I'm in the same boat. Don't want (or need) 6 bolt wheels
at 2550 lbs gross weight. There's a bazillion 180s flying
around with 8.50s mounted on 3-bolt wheels with nary
a problem.

The copy of the Kenmore STC I was given as a reference is
dated as "amended" 11/12/2002.

Would appreciate definitive info on this one way or the other!

Hi all, here is the information I gleened from my installation of Cleveland 3 bolt wheels and 8.50 tires on Sept 4, 2004. I do not know if there have been changes to these two Stc but have included phone numbers so that you may verify the information.
Lets start with the 8.50 tire STC SA361NW from Kenmore Air Harbor Inc. 425-486-1257, on my installation instructions, last amended Nov 12, 2002,
C180 prior to S# 18052011
C185 prior to S# 185-1471
AND ANY S# with 40-75T (6 bolt wheels)
Must have ParkerHannfin Corp (Cleveland) STC SA63GL installed

C180 S# 18052011 and on
C185 S# 185-1471 and on
with orginal Cleveland Wheels must have 40-75D (three bolt, deep
disc) and 30-52N Brake unless modified with 40-75T wheels per STC
SA63GL

C180 S#18052285 and on
C185 S# 18502091 and on
May be equiped with orginal McCauley wheels Cessna P/N C163004-0101
(3 pcs. wheel) or P/N C163006-0102 (2 pcs. wheel with hru bolts) and
C163032-0207 (LH) and C163032-208 (RH) brakes.
Just as information this STC applies all C180 thru C180K and C185 thru C A185F. The tire inflation pressure is 15 psi for the C180 and 18 psi
for the C185.
Now for the Parker Hannifin Corp (Cleveland) 440-937-6211 or 800-
272-5464 Stc SA63GL. The rev I have is 1/5/95. This Stc applies to both
the 199-62 (75D) and the 199-62A (75T) kit. It requires Cessna axles P/N 9541124 or P/N 1441003-1, I believes these are steel axles but please verify. This Stc is not eligible with crosswind (castering) gear. It applies to all C180 thru C180K and C185 thru C A185F. Both the -62 and -62A use the 30-52N dual piston brake and deep disc. Only the 75D (3 bolt) has holes for hub cap, the brake cylinder assembly is mounted forward of the axle. The 75D wheel assembly wt is 7.25# and the 75T is 8.41#.
Now all that said and done if I was to do it again I would probably go with the 75T wheels as I had based my choice on discussions of clearance problems with wheel skis but I will be using another set of wheels with 7.00 tires. I have Goodyear 8.50x6 6pr which work well, with a slight bulge at 2600-3000#. Sorry for the long post.

1954C180 wrote:Can anyone scan & e-mail me a copy of their Cleveland (Parker
Hannifin) STC SA63GL (Install Cleveland wheel and brake
conversion kit, P/N 199-62)?

I'm interested in the Kenmore 8.50x6.00 tire STC for my '54 C-180
and that STC (SA361NW) says the wheel/brake installation needs to
be per Cleveland STC SA63GL, but the FAA web site (as well as
Parker's) doesn't have any detail as to what SA63GL specifies.

TIA,

Bela, I'll be glad to give ya a copy of that STC....if it means you'll be yanking your panties off ! (wheel panties, that is!! )
I'm still back in the stone age, don't have a scanner but can snail-mail it to ya. PM me with your mailing address.

Eric

zero.one.victor wrote:I'm still back in the stone age, don't have a scanner but can snail-mail it to ya.

Dear Eric,

This is the printer/scanner/copier I got for $89 at Costco.

Actually it's an upgrade to mine because it has a built in memory card reader.

I have it, I will try to scan it and post it this afternoon

zane wrote:

zero.one.victor wrote:I'm still back in the stone age, don't have a scanner but can snail-mail it to ya.

Dear Eric,

This is the printer/scanner/copier I got for $89 at Costco.

Actually it's an upgrade to mine because it has a built in memory card reader.

Actually Zane, I do have a scanner that someone gave me but am too lazy to install it. Plus, then I'd be scanning/uploading stuff, and the slow speed of my dial-up internet service (no high-speed available) would have my patience worn to a frazzle (and my blood pressure in the red) in no time.

Eric

Thanks guys (and thanks Eric for offering to snail-mail SA63GL
to me). I went through my logs last night and found that when
they yanked the Goodyear wheels and brakes off of my 180, they
did put Cleveland kit 199-62 on there, so that's a good sign /
positive trend that this will work after-all with the Kenmore STC.

The panties and little itty-bitty tires are cool for long cross countries
(it'll do 160+mph at altitude) but I'm getting tired of fooling with
them every time I want to add air to the tires, etc. Plus I've
already bumped my head into the trailing edge of the flaps while
walking around in the hangar several times 'cause I'm not used
to the wing being that low

(my 170 had 8.50s on it....).

1954C180 wrote:Plus I've
already bumped my head into the trailing edge of the flaps while
walking around in the hangar several times 'cause I'm not used
to the wing being that low

I had my fair share of "Cessna diamond forehead" this summer. Damn near knocked myself out a few times. I'm 6'1" + 8.00's... I guess that's just not enough clearance.

I'm a short SOB, so don't have any trouble clearing the trailing edges on my wings. But like JR, I have KO'd myself on those #@%*# struts a time or two, usually when in a hurry scurrying around the hangar trying to finish up a maintenance job that's taken too long. Ringing my own bell doesn't speed up completion either .....

Eric

I am glad you said that, I have exactly the same problem.

Dane

Anyone have an IPL of what Cleveland kit 199-62 consists
of? My logs have the SA63GL STC paperwork in there but
no Cleveland installation drawing or IPL parts list. I'm trying
to find out which brake torque plates are specified / used with the
199-62 wheel / brake kit.

TIA,

Bela, check in the back of the Univair catalog. There's a big section on Cleveland brake components. The Cleveland "directory" sez 199-06200 conversion kit uses main wheel 040-07504, disc 164-03600, brake ass'bly 030-05200, lining 066-03000. All the bits in brake ass'bly 030-05200 are detailed in figure B-11 (even further back in the catalog), it indicates torque plate 075-01500 is used. Hope this helps.

Eric

Hi Bela, I can get the number from my installation drawing for the -62 kit when I get home. Unfortunately that will not be until Thursday. I did have a copy of the Univair catalog available and if you don't, I verified that the numbers given you by Eric are correct, sorry Eric, its just part of my trainig to check and verify everything. I will post if this information checks with my drawing on Thursday.

Tim

Kinda like diplomacy-- trust but verify.
I had a couple 8-1/2 X 17 drawing that go with the STC paperwork, but they didn't have the torque plate info on them, not that I could find anyway.

Eric

Thanks guys, but now I'm more confused.... (like that's never
happened before!).

I asked this question elsewhere as well, and one person responded
via e-mail with the following:

"The 199-60 kit (for 6.00x6 tires) uses a 30-52 brake caliper
and the 075-01500 torque plate. The 199-62 kit (for 8.00x6
tires) uses a 30-52N brake caliper and the 075-05401 torque
plate"

I'm guessing that the deeper brake disc that comes with the
199-62 conversion kit uses the same caliper, but the caliper
assy. number changes ("N" added to the end) because the
torque plate is different, hence the brake assembly is different.

My logs clearly state that the 199-62 kit was installed, but I
have a theory as to why things didn't "look right" with the
8.50s installed on my '54 180. The logs state that kit 199-62
was installed in 1995 (with 8.00x6 tires). In 2002, the 8.00x6
tires were removed, and 6.00x6 tires were installed along with
(factory original) wheel pants. My guess is the previous owner bought/
found some original wheel panties, went to install them and found that
with kit 199-62 on there, the brake disc stuck out too far and rubbed
against the wheel pants, so he found/purchased the brake discs
and torque plates that goes with the 199-60 kit (for 6.00x6 tires),
and bolted everything together but didn't say boo about changing the
brake discs & torque plates in the logs (blasphemy!).

In any event, I now have the correct (deep dish) brake discs on
there, but I need to procure the correct torque plates. I had
a set on my 170 (w/8.50 tires mounted), and they're identical to
what I have on the 180 except the outer bushing housing is 3/16" - 1/4"
deeper to accomodate the deeper (164-36) brake disc.

The mystery / saga continues....

PS: FYI, I can't call the previous owner and inquire as to what
the heck is going on as I bought the airplane from his widow....

1954C180 wrote:Thanks guys, but now I'm more confused.... (like that's never
happened before!).

I asked this question elsewhere as well, and one person responded
via e-mail with the following:

"The 199-60 kit (for 6.00x6 tires) uses a 30-52 brake caliper
and the 075-01500 torque plate. The 199-62 kit (for 8.00x6
tires) uses a 30-52N brake caliper and the 075-05401 torque
plate"

I'm guessing that the deeper brake disc that comes with the
199-62 conversion kit uses the same caliper, but the caliper
assy. number changes ("N" added to the end) because the
torque plate is different, hence the brake assembly is different.

My logs clearly state that the 199-62 kit was installed, but I
have a theory as to why things didn't "look right" with the
8.50s installed on my '54 180. The logs state that kit 199-62
was installed in 1995 (with 8.00x6 tires). In 2002, the 8.00x6
tires were removed, and 6.00x6 tires were installed along with
(factory original) wheel pants. My guess is the previous owner bought/
found some original wheel panties, went to install them and found that
with kit 199-62 on there, the brake disc stuck out too far and rubbed
against the wheel pants, so he found/purchased the brake discs
and torque plates that goes with the 199-60 kit (for 6.00x6 tires),
and bolted everything together but didn't say boo about changing the
brake discs & torque plates in the logs (blasphemy!).

In any event, I now have the correct (deep dish) brake discs on
there, but I need to procure the correct torque plates. I had
a set on my 170 (w/8.50 tires mounted), and they're identical to
what I have on the 180 except the outer bushing housing is 3/16" - 1/4"
deeper to accomodate the deeper (164-36) brake disc.

The mystery / saga continues....

PS: FYI, I can't call the previous owner and inquire as to what
the heck is going on as I bought the airplane from his widow....

I would say you are correct. Give me a call I think I have a set of the torque plates.

Hi Bella, I think you are on to something. About 10 years ago I had a 180 that had been ground looped and rebuilt 3 times before I bought it. It had torque plates with short bushings on one gear and long bushings on the other. 8.00 tires barely cleared with the short bushings and I ended up replacing the wheels and brakes do to a spun bearing in a wheel half and needing to correct the torque plate problem. I may still have those parts around, I'll check the length. I also seem to remember that the caliper guide pins come in long and short versions, I may have a removed caliper that has one of each. Some of the things you find on used airplanes make you wonder.

Tim

No offense, but personally I'm more inclined to go with information that is at least semi-official, as opposed to what someone thinks they remember or has jotted down on a cocktail napkin or something. That stuff in the Univair book isn't printed on Cleveland stationary, but I have to believe that it came from them. I don't know who responded to Bela with the contradicting information, but I know what the paperwork I have sez.
The STC certificate sez "installed in accordance with Cleveland installation drawings 50-36 .... and 20-128.." and also "applies only to aircraft equipped with 800 X 6 tires". I have a copy of the referenced drawings, the first is "installation, wheel and brake" the second is "wheel and brake assembly". Neither one ID's the torque plate by p/n, but they do call out brake assembly 30-52N. The Univair breakdown of the 30-52 assembly sez 075-01500 torque plate.
The list of Cleveland conversion kits lists 199-60 as being for 180/185/206/210 with 600 X 6 tires. The kit directory does not include the 199-60 kit, so I don't know what toirque plate it would use.
The bottom line, though, is that 1) the parts must fit & work properly, and 2) your IA (or whoever) must be satisfied with the paperwork. Sounds like you're well on your way to making both things right, Bela.
A freind of mine just bought a PA-22/20 Pacer, it has the original Cleveland hydraulic drum brakes. But one wheel is the original, which uses an outboard bearing retainer (which mounts with 3 screws to the wheel) to mount a hubcap with one screw in the center. The other wheel seems to be a later style, like you see with Cleveland disc brakes, which mounts a hubcap via 3 screws aroud the rim. Go figure.

Eric

zero.one.victor wrote:No offense, but personally I'm more inclined to go with information that is at least semi-official, as opposed to what someone thinks they remember or has jotted down on a cocktail napkin or something. That stuff in the Univair book isn't printed on Cleveland stationary, but I have to believe that it came from them. I don't know who responded to Bela with the contradicting information, but I know what the paperwork I have sez.
The STC certificate sez "installed in accordance with Cleveland installation drawings 50-36 .... and 20-128.." and also "applies only to aircraft equipped with 800 X 6 tires". I have a copy of the referenced drawings, the first is "installation, wheel and brake" the second is "wheel and brake assembly". Neither one ID's the torque plate by p/n, but they do call out brake assembly 30-52N. The Univair breakdown of the 30-52 assembly sez 075-01500 torque plate.
The list of Cleveland conversion kits lists 199-60 as being for 180/185/206/210 with 600 X 6 tires. The kit directory does not include the 199-60 kit, so I don't know what toirque plate it would use.
The bottom line, though, is that 1) the parts must fit & work properly, and 2) your IA (or whoever) must be satisfied with the paperwork. Sounds like you're well on your way to making both things right, Bela.
A freind of mine just bought a PA-22/20 Pacer, it has the original Cleveland hydraulic drum brakes. But one wheel is the original, which uses an outboard bearing retainer (which mounts with 3 screws to the wheel) to mount a hubcap with one screw in the center. The other wheel seems to be a later style, like you see with Cleveland disc brakes, which mounts a hubcap via 3 screws aroud the rim. Go figure.

Eric

Thanks Eric. I think the "rub" here is the 199-62 kit doesn't use a 30-52
brake assembly, it uses a 30-52N brake assembly (different torque plate).
If I have my information right (I'm just learning as I go, and you're right,
I'm trying to make my IA happy by having all my ducks lined up
correctly), the 199-60 kit uses a 30-52 brake assembly which uses the
075-01500 torque plate.

FWIW, Dave Clark (you know him, ex 170 guy, now 180 owner) was one
of the responders who just installed a new 199-62 kit on his new 180
(he had the 199-62 paperwork in front of him and said the torque plate
is P/N 075-05401).

When did Dave get a 180? Must be since last summer, I saw his 170 parked up at Stuart then. He just hung a Lycoming O-360 on that 170 a couple years ago and seemed to be real happy with it. Did you know that he's the one who converted that "Cessna 181" that your friend owned?

Eric