Backcountry Pilot • Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

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Would you be interested in a larger Desser tundra tire for a standard 6" wheel?

Yes, 27.5"
13
22%
Yes, 29"
11
19%
Yes, Both
34
59%
 
Total votes : 58

Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

AKclimber wrote:You should add a "not interested" option.
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hamer offline
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

hamer wrote:
AKclimber wrote:You should add a "not interested" option.
-Statistician


"Ignore the data that doesn't affirm your objective"
-Stats 101


Nice comeback!
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

What's the diameter of a 8.50-6 Tundra smooth tire from Desser?
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Aryana wrote:What's the diameter of a 8.50-6 Tundra smooth tire from Desser?
The 8.50s diameter is 22 inches

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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Aryana wrote:What's the diameter of a 8.50-6 Tundra smooth tire from Desser?


A friend of mine recently installed a set.
They measure out at 22-3/8" OD (fore-and-aft) mounted and installed on the airplane.
For comparison, my not-too-old 850 Airtracs measure 20-7/8" OD mounted & installed.
And my 26" GY's measure 23-5/8" OD unmounted.
Last edited by hotrod180 on Wed Mar 24, 2021 9:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

A1Skinner wrote:..... For stoutness, notice I only said 185/206? I know a lighter 180 should be fine, but a grossed up 3600lb 206 on 4 ply? I wouldn't trust that. Especially hearing of how heavier 180 guys are having issues with the 4 ply 8.50 smooth Dessers already.


Re the 850 Desser smoothies, I agree-- they seem kinda flimsy to me.
But on the other hand, the 29x10 Airhawks (both buffed & unbuffed) that ABI sells for mounting on their 10" wheels

https://www.airframesalaska.com/Buffed- ... lybuff.htm

are also 4 ply...and they seem anything BUT flimsy.
So apparently all 4 ply tires are not created equal.
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Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

My understanding is that they already have the proper tooling for 8” and 10” from some other tire. To retool for 6” is supposedly a real big deal.

We all have our ideas about how it should be but reality often times paints a much different picture.
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Certainly worthwhile for the experimental and amateur-built markets.
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

On a related subject, I've ragged on Alaska Airframes several times, politely, to come out with a 31" Airstreak tire. I've mentioned my CC was hot to trot, just make me a tire that size that isn't made for a heavier airplane, but for the LSA types.
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Hello BC Pilots/Community,

Upfront apologies...We are little late to the party and to this thread. We just joined BCP community.

In response to this post...Short answer: Desser cannot tool up to build anything bigger than about 23” in OD, in a 6” wheel configuration.

The reason behind this: modern AC tire build and cure technology has a limit on the internal bladder and mandrel that is inserted through the 6” size tire...it then expands via high air pressure in the tire cavity for mold curing. There is no physical way to implement a larger bladder in the mandrel to accommodate a larger OD size in 6” wheel, since the bladder cannot retract enough into the mandrel for the 6” hole size (and then pull out of the tire without severely damaging the bead area of the tire). That is why we had to increase the size of the wheel as we went up in tire OD: We are now about at the limits with the 10” size wheel, at 31” OD.

The good news is that Grove has produced both the 8” and 10” lightweight TSO’ed wheel and brake package to support the 27.5 x10x8 tire and in the 10” sizes, the smooth 850-10 6PR, the 29/1100-10 4PR, and the 31/11.00-10 4 PR tire. All #3 of these 10” sizes will fit on the Grove wheels. Seaplanes North in Alaska has the STC for the PA18/C185/185 and C206 for these on the 850-10 and 29/1100-10s and is just finishing up on adding the 31” to that STC.

On the sales comparison side, for just a little more than the price of #2 Bushwheels, you can equip your AC with new wheels, brakes and tires...and take advantage of the weight savings and extended tire wear of the Aero Classic TL Tundra tires with the Grove package. You’ll save some hard earned dollars. The next time you have to purchase just the tires and if you ever wear them out, they are less than ½ the cost of each Bushwheel. We have added a couple of older support docs for your review...hope you enjoy the comparison satire. :)
Hope this helps...thanks for all your support.

Ken Faire
VP Sales - Marketing
Desser Aerospace
DesserTireTundraComparison.pdf
(127.6 KiB) Downloaded 353 times
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Ken,
Thanks for showing up and describing the limitations of tire construction, and why we won't see anything bigger for our 6" rims. I recently broke down and bought a set of 26" airstreak 2.0 and you're not kidding - it's painful to click on that last button.

I laugh some because I drive a Porsche and recently installed 4 new tires for about what 1 airstreak costs. Your math is difficult to ignore. When I wear out the airstreaks I may invest in some larger wheels.

Maybe you know and maybe you don't, but can you help us understand how AWB is able to make larger 6" tires?
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Desser Tire wrote: Desser cannot tool up to build anything bigger than about 23” in OD, in a 6” wheel configuration.

The reason behind this: modern AC tire build and cure technology has a limit on the internal bladder and mandrel that is inserted through the 6” size tire...it then expands via high air pressure in the tire cavity for mold curing. There is no physical way to implement a larger bladder in the mandrel to accommodate a larger OD size in 6” wheel, since the bladder cannot retract enough into the mandrel for the 6” hole size (and then pull out of the tire without severely damaging the bead area of the tire). That is why we had to increase the size of the wheel as we went up in tire OD: We are now about at the limits with the 10” size wheel, at 31” OD.


So if its impossible how did GoodYear make the 26" Blimp tires?

Maybe the equipment you have?
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

Desser Tire wrote:Hello BC Pilots/Community,

Upfront apologies...We are little late to the party and to this thread. We just joined BCP community.

In response to this post...Short answer: Desser cannot tool up to build anything bigger than about 23” in OD, in a 6” wheel configuration.

The reason behind this: modern AC tire build and cure technology has a limit on the internal bladder and mandrel that is inserted through the 6” size tire...it then expands via high air pressure in the tire cavity for mold curing. There is no physical way to implement a larger bladder in the mandrel to accommodate a larger OD size in 6” wheel, since the bladder cannot retract enough into the mandrel for the 6” hole size (and then pull out of the tire without severely damaging the bead area of the tire). That is why we had to increase the size of the wheel as we went up in tire OD: We are now about at the limits with the 10” size wheel, at 31” OD.

The good news is that Grove has produced both the 8” and 10” lightweight TSO’ed wheel and brake package to support the 27.5 x10x8 tire and in the 10” sizes, the smooth 850-10 6PR, the 29/1100-10 4PR, and the 31/11.00-10 4 PR tire. All #3 of these 10” sizes will fit on the Grove wheels. Seaplanes North in Alaska has the STC for the PA18/C185/185 and C206 for these on the 850-10 and 29/1100-10s and is just finishing up on adding the 31” to that STC.

On the sales comparison side, for just a little more than the price of #2 Bushwheels, you can equip your AC with new wheels, brakes and tires...and take advantage of the weight savings and extended tire wear of the Aero Classic TL Tundra tires with the Grove package. You’ll save some hard earned dollars. The next time you have to purchase just the tires and if you ever wear them out, they are less than ½ the cost of each Bushwheel. We have added a couple of older support docs for your review...hope you enjoy the comparison satire. :)
Hope this helps...thanks for all your support.

Ken Faire
VP Sales - Marketing
Desser Aerospace


Thanks for chiming in Ken. Was hoping for better news, but it's understandable being a technical issue.

TangoFox wrote:So if its impossible how did GoodYear make the 26" Blimp tires?

Maybe the equipment you have?


Goodyear's 26" blimp tire isn't actually 26". It's roughly the same size are the 8.50. I am curious how ABW does it, but I know their manufacturing process is not easy, and has alot of fallout.
Last edited by hamer on Fri May 07, 2021 8:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

TangoFox wrote:
Desser Tire wrote: Desser cannot tool up to build anything bigger than about 23” in OD, in a 6” wheel configuration.

The reason behind this: modern AC tire build and cure technology has a limit on the internal bladder and mandrel that is inserted through the 6” size tire...it then expands via high air pressure in the tire cavity for mold curing. There is no physical way to implement a larger bladder in the mandrel to accommodate a larger OD size in 6” wheel, since the bladder cannot retract enough into the mandrel for the 6” hole size (and then pull out of the tire without severely damaging the bead area of the tire). That is why we had to increase the size of the wheel as we went up in tire OD: We are now about at the limits with the 10” size wheel, at 31” OD.


So if its impossible how did GoodYear make the 26" Blimp tires?

Maybe the equipment you have?


https://backcountrypilot.org/forum/tire ... otos-21353

tires.PNG
tires.PNG (2.6 MiB) Viewed 1515 times

tires-2.PNG
tires-2.PNG (2.2 MiB) Viewed 1515 times
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Re: Potential New Desser Tundra Tire Options

I installed GYs on my SC 7 yrs ago and newest owner just replaced with new set. I installed Desser smoothies on Champ 3 yrs ago and new owner took took them off last year so he could practice on on concrete with a stronger tire. IMHO; there is no comparison; I wouldn't put the light weight Desser smoothies on anything heavier than a light two place airplane- 180/182 is too heavy. When you pull them out of shipping box; you'll understand. Good tires, just too light even though I believe they state good for 1650 lbs. Currently use 31 ABW on my Husky and love them; do wish Desser could get into that game- 6:00s.
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