Things are moving along, I'll be moving into my new (to me) hangar home in two weeks at close of escrow. https://www.backcountrypilot.org/forum/ ... heap-18739

Keeping to my theme of "on the cheap" from the above linked thread, I've come to feel like the Rans S6ES offers the best bang for the buck. I can't say at this time if the S6 will be just a time builder, or a keeper but it does fit certain criteria for me. High wing because my hangar will share space with some cars and I prefer a high wing anyway. Tricycle gear because I'm a almost zero time ex student pilot and only have 15 hours solo in a 150 back in 1982. Side by side seating, it is just more social, and rather light weight (some as low as 600 lbs) for decently short ground roll and good climb.

My hopes for any a/c purchase is to have it ferried to my hangar hopefully by the owner as a proof of trust in his bird that he is selling. Once in my hangar I'll find a CFI in my area that will instruct me back to him/her feeling confident to allow me to solo. At that time with the convenience of air park living, I would like to practice locally for about 100 hours to get dialed into it before finishing my dual and having the check ride. My friend Dick, mentioned in the above link did it this way and had 120 hours solo before his check ride. My last flying was at a flying club with club CFI and in this setting it was slow getting hours and expensive since it was club owned a/c. Travel time to the airport, a/c availability, weather and work just seemed to conspire against getting a lot of time in a short time frame. Living with my own plane, retired, and New Mexico weather should allow 100+ hours easy in two months. I'll get to practice cross wind landings starting at the low scale and work up.

I'm looking for feedback on both my choice of aircraft for training and my choice of training. I know I could always do what most have done and go to a flight school setting, but I'm sure I will feel much more at ease during my check ride for my license in my own plane that I already have over 100 hours in a short time frame. It is just too costly to amass those 100+ hours in a rental.

Thank you for taking the time to read and respond.

Bob

Do-able, but there are a few hurdles to flight training in an experimental:

https://www.eaa.org/en/eaa/aviation-com ... t-aircraft

Can be done and the link above outlines a good deal of it.

I've known a few folks that are happy to be signed off for solo with no intention of getting a rating, accepting the restrictions that accompany the solo endorsement. Some CFI's will play along, others won't.

Best of luck, hope it works out. Rans products are a good value with consistent factory support.

That link was tailor made for my question, thank you. I want to get my rating, just want to be comfortable with a lot of hours in the a/c before the DPE tests me. And your link addressed that in saying not all DPE's are willing to give a practical test in an amateur-built aircraft. As I don't want to worry about passing a medical as I get older, my plan was Sport Pilot only.

On the insurance issue, I'll have to contact some companies to see if they will even insure a plane owned by a student pilot. I would think with no hull insurance and liability for the scenario of operating from a hangar/home with no exposure to damage other a/c or FBO facilities, it should be doable. I'll have to ask Dick how he did it for both insurance and which DPE was willing to give the test in an amateur-built experimental.

I believe that getting a full PPL now and letting your medical lapse might net lower insurance rates based on a few other threads here.

As far as your plan goes, I don't know that I'd be married to a number of solo hours. Your CFI (if they are any good) will prepare you for the test and let you know when they think you're ready. You can then fly as many hours as your heart desires getting more and more comfortable in your plane while possessing your certificate. Remember that you'll be earning a license to learn, and are expected to continue honing your abilities after your checkride.

I know of a really nice rans S6 that I'm pretty sure is for sale in geauga county, OH (7G8).

CamTom12 wrote:I believe that getting a full PPL now and letting your medical lapse might net lower insurance rates based on a few other threads here.

As far as your plan goes, I don't know that I'd be married to a number of solo hours. Your CFI (if they are any good) will prepare you for the test and let you know when they think you're ready. You can then fly as many hours as your heart desires getting more and more comfortable in your plane while possessing your certificate. Remember that you'll be earning a license to learn, and are expected to continue honing your abilities after your checkride.

I know of a really nice rans S6 that I'm pretty sure is for sale in geauga county, OH (7G8).

I don't want to take the chance of not passing my medical. I'm on meds for both diabetes and high blood pressure and can accept the limitations of the SPL.

Is the Rans S6 owned by Jerry, 83 years young?
If so, your right, it is really nice and would buy it if I can insure it as a student pilot and find a CFI willing to teach in a student owned homebuilt expermental. Would need to find a ferry pilot to get it from 7G8 to NM09.

deckofficer wrote:I don't want to take the chance of not passing my medical. I'm on meds for both diabetes and high blood pressure and can accept the limitations of the SPL.

That's a good point. I didn't know that. Hopefully I'm not getting into your personal business here, but you should check out the useful load thread on here for some diet/exercise ideas that might help both of those issues and help you enjoy your retirement and flying a lot longer!

deckofficer wrote:Is the Rans S6 owned by Jerry, 83 years young?
If so, your right, it is really nice and would buy it if I can insure it as a student pilot and find a CFI willing to teach in a student owned homebuilt expermental. Would need to find a ferry pilot to get it from 7G8 to NM09.

I believe so. I didn't get a chance to meet the owner but saw it when I passed through. Everyone I met at that airport was super nice, though! And it looked like a very nicely built plane.

Thanks for getting back to me CamTom12. Is this the plane?









I sent an email to Keystone Aerosports who have stated in their ferry service part of their web site that training is available on the ferry flight. I'm sure they meant for check out and not for a license but who knows. Weather permitting, it is at least two days of daylight flying (1600 sm) with an 18 gallon fuel capacity would mean a lot of stops. Maybe enough for the CFI/ferry pilot to sign me off for solo again???

On the "usefull load" suggestion for my health, thank you. I have been working on that too, going from 265 lbs Jan 1st to 210 lbs today. I'm 6' 1" and eating better now that I'm preparing meals only for myself.

deckofficer wrote:Thanks for getting back to me CamTom12. Is this the plane?









I sent an email to Keystone Aerosports who have stated in their ferry service part of their web site that training is available on the ferry flight. I'm sure they meant for check out and not for a license but who knows. Weather permitting, it is at least two days of daylight flying (1600 sm) with an 18 gallon fuel capacity would mean a lot of stops. Maybe enough for the CFI/ferry pilot to sign me off for solo again???

On the "usefull load" suggestion for my health, thank you. I have been working on that too, going from 265 lbs Jan 1st to 210 lbs today. I'm 6' 1" and eating better now that I'm preparing meals only for myself.

No, the one I saw was cream/orange and, now that I think of it, built as a TD. I think Dave owned it. Not sure, I'm terrible with names.

I think a CFI would likely not sign you off for solo after a CC ferry flight if for nothing else than liability reasons. You'll likely need to find one near you to develop a relationship with, so they can understand your decision making as much as your stick wiggling. But take this opinion with a grain of salt, I'm not a CFI.

Excellent news on the health side of the house! Keep it up! You should post your progress and what you've been doing in that other thread, as much for others as for a method to help track your progress!

CamTom12 wrote:

deckofficer wrote:No, the one I saw was cream/orange and, now that I think of it, built as a TD. I think Dave owned it. Not sure, I'm terrible with names.

Would that be Dave Rigotti?

$28,500 is asking for the one in the pictures. 650 TT, iFly 720, tow bar, cabin heater (water), 100 hp Rotax. Good price?

RANS are great planes! I love my s6s!
Approx how much life left on the coverings? Mine is dope/fabric, that was a must when I was buying.. but they cost more too! the ES versions w/ that type of covering have to be recovered more often... otherwise nothing comes to mind to look out for-

One of the guys on here name of Scott built and owned one very much like that one only with the little wheel on the tail. He's whizzing around on a powered parachute these days.....if whizzing is what one does in a parachute. I imagine he'll pop in here at some point. He loved his but needed to pay tuition for a daughter or two.

GravityKnight wrote:RANS are great planes! I love my s6s!
Approx how much life left on the coverings? Mine is dope/fabric, that was a must when I was buying.. but they cost more too! the ES versions w/ that type of covering have to be recovered more often... otherwise nothing comes to mind to look out for-

It has UV coated Dacron skins but as every seller says "always hangared". With me it will always be in a hangar except when flying. It also has the 116 wing with vortex generators and tie down rings. 3 bladed Kiev ground adjustable prop and Garmin transponder. Since it is a 2002, do you feel $28,500 is a good price? 650 TT hours.

I have viewed your videos on your YouTube channel and read a lot of your posts, I'm impressed with your mods like the leaner and Zipper slugs and jugs.

deckofficer wrote:

GravityKnight wrote:RANS are great planes! I love my s6s!
Approx how much life left on the coverings? Mine is dope/fabric, that was a must when I was buying.. but they cost more too! the ES versions w/ that type of covering have to be recovered more often... otherwise nothing comes to mind to look out for-

It has UV coated Dacron skins but as every seller says "always hangared". With me it will always be in a hangar except when flying. It also has the 116 wing with vortex generators and tie down rings. 3 bladed Kiev ground adjustable prop and Garmin transponder. Since it is a 2002, do you feel $28,500 is a good price? 650 TT hours.

I have viewed your videos on your YouTube channel and read a lot of your posts, I'm impressed with your mods like the leaner and Zipper slugs and jugs.

Appreciate that!.. it's been super fun and an ongoing project! I PM'd you some details on money related stuff and s6's

GravityKnight wrote:Appreciate that!.. it's been super fun and an ongoing project! I PM'd you some details on money related stuff and s6's

Thanks, read the PM. Saw your latest YouTube video of 15 hours ago. Nice climb out considering your 6600' field elevation. Your light weight combined with 114 hp Zipper Big Bore and 72" Kool makes for some serious performance. I could only dream what it would be like on a cold day at sea level.

deckofficer wrote:
Would that be Dave Rigotti?

$28,500 is asking for the one in the pictures. 650 TT, iFly 720, tow bar, cabin heater (water), 100 hp Rotax. Good price?

Great question! I'm not sure on either count!

Good luck though.

Popping in as ordered. That's a pretty good price. If it's Dave Rigotti's bird then it's a pretty good plane. You could probably get more and better answers over at www.ransclan.com

I loved my S6ES. It was a pretty capable BC aircraft. Roomy and comfortable to fly. Here's my old bird...

Now that this thread has attracted some S6ES owners, the big question. I would guess the reason such a great a/c has such a low resale price would be the dacron wing coverings? I think I saw on Barnstormers an outfit selling these coverings for I think around $3000. Other research I've found the life of the dacron to be about 1500 hours of UV exposure. I don't know if either assumption is right. During my hang gliding years I never had to replace my dacron, but over that time I was only in the air about 300 hours and after landing I would fold my leading edges, wrap and tie the dacron and put my glider bag on, so no UV exposure. So for those that have experience with dacron wings, how long do they last, how expensive is the replacement cost, and how labor intensive is recovering? Another thing that comes to mind is since the wing is a double surface (unlike my Rogallo type wing), as speed increases does the underside camber up a bit so as to lose some cruise speed? A metal, composite, or even doped cloth wouldn't camber up like dacron.

I guess what I am trying to say, is the cheaper up front cost offset by flying surface replacement costs? I figure typically on a fly-in I'm might be in the air a total of 2 hours but at the fly-in for 8 hours on the ground getting UV exposure. If the above costs and life of dacron are close, that works out to an added $16 per hour operating costs.

In my experience, and this is sad to say, the tailwheel is what hurts resale value the worst. I had I don't know how many people call and then hang up when they found out it was a tailwheel.

I had 300 hours on my dacron skins and they looked fine but I always kept the airplane hangared.

My father's Quicksilver with Dacron sails is 22 years old and they look brand new. Always hangared.

Svanarts and Zzz, thanks for the positive replies on the life of dacron skins. It keeps the S6ES on my short list. I'll be moving into my airpark home in Columbus, NM next week and need to find a CFI in the area to get started on my license.