Hi all,

I am a quarter inch away from buying my first plane. It’s a Taylorcraft BC12 with a 65a. I’m absolutely stoked but am having some concerns about the solo hand propping. I had a couple of questions related to this that I was hoping y’all might be able to help me out with. I’m looking for tips, tricks, and answers to the following questions:


First - how can I safely and easily hand prop the plane solo? The owner was telling me that It can be done from behind the prop on the passengers side. So I’m guessing you just start it then jump in really quick and hope it’s not rolling? Or is the parking brake generally strong enough to hold it in place? I’ve seen videos where people tie the tail wheel down, but that seems like more of a 2 person thing. Anybody have any experience with this?

Second - If the solo hand propping just isn’t gonna work out, then how expensive is it going to be to get a starter put in? There’s no electric right now. How much weight would this add? Are there even any options for this? Who do I call/where do I take it to get something like this installed? Currently out of Anchorage.

Thanks for the help!

Best trick I was ever taught by an "old timer" (my father) primer her all up, get her ready to go and then turn the fuel off. If you somehow miss getting back on the horse she's only going as far as the fuel that's in the line; it will not be very far then silent, other then your accelerated heart rate

My experience is with the original Stromberg carburetor.

What you were told about propping from behind or tying the tail allows a hand on the fuselage until entry. What Maplefit's dad said is safe.

Starter and generator require a rear case, more weight, and more oil seep and hassle than propping such a small engine.

There are aural and smell advantages to propping little Continental engines. We can smell gas when too much is in the carburetor. We can hear the gurgle when enough gas is getting to the cylinders.

The fuel air mixture must be right to start.The throttle set,the butterfly in the carburetor, sets the start mixture. Throttle full closed when cold allows little air and thus rich mixture. Throttle open more than just a crack, when engine is hot, allows a scary hot start. Safer to wait for engine to cool.

Emergency start, when nothing seems to work getting the mixture set with the throttle, is to flood the cylinders with primer and set the throttle at least a quarter inch out. Be sure the tail is tied down. Turn fuel valve off and prop until mixture lessens to just right and varoom! Keep working with throttle setting as this is dangerous but will get you home.

The A-65 is a pleasure to start on the first pull, when we have mastered the throttle mixture setting.

The door on a Tcraft opens up all the way forward to the boot cowl, so you can still get your arm in there. Mine has an 85 and no electrical. If I can tie the tail I stay out front, if I can't I usually prop from behind. The Stromberg likes to start with no throttle, so that's a plus too. Shutting the fuel off is good, but you can still get into trouble there if you're not vigilant.
As said, there's a special "romance" in starting it by hand. Not to mention the lack of a bunch of unnecessary weight! Metal props make it easier, as they have a little more momentum. Learn to do it safe, and don't let anyone or anything distract you.
I'd say go for it!!! You'll love it!
John

As said, propping from the back is fine. I feel it is safer.

I always propped mine that way. One had Case Tractor mags.

Those Shinn brakes will not hold, and I would not trust any other brake fully if the throttle jumps.

The safety comes from being behind the prop and the direction the plane wants to go if the throttle is set wrong or it opens itself.
Plus there are things to grab on to.

After flicking the prop down you can reach in and fiddle with the throttle to encourage it to keep running if needed.
Once the engine is percolating nicely you move the noise control to "less", and go untie the tail if tied.

I always tied the tail if at all possible, unless a competent pilot was in the seat. When light it will surprise you how quickly the Tcart can leap forward when lit off.

There are several discussions on this site about tying the tail with slip knots and such, but the gentle Tcarts will behave once in idle, and a regular tie will do.

Enjoy you Tcart.
Bill

Always tie the tail if possible. Learn to tie a quick release knot you can sit in the plane and release the tail. Pick up a set of plastic RV wheel chocks and tie a rope to them. Once you get it started you can pull them into the cab. It will take a bit of practice but should work when you don't have a tail tie down. Always prop from behind the prop. DENNY

For you who stand behind: ISTM that the prop is pitched such that you’d have to put your fingers over the top of the blade. When I learned to prop, that was a huge no-no because of the risk of injury if it kicks back. Do you have to put your fingers over the top?

And for the OP: if you stand behind, PLEASE don’t do that bounce against the compression before pulling through, as is done by almost every YouTube hand propper. If it’s set up right, that bounce might be all it needs to fire. Then you might be called Lefty, or Van Gogh, or something from Dawn of the Dead.

Gypsy Major engines are fun to hand bomb

Small engine and less compression, StuBob, makes the 65 through 90 hp Continentals less offensive. I have experienced what you mentioned on the 235 hp O-540 on Pawnee and used smear hold you mentioned. I ferried a Pawnee without a working starter from Ontario, Oregon to Bainbridge, Georgia, drank a lot of coffee, and shut down in populated places. Mean when had to hot start. And scary at that RPM.

StuBob wrote:For you who stand behind: ISTM that the prop is pitched such that you’d have to put your fingers over the top of the blade. When I learned to prop, that was a huge no-no because of the risk of injury if it kicks back. Do you have to put your fingers over the top?

And for the OP: if you stand behind, PLEASE don’t do that bounce against the compression before pulling through, as is done by almost every YouTube hand propper. If it’s set up right, that bounce might be all it needs to fire. Then you might be called Lefty, or Van Gogh, or something from Dawn of the Dead.

Putting your fingers over the edge of the blade on these engines when propping from behind is no big deal. You’re THROWING the prop through, so hand should be well out of the prop arc well before that next blade shows up.

More than likely, that engine has no provision for electrical, as contact said.

You can tie the tail, start the engine, then, once the engine is at stable idle, untie the tail. Slip knots are not needed, but if that makes you happy.....

There will be places where there is no place to tie the tail. Just learn to start the thing SAFELY and enjoy the airplane. Find someone who’s hand propped a LOT, learn to do it right, and ignore the nay sayers.

Do NOT rely on a park brake to hold an airplane.

MTV

MTV, can he still go to any uncontrolled field under Class B or has Mode C Veil ended that? The no electric never had electric grandfather clause?

I’d tie the tail down until you get familiar with starting from behind the prop. No need to start in front, these engines have hardly any compression for that method. Plus after a while you will know exactly how many primes, how far to crack the throttle and how many times pulling it through until it fires up. Every engine is different on what it takes to start cold or hot. My A-65 takes one good prime, 4 pull throughs mags off, with the throttle cracked 1/8 inch, then mags hot fires up first pull. When engine is hot I go straight mags on both, Throttle closed, and it fires on first pull. My other cubs where never that easy.
I wear a leather glove and prop from the rear, not because of kick back(never happens) but so I don’t get finger fronts and smudge on my shiny metal prop.

contactflying wrote:MTV, can he still go to any uncontrolled field under Class B or has Mode C Veil ended that? The no electric never had electric grandfather clause?

Not MTV, but YES, he can still fly an airplane that has NEVER had an electrical system under the Class B and within the Mode C veil... Still a good idea to have a hand-held radio to talk to ATC, but I don't believe you even are required to be talking to them.

It’s already been said, but I watched a guy hand prop a neat old champ with a set of wheel chocks that had a long line tied to them. He had the free end in the cabin, and when he got in and got settled he yanked the line and put the chocks behind him.

I wonder if tying the tail can be done similarly with a long loose end that you can pull to release from the cabin. I think you’d leave the line behind in that case but if it’s your home field you might could get it back after you return.

1st year for me handpropping and I have tied the tail or received a prop every time other than when I couldn't turn around with skis on once. If I am stopping somewhere that no one is around I will make sure I park next to something I can tie to. I carry a length of static line with a carribiner on each end. Once it's in idle it won't move on grass and can be easily handled on pavement even though I sweat it out every time. My plane also came with these cool parking brakes although I haven't had to use them yet. They actually work. So far so good. The 65's start easy unless you flood the thing.

Pete

pburns wrote:

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1st year for me handpropping and I have tied the tail or received a prop every time other than when I couldn't turn around with skis on once. If I am stopping somewhere that no one is around I will make sure I park next to something I can tie to. I carry a length of static line with a carribiner on each end. Once it's in idle it won't move on grass and can be easily handled on pavement even though I sweat it out every time. My plane also came with these cool parking brakes although I haven't had to use them yet. They actually work. So far so good. The 65's start easy unless you flood the thing.

Pete

Just understand that anyone who volunteers to prop your engine for you is a HUGE and very real liability risk. If ANYthing goes sideways, you are TOAST!

Learn to safely prop your own plane and politely tell bystanders to remain well clear.

Seriously, if you do nothing else as a result of this thread, do THIS.

MTV

CamTom12
The owner of a T Crate in the hanger next to me did just that. Taxiway is in front of our hangers so no tie down handy. He just ran a rope under hanger door with a loop on the end to his tail. Then had a simple quick release knot and rope to cabin. He could prop the plane and never have to worry about it getting out of control. Once he was in the plane he just pulled the rope into the cabin.
DENNY

mtv wrote:Just understand that anyone who volunteers to prop your engine for you is a HUGE and very real liability risk. If ANYthing goes sideways, you are TOAST!

Learn to safely prop your own plane and politely tell bystanders to remain well clear.

Seriously, if you do nothing else as a result of this thread, do THIS.

MTV

Amen!!

pburns wrote:ust understand that anyone who volunteers to prop your engine for you is a HUGE and very real liability risk. If ANYthing goes sideways, you are TOAST!

Learn to safely prop your own plane and politely tell bystanders to remain well clear.

Seriously, if you do nothing else as a result of this thread, do THIS.

MTV

That is a great point. I have only received props from people I know and trust. I have had numerous people want to "help" , but have respectively declined.

Pete

Man I loved my 65hp Champ ! Once I got good mags on it hand propping was easy ..
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DW