Commercial guy's do for a living where you live. They will tell you who to go to and who to stay away from for a Physical.
Now those are just my opinions. It would be entirely different if you were flying around congested areas with the back of the airplane full of paying passengers, but I assume your not, or at least I'm not.
If you are at all concerned about it and regularly fly with the same person, get them enough training so that if anything happened to you they could at least get to somewhere to land and get the airplane down safely.

[retired user offline]

OK, some of you will think these statements are a little dishonest, so be it.

Not at all, I agree completely !

We are playing their game by their rules. What you suggest is to know the rules and abide by them in order to continue to play. Simple as that.

I certainly don't want to be the one that goes through a S.I. with a new ME for instance, so, it would be best to seek out those knowledgable ME's that have some experience and also want to keep you in the game.

All of this is great advise.

I've always thought there is more danger on our two lane roadways, where cars are approaching each other head, routinely at 65mph and one or both drivers had have nothing more than a vision test up to four years prior. Of course it doesn't involve the evil airplane that seems to fall out of the sky on innocent people for no reason...

[skybobb offline]

Guys, I want to thank all of you for your help in my situation, but please don't sell my airplane just yet. Maybe work on finding someone to buy Skylane's plane first. Bob

[mauleace offline]

The medical certification process is based on voluntary compliance. The FAA is a bit like the IRS on this. If they catch you lying or withholding information on the medical certificate applicaiton, there will be consequences. The chances of getting caught are probably pretty slim. It would take an accident or some other event as your medical records are protected by privacy.

I had a friend who got a DUI before the FAA started checking driving records. Shortly after he got the DUI he got joined AA, got sober and became a real citizen. A couple years into his sobriety he renewed his medical, again not mentioning the DUI or the alcoholism. This time the FAA did the driver record search and discovered the DUI. He had been flying for 20 or 30 years, was commercial, instrument rated and was an A&P. The FAA revoked all of his certificates. He had to prove two years sobriety, completion on a substance abuse program before he could re-apply for a student pilot's certificate. He had to start from the beginning, throw out the log books and train complete the private pilots requirements to get his license back. I think they also fined him $10,000.

In the past few years they have caught pilots for lying on their medicals who were on disability. So they are now beginning to check Social Security and State Disability, maybe even worker's comp claims to cross check to pilots. Some these guys are in jail and have had their licenses revoked.