Hi Guy's, guess I'm responable for starting the mess Zane locked out. I just reported what I read on the FAA accident reports about the accidents at Solder Bar. Repeat, FAA accident reports! It was well known and documented. I was ask by a member to remove my post as he is one of us. Why are some trying to hide somethimg that the FAA knows all about? If the FAA doesn't know anything about it that's another story, I sure wouldn't take it upon myself to post on a public forum anything about an aircraft accident that wasn't reported, that's not my duty. If I'm in the back country and see or witness an aircraft accident it's not my duty to report it, or is it? Guess that would depend on a whole lot of things. I would only report anything if the owner/pilot ask me to and then I might still be hesiatant. I would never post anything harmful to the BCP or GA. Repeat this was on the FAA site and every pilot in the world can read about this accident. Sorry Zane. for all the BS this created for you.
Sincerely, Ron Lewark

It's not about hiding anything. It is about the potential damage from the erroneous or speculative info that invariably gets posted. Until the investigation is complete, any false info could have long lasting negative effects. The fact that the FAA knew that the incident occurred does not mean the "know all about it". That process takes a long time. Any armchair piloting and guesses as to what did or should have happened can easily taint the process. There seams to be a persistent belief that the FAA is some omnipotent entity that knows all and sees all. Not true. They get their info from a variety of sources over time. No sense in putting them on to a scent that might be harmful. As in most things in life, perception is everything. Once an incident gets painted in a bad light, it is much harder to clear it up.

s-12 flyer, The FAA or NTSB doesn't give a damn about erroneous or speculative info when they investigate the accident, and that investigation happens soon after the accident. I've recovered a number of aircraft accidents here in Co in the last 40 years or more, and been on the site before and long after they leave. How many have you done? And the NTSB covers 99 % of aircraft accidents, not the FAA. I've also know some of them. So your potential damage theory means zip/nothing. Next time we go recover an accident I'll e-mail you to come over and help, and you might learn something about aircraft accidents and investigations. I live here in Frisco, CO, a short hop for you. And you feel that my post on Solder Bar will put the FAA on a bad scent that might be harmful, BS! I must have touched a nerve for your response. Don't run your mouth if you don't know what you are talking about.
Ron

skywagon guy wrote:s-12 flyer, The FAA or NTSB doesn't give a damn about erroneous or speculative info when they investigate the accident, and that investigation happens soon after the accident. I've recovered a number of aircraft accidents here in Co in the last 40 years or more, and been on the site before and long after they leave. How many have you done? And the NTSB covers 99 % of aircraft accidents, not the FAA. I've also know some of them. So your potential damage theory means zip/nothing. Next time we go recover an accident I'll e-mail you to come over and help, and you might learn something about aircraft accidents and investigations. I live here in Frisco, CO, a short hop for you. And you feel that my post on Solder Bar will put the FAA on a bad scent that might be harmful, BS! I must have touched a nerve for your response. Don't run your mouth if you don't know what you are talking about.
Ron

Seriously dude, you need to chill. I did not say that your post did any harm. I said that the speculation and B.S. that invariably get posted on threads like that CAN be harmful. While I have not done any aircraft recovery , I have been an active member of SAR for decades. I know a thing or 2 about accident investigation. I will be glad to call you the next time we spend all night looking for stranded hunters in subzero weather. Your post said "the FAA knew all about it." That is why I mentioned the FAA and not the NTSB. Many investigations are on going for days and weeks.
If you are so set on transparency I will be glad to post every minute detail of your next mishap.
Next time P.M. me if you want to piss and moan.

I can see this forum without Zane is going to be interesting.

skywagon guy wrote:s-12 flyer, The FAA or NTSB doesn't give a damn about erroneous or speculative info when they investigate the accident, and that investigation happens soon after the accident.
Ron

I lost all my ratings and certificate 5 years ago because of this very thing. Thats not speculation, its very honest Ron.

I am by no means questioning your experience etc. Trust me.

All of this BS going on here needs to stop. The top five threads here on the site now are just crap. Everyone bickering, etc. Its not getting us anywhere.

Ron- I did send you a PM asking to take the post down only for the sake that the week prior we were dealing with all of this "speculation stuff" and "Idaho backcountry" and how sensitive it is, etc. People do look at these forums and yes you can find stuff on the internet etc and often times its not factual. Heck the FAA reported a Widgeon crashed at Soldier bar and that was not factual.

The feds have nothing better to do than observe everything and grasp for all. It actually amazes me how much they really do look here. I now know every Fed in the Reno FSDO now by first name and all of them have said at one time or another that they look at the flying forums.

All of us want GA to thrive and prosper along with learning something as well. I just think we all need to respect what it is we do and let the facts or persons speak for themselves. Shit, just this AM on the Skywagon email list a guy sent out an email talking about the cub that clipped the tree at JC. He went on to say the pilot sustained major injuries and the plane was totaled. WTF is up with that. Its so far from the truth its pathetic. As someone mentioned in another thread here, there are people that have nothing better to do than race for the phone to be the first to notify officials or say that they we there when they were not.

We need to police ourselves (posts) and hope that those involved will at some point share with the rest of us. Even more so when they are avid posters here and on other sites. I have spoken to Matt personally about his scenario and he will share with the rest of us at some point. For now just read the NTSB report and take it for what it worth. No need to speculate.

I have been there. Its very humbling and humiliating when you read all the BS that someone thinks they know. And then of course the arm chair quarterbacking begins like we have nothing else to do but give our 2c. Its all just a waste of time.

I sincerely hope that this site gets back to its old ways of good ole fashioned flying porn and shared learning experiences from all of you that read this. Its not that difficult if we just try.

Who really cares if your from Kalifornia, Idaho or Kansas. We all share the same passion for burning holes in the sky...

Peace

AKT

Akt, you are 100% right on your post, great post! Yes, i'm sure there is some snooping around on all the aviation forums by some Govt. agencies.I would have to say what they read is taken with a grain of salt. Yes, after talking to one of my best flying friends, Joe Stancil, I know a lot how they work and the tactics they use. I don't know how to remove a post and by the time I got your note, there were many replies to the post. Sorry.

S-12 flyer, pin a rose on your nose! What I put in my last post was as far from pissing and moaning as it gets. I was stating facts. As far as SAR goes I've done some here in Summit County also, plus flying SAR for the Summit County Sheriffs Department many times over the last 40 years. I've went out on many SAR for lost snowmobliers over the years. I get tired of listening to someone running their mouth, knowing nothing about aircraft recovery, investigation or such. Chill, your the one that needs to chill and accept reality, DUDE. Dude is a slang word that my 25 year old grandson even quite using several years ago. Don't know what got into your arse, but wish you well in your recovery. Hey Dude, keep the pointy end forward and the dirty side down.

I still don't feel there is a problem with posting known accidents, such as the post today on Moose Creek, maybe I'm wrong with that outlook. Yes I saw the post on the JC today on our 180/185 forum, It was not a true report, don't have a clue where the poster got the info. If I don't know for sure what I'm posting, I'll pass. WE need to tread lightly in our BC and do all we can to keep what we have and maybe get a few strips back. On my first trip into the Idaho BC strips in 1969 in my 180 we could do a lot more and get away with a lot more, those days are long gone.
Cheers, Ron

Oh God, not another long winded thread. It's not rocket science to understand the probable "situation" at xx LZ. Just do the math. Short mountain strip + one way + up hill + potentially high D/A = little room for error with predictable results. There I'm satisfied.

I'm glad Matt's ok. The rest of this I don't give a shit about.

denalipilot wrote:I'm glad Matt's ok. The rest of this I don't give a shit about.

X2 Amen brutha

Same here. Can we just merge this post into last weeks long winded one, bury it, and move on to good pilot porn...please?!?!

aktahoe1 wrote:I sincerely hope that this site gets back to its old ways of good ole fashioned flying porn and shared learning experiences from all of you that read this. Its not that difficult if we just try.

Who really cares if your from Kalifornia, Idaho or Kansas. We all share the same passion for burning holes in the sky...

Peace

AKT

X2!!!!!

This last 2-3 weeks has been something on here. Please believe me. I do not wake up each morning and think to myself, "Hmm, who can I piss off today? or, "What's going to get me wound up today on BCP?" I'm really not here for the BS!! I apologize if I have gotten sucked into some of the heated discussions Again, It's not why I'm here and I'll do my very best from this post on to not get involved in the BS crap. Most of you may know that I'm not too easily offended by much. But, I will bark back if I feel the need to do so (but it's usually for good reason).

Anyway. I thank Zane and Matt for a great site and I hope we all can get back on a positive track. This is the only flying website a visit every day (ok, every hour [when I'm not working])

And like Kevin said. It doesn't matter if your from California, Idaho, Florida, Maine or even Spokane, WA.. We all share the same passion for flying and exploring the backcountry airstrips!!

Have a great weekend my friends!

58Skylane wrote:It doesn't matter if your from California, Idaho, Florida, Maine or even Spokane, WA.. We all share the same passion for flying and exploring the backcountry airstrips!!!

Why no mention of Utah? I'm tired of my home state being your red headed step child!


Oh wait.... I don't mind at all.. Carry on!

WilgaBeast wrote:

58Skylane wrote:It doesn't matter if your from California, Idaho, Florida, Maine or even Spokane, WA.. We all share the same passion for flying and exploring the backcountry airstrips!!!

Why no mention of Utah? I'm tired of my home state being your red headed step child!

Oh wait.... I don't mind at all.. Carry on!

Retarded red headed step child

I like the freedom to verbally duke it out. I have said this many times and it applies here. If you don't like what you are reading go read another thread.

If you keep this up I will take the duct tape off zane and let him out of the locked closet.

WilgaBeast wrote:

58Skylane wrote:It doesn't matter if your from California, Idaho, Florida, Maine or even Spokane, WA.. We all share the same passion for flying and exploring the backcountry airstrips!!!

Why no mention of Utah? I'm tired of my home state being your red headed step child!

Oh wait.... I don't mind at all.. Carry on!

It doesn't matter if your from California, Idaho, Florida, Maine or even Spokane, WA., OR what ever part of the globe you may be from!! Including Utah

Jr.CubBuilder wrote:

WilgaBeast wrote:

Oh wait.... I don't mind at all.. Carry on!

OMG! That thing's almost as ugly as a Maule

.

OHHH Now ya gone and done it..... Just had to throw that out there didn't ya.


And does some one need a puppy ?!?! oh wait wrong crowd...lol (some of you will get that )