My take on it, is that it is a minor modification by referencing the def'n of major mod and It isn't specialized maintenance, so we are replacing it IAW ac43.13 2b chapter 11 and 2, And ac43.13 1b chp 4 section 4.

Going carbon fibre might be an issue though.. It's not like it's structural but I can't find any advisory circulars that give any reference for strength and replacement of aluminum material for carbon fibre. Which brings it into the realm of needing an Stc.

You'd have to find acceptable data, or create acceptable data for installation as the manufacturer of your replacement instrument panel..

I don't know exactly how to pull it off right now.. Easiest would be pay some blood money to a DAR. A little more work would be researching the regulations in regards to owner produced parts, installation of parts/repairs, minor modifications, acceptable data, etc. in the Canadian aviation regulations.

I'll try to do some research tonight on it for you and see if I can pull a way for it to be done through the regs.

According to the reg's you as a manufacturer of a part can install said part in the aircraft, as long as it meets the requirements of the type certificate/design... The 180 I believe was certified under civil air regulation part 3. So you do some digging into car part 3, and there isn't much in there in terms of "the instrument panel" because it isn't primary structure. So, does changing the material that the instrument panel is actually made of, alter the type design? I can't answer that. I would venture to guess that it doesn't, but I also wouldn't bet my license on it..

So if you are wanting to change the instrument panel (as in the piece the instruments are actually mounted in) to carbon fibre, I think you'll need an Stc.

Now if you are just wanting an overlay (like I made to cover the instrument mounting screws, (mine is made of metal, newer cessnas are made of plastic)) that would be completely different because i would think that would be "cabin furnishings" which is listed as an elementary task in the reg's.

mmartin1872 wrote:According to the reg's you as a manufacturer of a part can install said part in the aircraft, as long as it meets the requirements of the type certificate/design... The 180 I believe was certified under civil air regulation part 3. So you do some digging into car part 3, and there isn't much in there in terms of "the instrument panel" because it isn't primary structure. So, does changing the material that the instrument panel is actually made of, alter the type design? I can't answer that. I would venture to guess that it doesn't, but I also wouldn't bet my license on it..

So if you are wanting to change the instrument panel (as in the piece the instruments are actually mounted in) to carbon fibre, I think you'll need an Stc.

Now if you are just wanting an overlay (like I made to cover the instrument mounting screws, (mine is made of metal, newer cessnas are made of plastic)) that would be completely different because i would think that would be "cabin furnishings" which is listed as an elementary task in the reg's.

Wow. Thanks! I sure didn't expect you to spend so much time answering my question. (edit) where are you in Canada?
I've always wondered about that cabin furnishings part of elementary maintenance. Does that mean I can pull out my interior and go utility style all on my own? Or is that stretching the definition a bit? I found it didn't read real clear on how far I could go...
David

Technically you can, but the issue is you are supposed to record the change in your log book. . What happens is transport canada,if they ever dig through your books, goes and says a weight and balance amendment wasnt done.. you as a pilot can't sign a weight and balance amendment. What usually happens is the interior just gets done and no one knows the wiser. Even better though, is when most mechanics change an interior, unless you ask, they won't do a weight and balance amendment either.

I also don't think transport canada would be digging through your books looking to catch you on an interior change unless you got yourself on their hit list.

"Elementary Maintenance" only applies to Commercial Air Carriers operating under part 7 of the CARs. It requires training and TC approval through the operator's Company Operations Manual. It does not apply to private aircraft. Owners of private aircraft can only "service" their aircraft in accordance with the aircraft flight manual. Anyone can perform maintenance under the supervision of an AME.

Sorry northern guy but you are wrong about that. The note in the elementary task list is saying that "if you are doing an elementary task on an aircraft that is in the 406(flu) or 700(commercial) you must be trained and approved in the mcm/com.

If elementary tasks were intended to be for air carrier and ftu purposes only, they would have been listed in car 706 and 726 respectively and not car 625 and 571. Which are general aircraft maintenance rules.

I'm sure of this as I have dealt with transport on this specifically when I was prm for a small helicopter company.

mmartin1872 wrote:Technically you can, but the issue is you are supposed to record the change in your log book. . What happens is transport canada,if they ever dig through your books, goes and says a weight and balance amendment wasnt done.. you as a pilot can't sign a weight and balance amendment. What usually happens is the interior just gets done and no one knows the wiser. Even better though, is when most mechanics change an interior, unless you ask, they won't do a weight and balance amendment either.

I also don't think transport canada would be digging through your books looking to catch you on an interior change unless you got yourself on their hit list.

Ok. But I would do the interior then a weight and balance done. Then all should be well right?

And you are right on elementary maintenance. It does apply to private planes as well.

Yep all should be right.

Your doing a great job. Looks great! Sorry for derailing your thread there. Looking forward to seeing the completed paint!

I have no problem with thread derails.. I'm always happy to help if I can. I'm one of those AME's that will show up at 9 at night to give you a jump start if you get stuck at the airport I'm at. We (my dad and I) also have a camper at our hangar that we've put pilots up in if they need a place to stay for the night, along with a spare vehicle to go get food. It isn't the Sheraton, but people sure appreciate the gesture.

Where are you located? That's is a great gesture. Nothing worse then not having a place to go or way to get places at an unfamiliar airport.

A1Skinner wrote:Where are you located? That's is a great gesture. Nothing worse then not having a place to go or way to get places at an unfamiliar airport.

I'm based in chilliwack.. my work is at one end of the airport and keep the airplanes at the family hangar on the other side of the airport. So basically I'm at the airport 7 days a week.

Ok. Right on!

1st colour sprayed

2nd colour... I hope the colour choices turn out. .. Won't know till Thursday

Oh man, I like the looks of it! I think it's going to look awesome!

I just hope people don't think it's a ndp billboard. Lol.. I'm anxious to pull the masking but we have to paint the interior first

Haha! I thought you BCers like the NDP?But man I'm glad to hear you don't!

Edited because I was getting a little political. . Can't remember the policy on that. Lol