I just got this link off of the Baja Bush Pilot's website. After reading and listening to the audio interview, all of us should quit being cows being led to the slaughter and bitch up a storm.

This guy flies to Baja frequently as he owns a place in Loreto, BCS. The actions of the CBP agents is way over the top for any reason. Guns pointed at people for no reason. Remember, this happened in Long Beach, CA, USA, not in Mexico!!!!

http://www.avweb.com/avwebflash/news/Pi ... 519-1.html

Looks like Osama Bin Laden is winning to me. He now has our own government terrorizing us. Good job congress, you are all a bunch of worthless F*&%s!!!!!

To add insult when the DC F*&$s come home it is by private jet. Get out of the jet into the waiting limo. I'll bet they don't get M16s stuck in there face.

I know this is not 100% correct but this has blood shooting out of my eyes!

Maybe I shouldn't post after 4 cups of coffee

RB

Hmm, responsible gun owners know better than to point ANY weapon at anything they aren't willing to destroy.
Obviously, these thugs don't bother with basic firearms safety... or they're perfectly willing to kill innocent people.
(or, they're projecting their own mental shortcomings and just assuming that everyone is evil and is subject to elimination).

Bad cops... No DONUT!


And, yeah. Anyone in whatever country (including this one) who might have acted on their envy of our way of life...
hell. They're laughing up their sleeves right now at what's going on. I believe we're seeing a move to start up the Jr Brownshirts again. Huzzah!

So...

This guy and his family were going to take drugs down to Mexico? And surrounding his airplane with vehicles and personnel wasn't going to stop this rabid pilot so the use of M-16's pointing at the family was necessary because???

This is still America folks.

Make that 3 wars.

Ah, yes. The War on (nearly) Everything.

War being the health of the State, they must always have something to fight... when all you have is a hammer and all.

I certainly understand the fustration when our govenment does this sort of thing. I think there are several different approaches when faced with this sort of situation. The one that actually seems to work best is to carry a small notebook with you and very carefully keep notes of the entire process. Ask for names, badge numbers, background information, etc. Anything that might be useful and adds details and background material. It is important to remain very polite and respectful. Do not hide what you are doing but do not volunteer that information during the process.

The authorities involved are not stupid. They know what is going on. Write up the story and pass it around to all the local newspapers and any other media outlet that might be appropriate. Hint - The NRA loves these stories. Shine the light of day on these types of activities every chance you get. Send the story to your congressmen and state and local governments. As there is more exposure the pressure will build for the behavior to change. It isn't instant but over time it is remarkably effective.

Float Flyer:

Had to chime in. I can't agree more!!

Unfortunately, the intervention, meddling and overreaching control is coming at all levels. When you consider the attempts by Uncle Sam as of late to get into GA's life, it is very troubling indeed. Efforts include:

1. Attempts to make all GA flights in airplanes over 12,500 have to get preapproval as the airlines do.
2. Attempts to lock down all airports with commuter traffic (even though they have backed off some, airports with commuter flights with greater than 50 seats still have to implement new security measures).
3. Hatred by the current administration towards any "carbon footprint" combined with the lawsuit by environmental groups concerning lead in av fuel, which will ultimately result in more expensive fuel which is less available.
4. The imposition by Feds on airpark residents who have received federal dollars, federal standards including security issues, runway size and specs, etc.
5. The friendly congress trying to serve big money interest airlines by pushing fees to GA.

The bottom line is if we all need to be doing more than screaming Float Flyer. We need to assist AOPA, NBAA, EAA and the rest to organize and try to beat back these actions which will ultimately ruin GA industry. We need to flood congress and state legislatures with phone calls.

We all need to get motivated and active, otherwise these things are going to change our flying life (and otherwise too).

Regards, Larry

IMO unless a huge check accompanies talking, calling, faxing, letters, phone calls, emails don't really work. I have been doing all for years on a variety of issues, no huge check. To no avail.

What does work IMO, you get 20 or more pilots. Walk onto runways at class C or B airports. Then bike lock your neck to lights or signs.

Make sure the TV stations are called and have a spokesman there to articulate our grievances.

This has worked extremely well to stop logging in the NW.

Another way is to scale a Federal building near the entrance. Then live there for a week crapping in a bucket. True story, happened in Portland, Or.

Make sure the TV stations are called and have a spokesman there to articulate our grievances.

Then you do this every 2-3 months. This has to be done by people with nothing to lose. So you have to pay someone or give all your stuff to your kids.

This my friends is called civil disobedience.

Who wants to go first? I'll talk to the TV stations.

Just one more step on the path to revolution. We were walking, I fear we are now jogging down the path.

RB

I got one of these stories too. My 15 year old daughter and I were coming back from Saskatchewn Canada about 8 years ago. We went down a small backroad that I believe came out on Montana. I got to the little Border Crossing office about 2 minutes before they were to close. They wouldn't let me through and we had to drive back 40 miles to the first village and stay over night above the bar. The next morning we were the first in line and then an older gentleman and his wife behind us.

When I got up to the building in my car they told us we had to go inside. When I got in there they accused me of coming into the States and then crossing back into Canada. They took my daughter into another room and interigated us for almost two hours. My daughter was scared Spitless and they wouldn't let me talk to her. They kept telling me I kidnaped her. While all this was going on the old man came in and asked to use the bathroom. They started yelling at him and told him to stay in his car until they told him to come out. He sat there for well over an hour before the one of them went out to talk to him. This was OUR People doing this. Some of these guys are just F^$(*@# AS^*%@#^!!!!!!

I wrote a letter to the border patrol and got nothing in return. Guess this is what happens when you put badges on two dumbasses and put them in a little shack 40 miles from nowhere. Still pisses me off to think about it.

Jerry

Unfortunately, Customs and Border Patrol have never been very responsive to citizen complaints regarding ill treatment of said citizens.

9/11 has just made it all the worse, unfortunately. It seems like many at the border feel that they don't have to act professionally, nor do they answer to any higher authority.

Napolitano needs to hear about all this stuff, whether it works or not. Sooner or later, Congress and/or some bureaucrat is going to get fed up with all these letters and maybe tell someone in the agency to knock it off.

Maybe. I have no idea what ever happened to the notion of professionalism with these guys.

I sure don't like the notion of people pointing guns at anyone unless there's a damn good reason for it. If that were the case, then it should have been articulated to them after things calmed down.

I got told to spreadeagle on the highway by a CHP troop once during a regular traffic stop and held there at gunpoint for fifteen minutes. Then he told me I could go, got in his car and left. I visited the nearest CHP office, found a sergeant, and he looked it up. Turns out there was a felony warrant out for a murder suspect who was driving a car almost identical to mine, and Oregon plates, but one number off from mine. That I could understand, and I told the sergeant so, but I told him it was unprofessional of the trooper to have failed to explain that to me after having me face down on the pavement. He agreed. A couple days later, the trooper arrived on my doorstep, offered a sincere sounding apology, and left.

But, this sounds like something totally stupid.


MTV

Having met you MTV, I understand the CHP's actions.....you look pretty shady to me!

Things like this will continue to happen as long as we let them get away with it.....Make phone calls, send emails and letters and vote.

As a Border Patrol Agent and pilot this ticks me off. However, there may be more to the story. Weapons and cash are frequently smuggled South of the border, to the benefit of some really bad people. People just don't comprehend the amount of drugs, weapons and humans that are smuggled across the border for profit. Obviously, the agents in this situation acted, or over reacted, on bad intel. I have never heard of an instance where weapons were drawn without strong probable cause to believe that an agents or an innocent persons life may be in jeopardy. If the situation was accurately described, it is totally unacceptable. Agents can and have been fired for less. Agents can also be sued for 4th ammendment violations. Time to start bitching LOUD.

Trust me when I say that the southern border is a mess. I love to play in the desert but it just isn't worth the hassle to fly within a hundred miles of the border. If you do, expect to be noticed.

tonkhuntr, where do you fly out of?

SixTwoLeemer wrote:So...

This is still America folks.

Make that 3 wars.

You got that right 62L; This is America and we have constitutional rights as law abiding citizens. If this report is accurate, we are being targeted as criminals for going to the airport to fly. At some point it will be time to refuse to be bullied into the Ghetto. I'm probably going to get my ass kicked or shot full of holes for this attitude. But, if one of those somes of a bitches points a weapon at me for no legal, good, reason, I'd be tempted to fit him with said weapon to where the sun does not shine.
At some point we as American Citizens need to "just say no".
SLW

tonkhuntr wrote:As a Border Patrol Agent and pilot this ticks me off. However, there may be more to the story. Weapons and cash are frequently smuggled South of the border, to the benefit of some really bad people. People just don't comprehend the amount of drugs, weapons and humans that are smuggled across the border for profit. Obviously, the agents in this situation acted, or over reacted, on bad intel. I have never heard of an instance where weapons were drawn without strong probable cause to believe that an agents or an innocent persons life may be in jeopardy. If the situation was accurately described, it is totally unacceptable. Agents can and have been fired for less. Agents can also be sued for 4th ammendment violations. Time to start bitching LOUD.

Trust me when I say that the southern border is a mess. I love to play in the desert but it just isn't worth the hassle to fly within a hundred miles of the border. If you do, expect to be noticed.

Precaution noted and well stated.
Thank you,
SLW

"Those that foresake their right of Liberty for Safety, deserve neither" George Washington.

I am posting the link from Baja Bush Pilots that shows a letter to CBP detailing multiple incidents of aggressive and questionable actions against GA pilots. Please note that these letters are from different areas and all seem to have the same theme. CBP agents overacting with "gestapo" style attitudes and actions. Also note that we do not have both sides of these stories but that is because CBP has so far, failed to justify their actions, quite arrogant in my humble opinion.

The Baja Bush Pilots organization has, in my opinion, done more advocacy work on cross border operations than any other group I am aware of. I would like to think that some of you would send a few bucks to this organization as a thank you even if you do not go to Mexico or care to join. If you fly to Mexico and do not belong, you are, IMO, reaping the benefits of this group by piggy backing on others.

http://www.bajabushpilots.com/pdf/Letter,%20Hoffman.pdf

I just can't get into my pea sized brain how these bad assed Border DHS agents can harrass law abiding US citizens and there are 20 MILLION+ illegal aliens walking the streets of the United States without a bother in the world ?? Is it just me or am I crazy ?????

TomKatz wrote:"Those that foresake their right of Liberty for Safety, deserve neither" George Washington.

fer cryin out loud. That was not George Washington

Benjamin Franklin (1706–90)
QUOTATION: Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

Rob, I fly out of Casa Grande now. Like many in AZ, I'm a transplant.