bumper wrote:Many ultralights back then, and maybe a few LSAs now, are constructed in a manner that would never come up to certified aviation standards.

Most ultralights, and very light, LSA's still use pop riveted aluminum tubes. That's part of what made me look at the Legal Eagle. It uses standard, very traditional construction techniques. Steel tube fuselage with fabric covered wood wings. And a good old VW out front to boot. I nearly set my Bearhawk plans aside for a year to build one, but the truss type ribs kind of scared me away. They just look far too tedious to build to me.

Ultralights will get you up there, and like anything that flies, most certainly have the ability to kill you. Preflight and be careful.

That could actually be applied to any motor vehicle.

Phil

OK, given the Cayuna or whatever is a POS, what's wrong with the B1RD design?
The Quicksilvers way back when were poorly built, remember my knowledge is rather outdated, which is what led me to the Condor. The Condor had AN hardware, double swaged cables, any tube that had a bolt through it ran the bolt through an insert rather than just through the tube etc. Back in the day Quicksilver outsold everbody else though.
What is the skinny on the Challenger? Just from glancing at them, they seem OK?

a64pilot wrote: What is the skinny on the Challenger? Just from glancing at them, they seem OK?

I'm finishing up a Challenger II right now. Here's what I can tell you about hte construction. It's exclusively pop rivited aluminum tube construction. The tail boom has a reputation for being fragile, The Alaskan dealer warned me never to tail hook my landings. Performance seems pretty good, most owners report a 75mph cruise. However, what Quad City Ultralight calls "tundra tires" are actually smaller than a 5.00x5.

Wings have tubular front and rear spars that double as the leading and trailing edges. Ribs are just bent aluminum tubes over the top only. This makes covering it with aircraft fabric interesting because the bottom surface is only touching at the perimeter. The top surface uses fabric rivets to attach to the ribs. Normal rib stitching won't work due to the lack of ribs on the underside.

I should be able to give you a flight report by September.

Phil

a64pilot wrote: The Quicksilvers way back when were poorly built, remember my knowledge is rather outdated, which is what led me to the Condor. The Condor had AN hardware, double swaged cables, any tube that had a bolt through it ran the bolt through an insert rather than just through the tube etc.

That's how our Quicksilvers are constructed: 100% AN bolts throughout, passed through bushing-sleeved tubing. The old man actually turns custom 6061 tube ends to reinforce the ends of the tubing.

There is another company making a virtual copy of the MXL design, called M-Squared. They use aluminum struts instead of a kingpost and cables. They look a little cleaner, but they're reportedly heavier.

We sell a chromoly axle kit, as the stock aluminum one tends to not have a very good memory after a few hard landings:

a64pilot wrote:OK, given the Cayuna or whatever is a POS, what's wrong with the B1RD design?

The pilot's toes are a bit close to the prop tips, aren't they??

M-squared also uses chromoly steel for a lot of their structure. They're heavier, but reportedly a lot tougher too. They don't have a Part 103 legal ultralight currently though, I think their lightest plane is listed at 320lbs empty. Everything's a compromise.

One of my neighbors has a CGS Hawk II, and I really like the looks of that one. A lot of the things that are aftermarket upgrades to the Challengers are standard for the Hawk.

Phil

1SeventyZ wrote:[The pilot's toes are a bit close to the prop tips, aren't they??

You never had a Volkswagon bus did you?
I hadn't thought of prop / toe clearence, The only drawback I had seen was the prop wash in your face. It was it being a tail dragger with convential controls and it's STOL performance that drew me.

Unfortunately I never did have a VW bus...but I'd still love to get one and put a TDI converted to a greaser in it.

Anyway...I had to post these photos after dredging them up tonight because they give me that great feeling of exhilaration every time I look at them. From a coast trip back in 2003:



I probably wouldn't do this today knowing what I know:




If you look close you can see that the wings have just a hair of washout to them.


Not much different than camping at JC, except you have to bribe your family to drive your gear in.




At Bandon State airport:

Zane,
Those are clipped wings? The wingspan looks shorter than what I remember and I remember single surfaced wings as well.
What's a TDI converted to a greaser? Is that a Diesel burning cooking oil?
There were some VW Wesfalia campers with Diesels. I think they had the slowest 0 to 60 time of any passenger vehicle sold in America. Road and Track on their test couldn't make the brakes fade, not because they were so good, it just took so much time to get back up to speed that the brakes had cooled by then. I had a 71 Westfalia. Bus owners learned that you could climb a hill backwards that you couldn't go up in first, reverse had a lower ratio
I'll admit of course that there are some ultralights out there better built and maintained than certified aircraft, but they are the exception and not the rule. Of course it's completely buyer beware with an ultralight while there are at least min. standards for a certified airplane.
I'd buy the B1RD if it were close to me, but I can't see traveling 3,000 miles to get it. I figure you can't get stung with only $3,500 in something. I believe they had a good safety record for an ultralight, but I have no idea how to verify that, or really if it is even true.

Bub: This past weekend while attending the BCFA fly- in one of the speakers, Charlie Russell, had a Kobe ultralight on floats. He built this plane in '92 and put it in a container and shipped it to Russia where he flew it for 8 yrs while living with grizzlies.

He arrived at the fly in with a lady passenger and some camping gear. It had a Full Lotus fuselage float and performs quite well. If flying an ultralight makes you happy, I hope you get one. Knowing you, I am quite sure that attitude will never be a factor if a mishap were to happen. Good luck, Ford

Ford Wilson wrote:Bub: This past weekend while attending the BCFA fly- in one of the speakers, Charlie Russell, had a Kobe ultralight on floats. He built this plane in '92 and put it in a container and shipped it to Russia where he flew it for 8 yrs while living with grizzlies.

He arrived at the fly in with a lady passenger and some camping gear. It had a Full Lotus fuselage float and performs quite well. If flying an ultralight makes you happy, I hope you get one. Knowing you, I am quite sure that attitude will never be a factor if a mishap were to happen. Good luck, Ford

If he had a passenger, it wasn't an ultralight. At least not according to the current rules.

Phil

a64pilot wrote:Zane,
Those are clipped wings? The wingspan looks shorter than what I remember and I remember single surfaced wings as well.
What's a TDI converted to a greaser? Is that a Diesel burning cooking oil?

The single seat model (MXL Sport) has a slightly shorter wingspan than the MXL II. I have flown the MXL II solo and it's like a buzzard compared to the Sport...there's just so much wing. The Sport also cruises a little faster.

Yes, a TDI is a modern VW turbo diesel, usually salvaged from Jettas, and shoehorned into a Vanagon. There's a way to convert them to burn cooking oil I guess. Kinda neat.