Hey guys, similar question as the OP. I had a 180hp Super D in the past - loved it,, but I’m going back and forth between that and a 7gcbc for the next plane (Why: I now do back country flying in the west). I don’t need to get in/out of anything < ~1800 ft, but DA is obviously a real thing in the summer (local strips are 3-5k MSL). I plan on dual instruction for TW/spins+upset recovery/basic back country+mountain flying. I’d love another Super D, but I’m worried about a few things:

The fabric belly of the 8kcab for longevity when doing grass strips on a relatively regular basis. Am I over concerned about this?

I’ve only flown a 7gcbc (160 hp) once, but it was on a 5k grass strip, so no real world experience in its shorter field capability vs. 8kcab. Thoughts considering my 1800 ft strip comment above? Is an 8kcab fine for “mid-DA” on 2k+ strips? I felt like the flaps on the 7gcbc enabled a steeper approach, but didn’t really seem much slower than the 8kcab.

I’m not sure the 7gcbc is the best choice for dual instruction for spins and upset recovery when considering w&b/CG (based on what I’ve read). Is that an accurate assessment? This is my primary hesitation with the 7gcbc.

Secondary hesitation with 7gcbc is aerobatic capability. It’s not my #1 priority, but I’d rather do spins/upset recovery in a Super D and I also would like to have that aerobatic capability (mostly for fun, not because I plan on doing a bunch of aerobatic instruction, though I could see that creeping in if there’s enough local demand).

Useful load - Not worried about that, have other planes that haul a bunch. This airplane will generally just have a survival bag behind the rear seat.

So, what do you guys think?

GMK35 wrote:Hey guys, similar question as the OP. I had a 180hp Super D in the past - loved it,, but I’m going back and forth between that and a 7gcbc for the next plane (Why: I now do back country flying in the west). I don’t need to get in/out of anything < ~1800 ft, but DA is obviously a real thing in the summer (local strips are 3-5k MSL). I plan on dual instruction for TW/spins+upset recovery/basic back country+mountain flying. I’d love another Super D, but I’m worried about a few things:

The fabric belly of the 8kcab for longevity when doing grass strips on a relatively regular basis. Am I over concerned about this?

I’ve only flown a 7gcbc (160 hp) once, but it was on a 5k grass strip, so no real world experience in its shorter field capability vs. 8kcab. Thoughts considering my 1800 ft strip comment above? Is an 8kcab fine for “mid-DA” on 2k+ strips? I felt like the flaps on the 7gcbc enabled a steeper approach, but didn’t really seem much slower than the 8kcab.

I’m not sure the 7gcbc is the best choice for dual instruction for spins and upset recovery when considering w&b/CG (based on what I’ve read). Is that an accurate assessment? This is my primary hesitation with the 7gcbc.

Secondary hesitation with 7gcbc is aerobatic capability. It’s not my #1 priority, but I’d rather do spins/upset recovery in a Super D and I also would like to have that aerobatic capability (mostly for fun, not because I plan on doing a bunch of aerobatic instruction, though I could see that creeping in if there’s enough local demand).

Useful load - Not worried about that, have other planes that haul a bunch. This airplane will generally just have a survival bag behind the rear seat.

So, what do you guys think?

Okay, presumably you've read the first page of this diatribe..... I can almost guarantee you that a 7GCBC is going to put you over gross weight with many, if not most potential clients. And, let's consider that: If you're by yourself, and you do something illegal, the feds may come after you, and potentially, there MAY be lawsuits, if you crash in someone's house. But, if you are "holding out", as in flight instructing in any manner, shape or type, you'd better have really good insurance, especially so if you're doing ANY acro (spins included) and backcountry stuff. Liability goes waaaaay up, and it's all you the CFI. If you think I'm BSing, I once owned a really nice Super Cub, on floats. But, I wanted to instruct in it, on floats. Problem was, that plane would be over gross weight with many prospective clients. What does that mean? Anything bad happens, guess what the very first thing the NTSB does during its investigation? Weight and balance.....it's low hanging fruit. And, INSTRUCTING in excess of legal gross weight???? Yow! Guess how that's going to look at a potential aggrieved...

I sold that Super Cub and bought a very nice Cessna 170B with a 180 hp engine, instructed in it on floats/wheels/skis for years and enjoyed it immensely. Never worried a bit about weights.

So, here's my suggestion to you: Find a nice, well kept Cessna 172 with a 180 hp engine. Those things will spin till you puke, trust me, I've done 12 turn spins in a 172. Back country? Why not? It's a great backcountry airplane with the 180. Down side: No tailwheel. So, you skip one tiny bit of your mission. And, guess where the vast majority of risk comes in this kind of instructing? Tailwheel endorsements. You do that gig and you REALLY need to have good insurance, on the plane and on YOU, the CFI.

But, there is no way I would climb in an over gross weight airplane to conduct any kind of flight training. And, BTW, I have flown fairly extensively in airplanes that were often in excess of their legal gross weight. It was legal there, due to them being government airplanes, and sanctioned by the government agency and the FAA. And, you know what that taught me? I want no part of operating ANY airplane over gross weight, legal or not nowadays. I think of how close I probably came back then, and count my blessings, of which there are many.

But, as soon as you "hold out" your certificate and potentially all the money you can ever earn can and will be on the line every time you fly in excess of legal gross weight. Instructing in a 7GCBC is almost guaranteeing that at some point, you'll go there. Or pass up a lot of customers.

I agree regarding flying over gross. 600-650 usable (normal) and 500 (aerobatic) is just fine for me. Though I’m happy to entertain other aircraft that can do the entire mission I want, but with more GW. I’m not sure that aircraft exists.

What are the "specs" on a clipped wing Cub, they are mildly aerobatic I think ?

Mapleflt wrote:What are the "specs" on a clipped wing Cub, they are mildly aerobatic I think ?

Some are Experimental, is there an STC??