I need 10 hours of dual complex time for my commercial license and I'm having a hard time finding a reasonably priced airplane close by. I've also given much thought to getting a commercial seaplane ticket at the same time.

The one guy I found with a seaplane is estimating it would take 20-25 hours of time to get the commercial in his seaplane. This immediately made me less interested in him, because I have a feeling he's trying to milk me.

Anybody got any suggestions?

"reasonably priced airplane"

Well Mister Willie, there inlies your problem. There is no such thing. I'm lucky enough to have 182RG, T-34, and SF260 time to have the hours for the commercial. It's tough to find a complex airplane that you can rent. I was able to rent the 182RG, but that was 15 years ago. Doubt if I could afford it now.

Good luck, Bub

Many flight schools have a Piper Arrow that is used to give CML instruction in. They are relatively easy to find in these parts and usually cheaper to rent than the new 172 or 182.

Crap.. After all my searching I might just have to give up and take the 182RG at Double Eagle II... *Puke*

Shebles, Not only will they treat you right on your commercial needs, but you can do your SES in a supercub. Or a lake if you prefer... And the flying on the Colorado river and its associated lakes should be pretty nice right about now.
http://www.shebleaviation.com/
Take care,
Rob

Another thought just occured to me... I wonder if you could do your complex time in the lake while getting the SES? might be worth talking to Joe Joe about...

Rob.. That was my plan before the guy in OK told me 20-25 hours. I wanted to get the SES training and complex at the SAME time and then kick both SES and SEL commercial checkrides in the ass while I'm there. I can do all the maneuvers in my 140, then do the complex required or seaplane required stuff in the Lake.

I don't think it would take 20-25 hours to learn the seaplane or complex stuff. These seaplane schools are claiming it should take around 5-8 hours for a seaplane rating and I think with the remaining hours, I could practice and get good at what I need for the commercial tickets.

Rob wrote:Shebles, Not only will they treat you right on your commercial needs, but you can do your SES in a supercub.

Shebles WILL treat you right. I did a couple ratings with them over the years. Joe and the Old Man still talk about my commercial SES check ride with the Old Man. I had to smack his hand, and told him I was gonna break his fingers if he ever touched "my" airplane again when I was doing a glassy water landing in the Lake. He "fiddles" with stuff and kept messing with trim wheels and levers, which drove me nuts to the point where I had to rap him across the knuckles to make him stop.

Damn good drinking buddy too....

Gump

Glad to hear good things from Shebles.. I guess I'm calling them tomorrow!

That old dude sounds pretty cool minus the fiddling shit but is that not kind of expensive for an instructor and a 172rg, not including the cost of the examiner? $2055-$660 (C-172rg for 6 hours)=$1395
I have not rented since '04 but i think $110per hr for a 172rg is on the high side.
If you do 8 hours of ground before the flying 8+6=14hr of instructor time
$1395/14=$100per hr for the instructor. shoot
So, i'm not sure why do this course regardless of the money if you have already done all of the precourse requirement and you know your stuff, man go do the flight exam. It would be cool to do it in a seaplane though and kill to birds.

Looks like you got some good advice, but if it doesn't work out for some reason and you find yourself back at square one try this site: http://www.private2atp.com/.

You have to register, but if you scroll all the way down to the bottom of the registration page there is a link to their free basic service.

Yeah I don't need ground instruction. And I've flown complex before, but not with a CFI so it didn't count as dual. All I need is to go out, log all 10 hours of complex and then get a checkride scheduled. I thought it would be cool, and useful to kill both sea and land in the same trip but its starting to not look that way.

Scratch Sheble too.. I called and their lake is WAY too expensive, and the lady on the phone was pretty damned rude too. I couldn't even get a word out of my mouth before she was talking 100 words per second! Interrupting me and all this jibber jabbery... jeez.



Well.. shoot. It might be Steel City Aviation in Pueblo. Very polite, cheap commanche (puke) for rent, and they even offered me a car to use while i stay there!

Mister Willie, try contacting Mary Alverson at www.wingsoverwaterseaplanes.com or Brian Schanke at www.adventureseaplanes.org. Both are very reasonable float instructors that will be able to help you with their services or point you in the right direction. Mary has a supercub and I think she has access to a C-185 on amphibs. Both instructors are absolutely top notch, located in Minnesota.

Good grief!!!! $110 an hour is HIGH for a complex airplane????

SOMEbody needs a reality check there.

Check the price of gas, for criminy's sake.

If you think someone is trying to "milk you" for money, it could also be that you're too busy trying to do things on the cheap to recognize reality.

You get what you pay for--at least in many cases.

But, good luck,

MTV

mtv wrote:
You get what you pay for--at least in many cases.

^ That's my thought about Shebles.

I got what I paid for.

I would pay more next time

One man's experience.

I have to agree with Mike, there are not too many complex aircraft that rent for a little of nothing. At the flying club I belong to in Ontario, the PA12 rents for $110 on straight floats or skis and they are talking about increasing that. Most airports I go into in the midwest don't even have a complex plane to rent. With the high price of foreign oil and insurance, everything costs more. Most of us don't even want to try to keep track of what our plane ownership costs every year. If we did, a $200 per hour rental would probably look cheap. Find a good instructor with an amphib, pay the price, you will enjoy it and hopefully learn a little more too boot. The Seaplane Association has a listing of instructors by state. Florida is not a bad place to train in the winter. I'll bet any of the Minnesota boys can point you in the right direction.

It seems that not only the cost of fuel has gone up, but the cost for good insurance in a commercial seaplane is through the roof, especial if you add amphibs into the picture. It is very, very difficult to make a buck as it is in the aviation business. Even if one owned their own complex aircraft it is difficult to operate under $100.00/hr. I fly a 206 that is involved in a partnership, the partners bill each other $90.00 for each hour of flight, just to put things into percpective. Mr. Willie, find a school and instructor that you like and go for it. I purchased a 1960 Bellanca Cruisemaster to build my instrument and complex time, had and am having the time of my life with that bird. More power to you my friend and good luck. Remember GUMPS "gas, undercarriage, mixture, props, safety." Flying to Crane Lake with some fellow Brainerd MN pilots tomorrow, should be great times. I will post with a moose count report.

wow, steve read my mind as I was writing. Brian Schanche is a fellow MN guy. He fly's out of Oak Harbour in Florida in the winter. What are your intentions with your Commercial Seaplane rating Willie. Do you want to fly seaplanes as a profession? Or simply combine the two for the fun of it? You are going to have allot of fun with this.

mtv wrote:Good grief!!!! $110 an hour is HIGH for a complex airplane????
MTV

Where are you finding a $110 per hour complex airplane?

The closest complex airplane costs.. 199 per hour with instruction.

The guy in OK wanted to teach me all of the maneuvers and all of everything in his sea plane. I understand it's his signature that says I'm ready for a checkride, but it's my money and I don't need someone to teach me pointless maneuvers that I already know. I thought 175 with instruction was reasonable for a seaplane, until I realized he wants me to blow nearly 4000 dollars on his training. Not happening, I'm not rich. I work line service for a living.

You do get what you pay for, but Sheble was rude, and I'm a big fan of service. To me, their attitude only reflects the entire attitude of the rest of the company. You guys had a great experience, but even in a phone conversation I didn't like them.

I found a commanche for 126 dollars an hour plus 30 for instruction. Thats 156 an hour and thats by far the cheapest I've found. I hate nosewheel airplanes but.. gotta suck it up I guess. I'm going to have to fly the landplane for now and I can always do the commercial Seaplane add-on later.

Finally..

I figured the seaplane was good for 2 things. A. It would be funner n hell. B. I want to (and please don't discourage or laugh at me) fly the bush for a living. When I started flying fixed wing I thought bush flying would be so much damn fun. When I first touched down on a dirt strip I thought it was just spectacular. Now that I have my own plane, all I do is look for challenging landing spots, like narrow dirt roads, short dirt roads, and fun stuff like that. Well anyways, I think a sea rating may look good in a resume.

Mr. Willie-

MTV was saying that he thinks $110 is LOW for a complex. It sounded as though you were complaining that it was too high in an earlier post.

As for Shebles, my point was if you get what you pay for, then you should pay more somewhere else than Shebles. They are cheap for a reason. Everyone likes the seaplane rating there, sure, but that is a whole different ball of wax than their core operation in Kingman, which is disorganized, chaotic, hit or miss with the instruction - and you found out about their scheduling and accounting 'department' when you called.

Of course this is my experience, others feel differently I'm sure. Perhaps I was unlucky