But how should you comb your hair first?

The whole idea is to NOT have the prop 'part' your hair......

Sorry. Couldn't resist.
lc

Our 206s have handles just forward and down from the windscreen, I hold that and prop from the rear. So far everytime I have had to prop them was on a beach or on icy ramp, no way am I getting in front of that thing. On the 207 I open the nose baggage compartment, always have somebody who knows what they are doing on the controls.

Hey MTV, I was making a joke. Were you? Just checking...
Here is a thought though... in regards to complex machinery.
Since the single point of failure (either P lead) can and will make a mag continuously hot and very dangerous, why not actually give it a real test periodically? Instead of the briefest of groundings, with the key switch at low RPM... which might not catch a frayed P lead subject to vibration and intermittent failure... just shut off the engine now and then with the key switch... or toggles depending on the vintage of the machine. It is a thorough test, does no harm and conculsively shows grounding of both mags. (Well, for that day and time anyway)
Many of the vintage planes have no mixture idle cutoff function and are always shut down with the mag switch as I am sure you are aware. Just a thought, to throw into the mix out there.
Have a great weekend.

A little off topic. This guy does hand prop a 3 blade rotax... I'll leave you to your own conclusions regarding proper technique.

GroundLooper wrote: This guy does hand prop a 3 blade rotax...

A 2-stroke at that. Not sure I would let that particular guy handprop my bicycle.

Just don't do it like this!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPWJHj13 ... re=related

Couple cents here from the peanut galery.
I have only owned 2 planes both required hand propping to start.
I have always propped from the front with the tail tied down.
I will soon have to learn to do it from a float...we'll see how that goes come spring.
One thing I have not seen mentioned is the fuel shut-off.
After the carb is allowed to fill & I prime the engine with 4 flips, I turn the ignition on & fuel back off.
Don't know how effective it would help in an emergancy as it takes a minute or two to quit, but it makes a little sense to me from a safety perspecitive

On the Cub I hand prop from the back. I prime and set the throttle as required by conditions but the mixture will be pulled to lean cutoff. If all goes as planned, after the engine fires I reach in and push mixture rich and go about the flight. If I can't get to the panel on schedule the motor quits. It's the best safety system I can utilize.

Guys who've never propped a plane should learn how so they aren't intimidated by the process. It doesn't take a big physical effort to prop a plane.

What feels most secure for a given individual on a given plane on a given day? What is your follow-through trajectory? When is your stance in-balance vs. out of balance? Where is the most secure footing and handhold on that particular configuration? Four-cylinder or six-cylinder?

Hand-propped a Taylorcraft for hundreds of hours. Generally felt best from behind, but not always. Cessna on tall gear and big tires, I usually like the front, but not always. Always tied the tail whenever possible.

Do a couple imaginary throws. Visualize the follow-through. Check your egress path. Check for trip hazards and slippery footing. Re-tie your shoelaces. Check for loose clothing and hair. Grab hold of the prop at a point that gives you mechanical advantage but doesn't put you out of balance at any point in your throw.

If you have a helper but he/she isn't proficient on the brakes and mixture, then standing in front of the horizontal stab may be the next best way to prevent the plane from getting away.

Never had to try it, but am told by a long-time Helio pilot that a gear-driven prop is a whole other animal when it comes to hand propping.

Once you prop a plane and find out how easily and slowly the prop can be pulled through a compression stroke and have the engine fire off? You'll have a new respect for the warnings about taking caution when moving a prop when you aren't intending to start the plane.

Exactly right StewartB! One mistake that I see alot of people make is thinking they really have to throw that prop hard! All it takes is a nice gentle "over the top" usually, and it'll fire. I watched a guy working himself to death trying to start a Kinner one time.... I offered to help but he knew what he was doing and let me know that, so I stood off the side. When he finally got so tired he wanted to stop, I walked up and cleared it, set it, then eased it over the top and it fired right off. He was throwing it so hard that the impulse didn't pop. He never would speak to me again....oh well, no great loss. I propped Ag-Cats, 195's, Fairchild 24's, and a host of others. I'll take a radial anyday!
I propped a Beaver on floats once...that was my most fun one. Got my hip boots on, turned it way from the bank, and propped it from behind and below..nice slow easy swing....not a biggie, but I got a little wet getting out. I always wanted to try one of our Single Otters... I always prop my Tcraft from the front, but have the tail tied at a minimum....seems like there's usually something I can get ahold of somewhere...if not, I'll do it from behind, but it feels really awkward to me! Cubs are setup to prop from behind. Nice opening doors, and controls where you can reach them. The worst one I ever did was a Sonnerai, with a VW in it. That thing had such a short wood prop and it was so fast to pop and spin that it was scary!
I watched a kid handprop a P-Navajo on a ferry flight one day... not a biggie... it was a cold engine and he had the pilot prime it and got it all set, then a nice swing and it popped off and he just smiled and crawled in and away they went! (starter had taken a crap)
Biggest thing is not to get in a hurry! Take your time and figure out what could happen and where to go... make sure the footing is good, do all you can to keep things in your favor. No sense making it dangerous if you don't need to!
John

HTJ & DP,
Thanks for chiming in with lots of real world experience hand propping on a wide variety of airplanes.....
Your seasoning/experience shows and is valuable to share with those many/most of us with less experience.
Again, thank you,
lc

The J3 I fly I prop start from the back. Standing on the right side of the aircraft left hand on the door ledge and right arm to give the prop a flick. That way you're close enough to catch the throttle if you need, to give it a tweek to keep it running.

GroundLooper wrote:A little off topic. This guy does hand prop a 3 blade rotax... I'll leave you to your own conclusions regarding proper technique.

Dave is a lil off in the head.. If you watch some of his other videos and just listen to him talk you will figure that out real quick LOL.
The 582 in his plane is using a 3:1 gear box. The ignition on the 582 requires a minimum of 250 RPM to fire. You pretty much have to do the 2 handed spin the way he does to get enough RPM going long enough to get her to fire. The geared 2 stroke is a lil different animal that proping a tcrate or a cub, or any other direct drive engine with a mag. The mag fires no matter how many RPM you have.

I've done a little hand-propping over the years, although frankly I'd just as soon not. I've never done it from behind the prop, and I've always been pretty careful about footing. I've hand-propped Lyc 320s and 360s and once a Conti 470.

Years ago, I was taking aerobatics lessons in Boulder. I was in the middle of a divorce and on a whim one day, I flew down in hopes that my instructor would be there. He wasn't, but a small woman there said she was an instructor and would fly with me. So we went up in the Decathlon, and she wanted me to show her what I knew, so I did a really good loop, a couple of great spins, and a truly terrible aileron roll. She asked me to follow her through, and when she took over the airplane, it changed personalities completely. I don't remember much more of the lesson, other than that I could never be that good.

After we landed and she filled out my logbook, she asked if anyone there knew how to hand-prop, because she had to get on to her next gig. I was the only one, so I walked with her out to her little red Pitts, started it, and she flew off to wherever she was going. I walked back into the office, and I commented something about how much better the Decathlon flew with her at the controls. One of the guys asked me if I realized who I had just flown with. "No, why?" "That's Betty Stewart, World Aerobatic Champion." Wow! No wonder!

My other hand-prop story of note was at OSH in the late 70s. We had a new TR182 in a partnership, and my family and I had been there a couple of days. When it was time to leave, I left the master on too long while waiting for my IFR clearance, so it wouldn't crank over when the clearance came. A short fellow with enormous arms walked over and said he could hand-prop it. He said, "This is a Lycoming, right?" "Yes, a 540." "OK, get it ready, and when I tell you, turn on the mags." He set the prop, hollered "contact", and when I turned it on, he started a hand over hand sort of thing instead of the usual flipping of the prop. It took several blades, and then it fired. Amazing!

But I'd still rather use the starter. A year ago, I had a new Concorde AGM battery installed, and since then I've had no trouble starting, even when the engine hasn't been preheated and takes a lot more cranking.

Cary

Terry wrote:Ha, found this in an old thread. I'd stick with behind:-)

WOAH! Nice photo.

Cary wrote: One of the guys asked me if I realized who I had just flown with. "No, why?" "That's Betty Stewart, World Aerobatic Champion." Wow! No wonder!Cary

Ummm, Betty Skelton was an aerobatic champion, and passed away a few months ago......

MTV

From Women in Aviation website:
1980, 1982 Betty Stewart (USA)
First and Only U.S. Woman to Win the World Aerobatic Championships (WAC) and First Person to Win the WAC Two Consecutive Times.

From the International Aerobatic Club website:
November 5, 2004 – Betty Stewart and Dorothy Hester became the 30th and 31st inductees into the International Aerobatic Hall of Fame during a presentation at the EAA Museum, Oshkosh, Wisconsin on Friday, November 5, 2004.

Stewart, of Moscow, Idaho, was a member of the 1976, 1980 and 1982 United States aerobatic teams. She is honored as the first person to win the world champion title at two consecutive world events. In 1980, she won three individual gold medals and the title Women's World Aerobatic Champion. In 1982, she repeated this feat winning the title, another three individual golds, and the silver team medal. Stewart continues to support the growth of grassroots aerobatics in both powered aircraft and gliders serving as a judge, critiquer, and coach to aerobatic competitors.

Two different Bettys.

Cary

Preddriver wrote:

Terry wrote:Ha, found this in an old thread. I'd stick with behind:-)

WOAH! Nice photo.

Back for this guy