The interest alone on $68k would nearly net you a decent J-3, let alone a Nice T-Craft. Assuming you take on a 5 year EZ payment plan your talking a big chunk of change EVERY month! Payments get old Fast especially when the newness wears off.

I think everyone should own a shitty old plane to learn the ropes. Buy a beater Pacer and learn the game of certified maintenance, regs, finding and dealing with an IA, etc. It would be a low risk entry to aircraft ownership, even if you eventually intend to own an Experimental.

I'm usually not a proponent of learning things the hard way and empirical data, because there's so much experience and wisdom to leech from websites like this, but in this case, similar to high density altitude, you have to get involved to appreciate it.

Then move on to the next airplane with some knowledge.

Good point Zane.

I'm getting an overwhelming response of 'DON'T FINANCE AN AIRPLANE'. Haha.

I take that advice very seriously.

I (very recently) was presented the opportunity of co-owning a Kitfox 2 for $10k (built by Vic Syracuse). While it's not my 'dream' plane or as nice as the $80k AeroTrek, I wouldn't be in a massive hole if something happened to me financially.

It would also be great to build hours in, learn the ropes of being an airplane owner, and insurance would be a whole lot cheaper (and the wheel is in the right place ). If you have any feedback on that, I'd love to hear it. I would just buy in and have no loan (obviously).

I really do appreciate everyone's feedback. It means more than you know!

A friend once told me, “There are two things you should never share. Your wife and your airplane.”

Squash wrote:A friend once told me, “There are two things you should never share. Your wife and your airplane.”

I sort of agree with this. Was in a partnership on a 1959 C182. It was very taxing. So many little things pissed me off. I have been married for almost 50 years to the same great gal. There are lots of little things that bug me but sex gets me past those things. I am guessing that you probably do not want that with an airplane partner

That said, 10 grand investment in a Kitfox for 1/2 ownership would be much more bearable than 35 grand for 1/2 half of a nice 182B

I'd say that half a airplane you can easily afford beats the hell out of a whole airplane you have to over-extend for.

gtylerdowdy wrote:I'm getting an overwhelming response of 'DON'T FINANCE AN AIRPLANE'. Haha.

I take that advice very seriously.

I (very recently) was presented the opportunity of co-owning a Kitfox 2 for $10k (built by Vic Syracuse). While it's not my 'dream' plane or as nice as the $80k AeroTrek, I wouldn't be in a massive hole if something happened to me financially.

It would also be great to build hours in, learn the ropes of being an airplane owner, and insurance would be a whole lot cheaper (and the wheel is in the right place ). If you have any feedback on that, I'd love to hear it. I would just buy in and have no loan (obviously).

I really do appreciate everyone's feedback. It means more than you know!

1) good call, though I financed my airplane. I’m glad I did because the timing was right for a one-off-a-kind airplane, but I hate paying the interest every month.

2) are you in the southeast? I met Vic once in GA.

Squash wrote:A friend once told me, “There are two things you should never share. Your wife and your airplane.”

Yep, I agree!

Hey CamTom,

I am in the Southeast. I live in the Buford, GA area (40 miles Northeast of Atlanta).

I've actually never met Vic. I've just heard great things about the guy and his builds.

You in Huntsville, AL?


Side note: After seeing all these replies, my hope is this post will help some people in the future. Not that it's 'special' in any way, but i think people can be closed off to being completely open with their (basic) financial situation. I figured it's better to air it all out than make a bad decision based on pride, haha.

I'll keep y'all updated with what I do!

gtylerdowdy wrote:You in Huntsville, AL?

I am, let me know if you’re ever nearby!

We have financed two planes. I looked at it a bit differently. We could have paid cash for either, but decided not to. Both were inexpensive and we put a decent down payment on both, leaving us with a principal balance that would be low enough that in the event we had to sell the plane due to a financial emergency we would never be "upside down" on the loan, even if we had to dump it cheap. I thought that even though a plane is a pretty liquid asset if we needed money NOW for some unexpected reason it would be nice to have that extra bit of cash we would have paid for the plane. Neither loan strained us financially and if some mechanical (or other) issue deemed the plane useless and we ended up eating the loan, we would be just fine.

Pete

pburns wrote:We have financed two planes. I looked at it a bit differently. We could have paid cash for either, but decided not to. Both were inexpensive and we put a decent down payment on both, leaving us with a principal balance that would be low enough that in the event we had to sell the plane due to a financial emergency we would never be "upside down" on the loan, even if we had to dump it cheap. I thought that even though a plane is a pretty liquid asset if we needed money NOW for some unexpected reason it would be nice to have that extra bit of cash we would have paid for the plane. Neither loan strained us financially and if some mechanical (or other) issue deemed the plane useless and we ended up eating the loan, we would be just fine.

Pete

Same here, just because you use a loan doesn’t necessarily mean you’re not well off enough to own a plane. I’ve financed 2 GA planes, had to overhaul the engine on one prematurely and our finances were not strained. If I waited until I had the cash for a plane + $25k set aside for incidentals I would have waited another 5 years to buy, paying interest to have the privilege of owning my plane was worth it to me. I’ve seen too many people work their ass off for years to get all their ducks in a row before they retire or start enjoying life, only to die of cancer or something else in short order. Not for me. FWIW I agree with others, I’d buy an older LSA plane before I paid $80k for an Aerotrek, they just don’t do much for me. I don’t see the advantage of it compared to a well maintained Cub or Champ, anything can break.

I’ve also financed 3 commercial airplanes, 2 being six figure loans, and they were ridiculously easy to get approved compared to a GA plane. Don’t get discouraged if they are pretty hard on you in the loan process, they just seem to have a lot of boxes to check before they loan you the money. On my 182 I used an unsecured loan through Lightstream, I preferred that over the loan process I went through buying my Cub.

pburns wrote:..... I thought that even though a plane is a pretty liquid asset if we needed money NOW .....

I wouldnt consider an airplane much of a "liquid asset".
I can sell stock or mutual funds overnight,
whereas my old C170 took 7 or 8 months to sell.

gtylerdowdy wrote:I'm getting an overwhelming response of 'DON'T FINANCE AN AIRPLANE'. Haha.

I take that advice very seriously.

This might be worth further consideration.

We live in a system where capital is available to help us meet our needs, advance in society and to do the things that we want to do.

Student loans allow for a person who has no significant income to go to school to become a lawyer, an engineer, an accountant or a doctor to move on and make a great living. That's an example of wise debt.

Borrowing money for real estate is a way of life for many in America. This is most often a winning prospect as rent goes up and mortgages typically don't (at least these days).

Taking a loan on an airplane can make sense if: 1. you are all in and 2. you are goal oriented in aviation.

I financed my first airplane and took a smaller loan on #2, then paid it off pretty quickly. In both cases, I wasn't stretching it financially. #3 and #4, I paid cash for and had/have successful partnerships.

1, 2, 3 or 4 never would have happened if I didn't take a chance and get a loan on #1. I would have been renting otherwise, and most likely would have given up on aviation because of the cost.

Aside from building a decent pilot resume, I have met many amazing people along the way, developed an attitude of responsibility, pride and diligence in ownership and airmanship, visited some amazing places and experienced many truly unbelievable moments in my planes.

My primary career is in Aeronautical Engineering, but my flight experience accumulated over a couple of decades presented me with the opportunity to transition in to a pilot career. I've had a blast with different flying jobs over the past several years, and it has given me the opportunity to work away from the desk.

Would I trade all of this for the interest that I paid in the beginning? ABSOLUTELY!

The important questions in this situation are whether the airplane will only be a recreational toy (flying jet ski)? - Or can the personal growth associated with having it produce a return or other career options over a span of 10-15 years?

For the latter situation to work out, you need to commit to a lot more flight training beyond a private license.

LSA aircraft are generally toys, but a 172 or 182 with an IFR panel can be had for less than many of the LSA offerings.

Talk to other aircraft owners and run the numbers to know what you would really be getting in to.

Upon encountering financial distress, I would much rather be faced with the need to unload a Cessna 182 than a 4 year old Silverado with 100,000 miles on it.

My $0.02

I’m of the other school of thought, and about the same age. Income is reasonable equitable, however, my wife doesn’t work.

It’s all about how fiscally responsible you are. Do I have a loan on my 180, yes. Could I do some things and move money around to not have a loan on it, yes. Could I just pay cash for a cheaper plane and not have a payment, yes. Interest is a cost of doing business but it doesn’t make sense for me to pull money out of the market making 12-15% to avoid 5% interest on the plane.

You only live once, you will only be young once. I didn’t want to wait as mentioned until the utmost opportune time only to enjoy aviation for a short while due to an illness, car wreck, or who knows what else.

I agree with others on here Don’t finance fun. Look around for a older gem fly the heck out of it. Look north Canada’s economy i fear is going to be in the toilet and there will be some good used aircraft on the market. Just don’t bid on the one I want.

David K wrote:I agree with others on here Don’t finance fun. Look around for a older gem fly the heck out of it. Look north Canada’s economy i fear is going to be in the toilet and there will be some good used aircraft on the market. Just don’t bid on the one I want.

Which one is that?

Hang in there David K. The Northwest Passage is going change things.

WWhunter, Haha not in the market but every once in a while there is a beauty that comes up and I have to force my self to look the other way.