Looking for a good light sport Champ so I can go and play......let the medical lapse late last Fall.....sold the 182 on 5/30 and need a bird now. Have been researching how hard it would be to make the gear mods on a 7EC to make it light sport legal. There are a couple of good 7EC possibles up here to inspect.

I'm not sure tou could ever make a 7EC LSA legal. One of the requirements for LSA is that the airplane can NEVER have been legal at a gross weight higher than 1320. I THINK all the 7EC were approved At higher weight at some point. You can't just reduce the GW and operate LS

MTV

Don't think you can change to light sport from a previously certified airplane with higher gross weight. May be able to compleatly dissemble aircraft and put together with other parts and license as experimental thru DER-- but it will be costly. Cessna 140 club tried to get STC to lower gross weight to under LSA weight but failed. Just get a champ or cub and that will quilify . Older rag wing Erocoup and luscome's will also get in. There making "New light sport " luscomes in Flabob airport, Ca. My ex faa buddy signs off the airworthness for the gov.

Why not get something like a Kitfox or Avid? Just as much room or more in some cases and will literally fly circles around a Champ.

AK

Over the last 6 months I've crawled in almost every LSA on the market. Don't know what size you are , I'm fairly large, but after all of the looking and riding I am back to the "Champ". Put money down on one, hope to bring it home soon.
Still have the 206 but the medical is always a hassle........just getting ready to do the samething as you someday
All the research I've done I didn't think the 7ec was LSA, I could be wrong though. Good luck on the hunt. I'll post a pic when I get mine home.

Ak,
Best thing you can do is contact EAA if you have a question. As far as I can see the EC is not listed. Here is a link to the certified planes that can be flown under the LSA guidelines: http://www.sportpilot.org/learn/lsa/sta ... craft.html

Way too many people out there that are misinformed and will tell you falsehoods. Then people take it for fact and soon the internet is abuzz with how someone can 'get around the rules' or thinking what they read on some forum is fact.
I have had more people than I care to count pose a very similar question to me..."Why shouldn't I buy this 7EC advertised for 'x' dollars since it is so much cheaper than all the 7AC-7DC planes I see for sale, Plus I can put on the No-bounce gear and be legal." Most have a gross of 1400+ (?) which is considerable more than the 1320 stipulated by the LSA rules. There is a reason the AC-DC prices are higher.
I am not sure what the designator is for the NEW CHAMP, it very well could be an EC and that particular plane is legal to fly under LSA but you won't find one cheap. www.amerchampionaircraft.com/NewAircraf ... Champ.html
Also if you read 'note 1' at the bottom of the page it does state there were some early EC's with a GW of 1300 and if you can find one of these count yourself lucky. All the one's I have seen were upgraded over their lifetime to the higher GW and once they have been taken over the 1320 GW there is no going back. As MTV states, once it has been raised it can never be lowered and used under LSA. Yes, the rules are that difficult to interpet!

mtv wrote:I'm not sure tou could ever make a 7EC LSA legal. One of the requirements for LSA is that the airplane can NEVER have been legal at a gross weight higher than 1320. I THINK all the 7EC were approved At higher weight at some point. You can't just reduce the GW and operate LS

MTV

I'm gonna have to research that exact question. The A-759 TCDS shows the following:

"Maximum Weight 1450 lb.
1300 lb. (If lower end landing gear oleo strut assembly, Aeronca dwg. 3-433.
is installed."

The TCDS then gives the CG range for 1300 lbs.


So the TCDS seems to show you can make a 7EC a LSA. The rub is the exact difficulty you state, i.e. can you go backwards. Logic (beyond FAA grasp) is that, if you couldn't do it, it would not be in the TCDS


I have found a 7CCM in pretty good shape on 8.50's. The only rub is absolutely no electrics at all. I can live with propping and a hand held com, but would sure like Mode C ( I'm near ANC class c airspace) and some lights I could get flashing to help others see me. The 7CCM I found has the C90-8f engine, so no provisions for electrics at all says my IA.

AvidFlyer wrote:Why not get something like a Kitfox or Avid? Just as much room or more in some cases and will literally fly circles around a Champ.

Could be but I just cannot wrap my mind around carbon fiber prob blades and a rotax or subaru engine. The last Kitfox I saw had 1/2" gaps in the way the doors and cabin, and windscreen fit (probably just a lousy builder) but I just can't do it. I know nothing about the Avid Flyer. An Avemco underwriter also told me yesterday that they will insure a Champ but not any of the experimentals and was also told no regarding almost all of the new LSA birds being built....only older certificated birds.

Bighorn wrote:AK

...Don't know what size you are , I'm fairly large, but after all of the looking and riding I am back to the "Champ"........

Unfortunately, I am not "fairly large". I am 6'3" and 325, i.e. LARGE

AK, as you research that question you will unfortunately find that once and airplane has gone outside the LSA category it cannot return. The LSA rules are quite explicit about that. It is a dumb rule but that is how it is.

AKGrouch wrote:...................I have found a 7CCM in pretty good shape on 8.50's. The only rub is absolutely no electrics at all. I can live with propping and a hand held com, but would sure like Mode C ( I'm near ANC class c airspace) and some lights I could get flashing to help others see me. The 7CCM I found has the C90-8f engine, so no provisions for electrics at all says my IA.

That's the easier way to go. You can run a com radio & txp for a long time with a constant-loss (aka battery only) electric system. Put some battery-minder quick-connects on it, and charge it up once a week or so. Easy to install, but ease of approval depends on your local FAA inspector.
Daytime strobes & beacons are not very effective- (flashing) landing lights work well but are more work to install as well as a bigger power drain. Not sure I'd go to that extent.
I'm sure there must be some other NORDO aircraft in your area- how do they interact with the local class C? Our Navy class C controllers are sometime yes/sometimes no on giving non-txp traffic clearance, depending on their workload.

Pretty sure no one is actually building a new Luscombe. But, an old 8A is a great light sport option.
Nostalgic too... as you hand prop it. If you weigh 300 plus... forget it. Get a Harley.

There are a couple more in the South Central region.
http://anchorage.craigslist.org/fod/3844824179.html

http://kenai.craigslist.org/rvs/3778568209.html

EAA guidance on this topic below. Good luck finding a 7ECA that hasn't been modified to operate at a higher max takeoff weight (note the difference in definition to max gross) above 1320lbs. You most definitely cannot buy any 7ECA and modify it back to the TCDS and call it good. Pretty sure this topic has been thoroughly explored.

http://www.sportpilot.org/questions/afmviewfaq.asp?faqid=415

Have you thought about a t-crate? Some big fellers have good luck getting in them
I'd don't have a problem with mine, but then I'm only 5'7".

alaskadrifter wrote:Have you thought about a t-crate? Some big fellers have good luck getting in them
I'd don't have a problem with mine, but then I'm only 5'7".

Haven't tried a Taylorcraft but am open to the idea. I was very bummed out yesterday when I found I can't put a Champ on. Since the seat doesn't move, there is not much room from the seat back to my chest. Also means the stick would be back under or behind my#$% to rotate or flare. Not good. Discovered and am now considering a RANS S7 if I can find one up here to try on. The designer, Randy Schlitter said he thought it would fit. Like I stated in an earlier post, I'm 6'3", 325, and wear a 3XLT coat and shirt.

Ak

I'm 6'3" 275. Tried the S7 I thought it was tight, didn't like the head room either. Now a S6 (side by side) is a different story. Also the Kit Fox 5 and 6 but they aren't LSA.
Champ seat, Citabria has a slider in the early 70's they are still made, should be able to get a sign off. I have other ideas as well, if your interested send me a P.M. will share.

Uhhh... sorry to say this... but you have to put my beloved Taylorcraft, the Luscombe, the Avid/Kitfox (and the Jeanie's Teenie and Culver Cadet for that matter) on one side of an arbitrary line, pick up your wallet, and walk swiftly to the other side of the line.

(I've had the privilege to meet the Grouch, and he will not be comfortable in any of those airplanes, LSA or otherwise)

Mike and Bill and others are correct. Uphill battle on "backwards compatibility" for LSA weight. It is definitely possible, but you have to figure out just how much of your life you want to invest in arguing the weights and modifications on the TCDS with the average FSDO office.

As has been mentioned, you are probably in need of an Aeronca 7AC. IMHO find an old 65-85HP Champ that fits in LSA now, without a legal battle with the FAA, and maybe make it run a little "healthier" in the crankshaft and carburetion department. That is about as good as you are going to get for a factory built, Continental powered, low-priced airplane with enough cabin room.

Some kitfox 5-7 are LSA compliant, depends on how they are certified. My set up is a kitfox 5 with a lycoming o290D certified ELSA. It has better useful load than a carbon cub LSA and is set up nicely with 125hp. It has adjustable rudder pedals to custom fit a pilot. It's harder to find them set up this way, but they are out there.

Grouch,

Don't waste your time/money on mode c at this point - unless you want to buy my brand new factory upgraded microair mode c transponder (will sell for $1400 - only 2 weeks old - $1000 off cost of new). If you are installing a battery - go mode S - and hook up a small portable garmin gps (used 196/296/396 etc).

If installing new, I would be (am) looking at the very light weight and small Trig mode-s: ($2300 - even TSO'd)

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/avpages/trigtt21.php

Couple that with an ADSB receiver like the stratus 2 and you will have a good setups where not only can you be seen - you can see traffic.

'Greg

hotrod150 wrote:

AKGrouch wrote:...................I have found a 7CCM in pretty good shape on 8.50's. The only rub is absolutely no electrics at all. I can live with propping and a hand held com, but would sure like Mode C ( I'm near ANC class c airspace) and some lights I could get flashing to help others see me. The 7CCM I found has the C90-8f engine, so no provisions for electrics at all says my IA.

That's the easier way to go. You can run a com radio & txp for a long time with a constant-loss (aka battery only) electric system. Put some battery-minder quick-connects on it, and charge it up once a week or so. Easy to install, but ease of approval depends on your local FAA inspector.
Daytime strobes & beacons are not very effective- (flashing) landing lights work well but are more work to install as well as a bigger power drain. Not sure I'd go to that extent.
I'm sure there must be some other NORDO aircraft in your area- how do they interact with the local class C? Our Navy class C controllers are sometime yes/sometimes no on giving non-txp traffic clearance, depending on their workload.