Looking good Luke!

Cotton is usually good for four apps around here. Pix (growth regulator), an insecticide for whitefly, a dry app of AF36, and of course the defol... So all in all note a bad crop. Although I could do without the defol, as it occurs right when fall melons are popping up or cole crops are being transplanted

A1, I have flown the same Thrush with and without Agtips (winglets). I really liked them for herbicide work as they do really well at killing the voricies. At one time that airplane was setup with Agtips, and a right boom shut off, and herbicide work was a dream in it. It does fine without them though. The best part about having them for me was that at night the strobe would reflect all the way up the tip. This is annoying for about the first hour you fly one set up like that, but after that it becomes so handy in knowing exactly where you wing ends when your trimming something up along trees or wires on a moonless night.

I would have a set in a minute on a lighter plane. We only left them out on the last set of wings because the airplane was becoming piggish.

Take care, Rob

Had winglets on the first Thrush I flew, along with VG's. This one only has 15 degrees flaps, the other one had at least 30 (maybe 40). Both have Garret engines, this one has the -1, the other had a -6, both 400 gallon. Needless to say, the old one I flew was a Hot Rod, but this Thrush is one of the sweetest flying birds I've ever flown [emoji2]

So, considering how different the two I have experience with are, hard to make any claims regarding the winglets. Be interesting to hear what others think.


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I never had winglets on a Pawnee, Callair, or Stearman. The extra rib and wing length that came with droop tips helped the Pawnee 235 HP carry a decent load, especially up at high DA. We all started shortening the spray boom in the 70s to mitigate vortices drift when lawyers became more prevalent.

What's your guys year look like? Is it typically ~4 months of +12 hour days and ~8 months of here and there type of work? Or does it stay pretty constant?

I've had a fascination with dusting for as long as I can remember. Grew up on a farm in the SW. Currently a navy dude but seriously considering getting into the industry once my time is up.

(attempted thread revival)....


I've enjoyed reading this thread from the beginning. Out in Utah on a SEAT contract right now...so this was *funny*....



<quoting>
Typical SEAT Driver;

"Hi my name is 802 err... I mean Maverick... I fly an 802. I'm a SEAT driver and I fly an Airtractor 802. It's the largest ag plane in the free world. The 802. I fly one... an 802. It's so big it needs a type rating, but they wouldn't give me one ... screw 'em.. they don't know what it's like to fly an 802... they're just jealous... of my 802... anyways... my name is Maverick, and I fly an 802..."



<end quote>

Since you revived, I will repeat my Andy Davis story. He was one of my students who ended up working for Jack Frost in the Delta. Visiting him near one of my pipelines, I noticed he had moved up to the 802. I asked him what the two extra blades on the prop were all about. "That means you have arrived," he replied.

With the pilot shortage has it become any easier to get a seat? Couple years ago when to the NAAA convention and talked with a fair amount of operators and the general consensus was spending at least 2+ seasons as a ground hand before even the consideration to fly. Ratings/ hours/ or experience didn’t really seem to change the time line.

Thanks

My *impression* is that ground experience is valued...for a couple reasons:

-while the job involves flying, it's a *application* business....and you have to know/understand the chemicals. Loading requires/teaches you a lot....and as a pilot, you have to be able to have a sense that the application strength/rate/chemical is right. Several of my friends have rejected certain applications, only to have seen someone else put the "wrong stuff" on a crop. The economic damage can be huge....

-your first couple of seasons you are at much higher risk of "being kilt", getting a drift claim, or tearing something up...and before Mr. Operator wants to stick you in a plane where you can do those fun things, he wants to make sure you will show up on time, sober, and will not pi$$ off his customers because you can't be nice to Mr. Farmer, or Mr. Consultant, even when they're being unreasonable. Putting you in a position as a loader/ground guy lets him observe all the above with much less risk to his business.

That said, a lot of times it's simply "right place, right time". I haven't done much ag work in a long time, and got my job as a SEAT pilot due to a rainy day, and sitting in a pickup truck at an airport with 4 other guys, one of whom owns the company for which I have worked for the past 7-8 years. Right place, right time. I darn sure didn't have much to offer...and he needed a relief pilot.


Our company hired a real good young (23 y/o) guy, put him as a relief *driver* the first year, despite him having 3000 plus hours in tailwheel, just to watch the work ethic, and if he would do good on the road. He has a job as a SEAT pilot this year....and has done an outstanding job.


Just my opinion, but I think that while NAAA is okay, your best option is to go to the state meetings, including those states where you don't live, but would be willing to work. Show up on time, and sober....and offer to come visit "on-site" at their convenience.


YMMV.

Hope some of the other guys weigh in....

I agree with what Southern Boy said. I also have been away from it, but I keep tabs on the Kingsleys at Hanger Kafe. Very bad now with tariff on soybean. Most SW Missouri SE Kansas is corn, wheat, soybean rotation.

In my day we started in Pawnee and moved up if we did well. Different than having to start out in a million dollar machine. And the Pawnee could be rebuilt quickly. I traded a really rough Cessna 175 for my first Pawnee.

It is a good business, loading or flying. I was a single plane single pilot to start, which was also common back then.

Understand having to learn the different aspects of the job. Would never want to be thrown into something like that without the knowledge while that amount of money is on the line. New pilots are surely a risk. Every job I have ever had I have always started at the bottom and worked my way up, just seemed there are plenty of ways for someone to get stuck on the ground operator after operator.

I was just a little caught off guard, by some of the people’s answers. Right place, right time was one I heard fairly often, but heard plenty of others who were like sure we always need loaders at $9-$12 an hour. Usually followed by most of our loaders are pilots 3-4 seasons of loading before we even consider trying to train them.

Best one by far (couldn’t help but laugh): “why did you go learn how to fly first, should have spent a hand full loading before even considering that”.

Here's a picture of my Dad sitting in his Thrush letting the P and W warm up. It was about 1979 and he bought the plane new in 1972. He was 59 at the time but got his start in 1964 when Ohio State Univ. had their first aerial applicators school and it was free. He and some others were guinea pigs and got to fly Cubs, Pawnees, 220 Stearman, and an Ag Cat. Dad bought a cut back J-3 with a 125 hp Lycoming to start with in Virginia, then a Quail and then the Thrush. No insurance at first and I think the Thrush was $42,000 in 1972.

Cool old pic, Marty-- got any more?

The Thrush was made from really big steel tubing and had huge bungies. Good airplane to crash in. I really liked the flaperons on the Quail.

Dad sprayed off a grass strip at Emerson IA in mid 1970's. Dad flew it from the factory to Iowa and then back to Virginia. Eventually he based in NW Missouri.

Here are some from the Ohio State Univ. school in 1964. In the VW pic, Dad is standing and the guy in black kneeling was from England. Before the school he'd been in Kenya doing some flying. He put the Ag Cat on its back when he landed on wet grass and hit a dry spot. Dad brought him home to Saluda VA after the school and he was a hit with all the neighbor girls because he looked like a Beatle. Dad didn't ding anything and nobody got hurt but they tore up so much stuff the school only lasted a couple of years.

Dad bought a new Quail Commander(had a GO-480 Lycoming) in 1970. Here is a picture of the factory at Albany Georgia (notice the VW bus without doors) when he picked it up and Ralph Aldridge was the test pilot sitting in the close up. The other pic is of Dad at Ames Iowa and if you look close, the Iowa State Univ dormitories called the "Towers" are on the horizon. One more of the Thrush in about 1974 at West Point VA spraying for his competition that had just bought two new Ag Cats.

Nice pictures. Either the A9 or Quail was my favorite spray plane. Very well balanced and smooth controls compared to the Pawnee, which would work the pilot harder. Kiman Kingsley made the last page of the October AOPA PILOT.

Cool old pics Marty!
Did you get in any cropdusting time in any of those airplanes?

Did you get in any cropdusting time in any of those airplanes?

No never did. Not cut out for all the decision making for "is it too windy" "will someone complain" etc.

Contact, I've seen a Callair used as a tow plane...never saw an A9.

Tell us more about them.


(I started with a Pawnee....it could barely carry it's own weight out in the TX panhandle!)