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Operating costs

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Operating costs

Hey everyone,

I'm looking for some help. I've been tasked with the job of doing a cost analysis of the operating costs for our club's aircraft, to see if our rates need to change. I saw some discussion on here about operating costs, but didn't see exactly what I'm looking for.

Here is what I need. If you are operating a C172 or C182, what do you use to figure your operating costs? I don't need fuel to be included since we charge a dry rate. Also, I know our insurance costs. I guess the biggest thing is oil/hour, engine reserves, etc. Specifically, we are flying a C172M, C172S, C182P, and a C182Q.

Thanks,
GSP
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Re: Operating costs

GSP,

You're asking a question that only YOU are qualified to answer. What do annuals cost on those airplanes, on average, say over the last ten years? Are the airplanes in really good condition, and all squawks dealt with as they occur, or do you defer a lot of maintenance?

Are you on a phased maintenance inspection program, or??

What type oil do you use? How often do you change it?

Etc, etc, etc, ad nauseum.

If you've been running this club for a couple years, you should be able to look BACK at your actual expenses for each airplane, and, adding a little fudge factor, come up with a reasonable estimate. If you haven't kept records so far, too bad, and shame on you. You should keep records both to assure the disgruntled member, the IRS and to help set future rates.

Every airplane, every base of operation, every set of pilots will generate a SIGNIFICANTLY different hourly cost of operation.

So, the question is back on YOU....What did it cost YOU to operate those aircraft over the last few years?

MTV
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Re: Operating costs

I came into the Treasurer position last year and, yes, records have been kept, sometimes not in the most tidy manner. For one, I was just curious about how much people figure for engine reserves and what kind of hourly cost they were using. All your points are valid and I've waded through the ton of information we have to come to "our" rate given the aircrafts' past histories. A couple of the aircraft we have only had for a year or so, so there isn't much historical data upon which to base our rate...another reason I was looking for some input. I've found an operating cost calculator on AOPA, similar to those type of calculators for mortgages, which is good. One thing it asks for is for a quart/hour usage. Since I don't fly all the aircraft the same amount, and am not the one to always put oil in, it is hard to track how much each aircraft is using over a given amount of time. So I thought I would see what either people's real world usage is, or what people conservatively figure in computing their operating costs.

Thanks,
GSP
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Re: Operating costs

Most airplanes I've run that are in good condition use a quart of oil every ten to twenty hours. I have run one or two that used a quart every four hours, but that is starting to get excessive, in my opinion.

So, who buys the oil for these airplanes, and how do you determine where the oil is going? Sounds like you might want to tighten up some of your procedures to help you track this kind of stuff.

You can find overhaul cost estimates from several engine overhaulers. Depending on the engine model, frequency of use, etc, the engines may or may not go to tbo.

In working with the one flying club I was in during my career (and never again), propeller abuse may well be one of the most costly functions, again depending on the type of aircraft and where they are flown. If any of hte aircraft ever go to gravel strips, you'll use up propellers regularly.

MTV
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Re: Operating costs

For what it's worth, I posted this in a thread awhile back:
viewtopic.php?f=11&t=3485

Because I fly so frequently, I change my oil every 50 hours. I add one quart during those 50 hours, and generally it's down to about 6 to 6.5 when I do the oil change. Also, it nets down to the fact that I throw in 8 bucks per hour for a maintenance fund.

Just my two cents on operating costs... here's how I broke down the operating costs for my 1975 7GCBC. I didn't factor in the purchase price because I assume I can get it back...

I share the operating costs, so I broke it down as a sole owner and as a partial owner. Last year I flew my airplane 125.4 hours.

To start calculating the hourly cost, I took my “split costs” which added up to $5,150.00 and are broken down as follows:
# Insurance $1,700.00 (hulled for $55K, and my brother had less than 100TT)
# Shelter - $2,910.00
# Annual - $300.00
# Oil (~ every 50 hours)- $240.00

And then added them to my “variable costs” of Gas and my maintenance fund:
# Gas (avg price of $5.41 per gallon last year. Yes, I saved every gas receipt and averaged it) - $3,903.17
# Maintenance Fund - $1,046.50

These added up to $4,949.67.

The maintenance fund is a savings account I throw 10 bucks for every tach hour flown into. The Hobbs to Tach percentage is about 80%. At 2,000 hours it would give us enough for an engine overhaul. If we decide to sell the airplane before overhaul, it gives us an upgrade fund, as I like to call it.

Overall, add $4,949.67 to $5,150.00 and divide that by 125.4. This gives me an hourly cost of $80.54. If we take my split costs and divide that $5,150.00 by two, add it to the $4,949.67, and divide it by total hours flown of 125.4 we get roughly $60.00 per hour.

If I was the sole owner and flew 125.4 hours - it would cost me around $80.00 an hour, and as it sits, it cost me about $60.00 per hour to fly it having a partner. You could actually think of it more like $50.00 an hour since $10.00 of that is actually sitting in a savings account.

Chris
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Re: Operating costs

mtv wrote:Most airplanes I've run that are in good condition use a quart of oil every ten to twenty hours. I have run one or two that used a quart every four hours, but that is starting to get excessive, in my opinion.

So, who buys the oil for these airplanes, and how do you determine where the oil is going? Sounds like you might want to tighten up some of your procedures to help you track this kind of stuff.

You can find overhaul cost estimates from several engine overhaulers. Depending on the engine model, frequency of use, etc, the engines may or may not go to tbo.

In working with the one flying club I was in during my career (and never again), propeller abuse may well be one of the most costly functions, again depending on the type of aircraft and where they are flown. If any of hte aircraft ever go to gravel strips, you'll use up propellers regularly.

MTV


Doing some reading, a quart every 10 hours is what I have read. We change oil every 100 hours, give or take. As the engine nears TBO, I believe it is changed every 50 hrs and the filter is checked for metal. We regularly are able to go over TBO on our aircraft so long as all the other vitals are looking good.

As for oil use, a case is kept in our club's shed. How it is supposed to work is when you take any out of the shed, you need to write down how much and what aircraft. It is also to be noted on the aircraft logsheet. With 90 members (less than half of whom fly), it isn't easy to keep tabs on it. Some record it, some don't, etc.

Thanks for the info guys. It's good to hear others experiences.
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