I am currently flying a tired set of Edo 2960s on a 1975 C180J, stock engine. There is a set of Aqua 3190s available locally and I’m considering making the switch for next summer. Anyone have experience with the Aquas?

Osprey0470 wrote:I am currently flying a tired set of Edo 2960s on a 1975 C180J, stock engine. There is a set of Aqua 3190s available locally and I’m considering making the switch for next summer. Anyone have experience with the Aquas?

Yes, and I did not like them. It's been a while, and I didn't fly them a lot, so don't remember specifics. Not very helpful. THey need to be cheap. You might be able to find a better set of 2960s....lots of them around and fairly cheap.

Of course, Aerocets are the hot ticket.

MTV

I find the Aquas appealing because they are cheap, they have flat tops, and I expect them to be better performers than the 2960s because they don’t have such long tails. I sure can’t afford Aerocets, I’m tempted by the PKs because they’re close, but the Aquas are here.

If they’re cheap, go for it. 2960s are great floats, but those long tails require some technique for sure.

MTV

mtv wrote:Yes, and I did not like them. It's been a while, and I didn't fly them a lot, so don't remember specifics.

If I recall you thought the Aqua 2400s were a great float, though? It didn't translate the bigger model?

Zzz wrote:

mtv wrote:Yes, and I did not like them. It's been a while, and I didn't fly them a lot, so don't remember specifics.

If I recall you thought the Aqua 2400s were a great float, though? It didn't translate the bigger model?

Yes, different models of a particular brand of float may or may not be great. PeeKay built some real stinkers, and some really good floats. Same for Wipaire.

MTV

They don't have flat tops but don't overlook CAP 3000S. I liked mine a lot, definitely preferred them over the 2960. The CAPs are usually cheap, too.

Fraser Farmer wrote:They don't have flat tops but don't overlook CAP 3000S. I liked mine a lot, definitely preferred them over the 2960. The CAPs are usually cheap, too.

Agreed on all counts. Flat topped floats are for wussie boys who can't swim......

MTV

This may help:

We’ve owned our 180 for 30+years; roughly half that time with 2870’s, half with 3190’s.
Disclaimer: We have a Pponk O-520, and have never flown a stock 180 on 3190’s

On the 2870’s it was underfloated. You’re a little better with the 2960’s, but not much. The 3190’s are a great size for the 180, and have the airplane sitting up on the water, vs down in it.

We fly this airplane a lot, lots of passengers, lots of different missions. The flat tops and large lockers are a significant advantage. Even the very long, flat boarding steps are an improvement over the short tube steps on my 2870’s.

The 3190’s developed a bad rep early on, then at some point the hull was changed and the rear strut length changed. I don’t know when this was, but I know my ‘96 model floats are of the new design.

During the transition,
1. I found the 3190’s had a much narrower sweet spot for optimum acceleration.
2. The 3190’s are less forgiving of any “flat” landings, they will dig in.
3. They are not helpful at the Greenville takeoff contest

-This was all managed pretty quickly with some practice(except still getting my butt kicked in Greenville)
-They handle rough water very well
-They are just as fast despite the size
-Mine weigh just 10 lbs more than my 2870’s(on a scale)

We’ll be in Speculator 6/3-5 if you want to have a look.

Forgot to add, they steer very well.

Also, a photo showing similarly loaded airplanes; both with. one person, light fuel.
2870’s vs 3190’s. (2870 airplane is an early 182, effectively the same airplane)

Great input Aqua. Perhaps I will catch up with you in Speculator. It is right in my back yard and I haven’t been to a fly-in yet.

aqua wrote:Forgot to add, they steer very well.

Also, a photo showing similarly loaded airplanes; both with. one person, light fuel.
2870’s vs 3190’s. (2870 airplane is an early 182, effectively the same airplane)

Good intel. Modifications to rigging sometimes make an amazing difference in performance. “We” ( nobody knows who that is) cut rear struts off to shorten them one bolt hole on EDO 2870s on stock 180s. Made a significant improvement in takeoff performance.

Thanks for the specifics!

MTV

Osprey0470 wrote:Great input Aqua. Perhaps I will catch up with you in Speculator. It is right in my back yard and I haven’t been to a fly-in yet.

Raquette Lake, Home of one of the last good bars left in the North Country where you can still buy a Utica Club or Genny Cream, although they have spruced it up a bit the last couple of years.

Pete

And you can order your burger however you want it, and it will still come out bloody as hell

I have a set of 3190s with rigging for my plane ('55 180) - they haven't been on my plane in a couple of years and are several states away (MN from CO). I need to transport them via trailer (long story). I apologize for the dumb question, but is it reasonable for a non-a&p to partially or fully de-rig them and get them on a 6x12 U-Haul trailer for transport? Any gotchas I should be aware of so as to not damage or create a lot more work for myself on the other side of this trip? Do I need to mark the positions of anything in particular, or is it all gonna need to be re-rigged from scratch anyway when re-installed? TIA

soyAnarchisto wrote:I have a set of 3190s with rigging for my plane ('55 180) - they haven't been on my plane in a couple of years and are several states away (MN from CO). I need to transport them via trailer (long story). I apologize for the dumb question, but is it reasonable for a non-a&p to partially or fully de-rig them and get them on a 6x12 U-Haul trailer for transport? Any gotchas I should be aware of so as to not damage or create a lot more work for myself on the other side of this trip? Do I need to mark the positions of anything in particular, or is it all gonna need to be re-rigged from scratch anyway when re-installed? TIA

No issue. Aqua 180-85 (3190's) are easier to disassemble and reassemble as there are no boxing wires as EDO employs. Detach enough control cable to allow handling the barrels individually once separated. Remove the streamlined wires, steps and struts marking locations and orientation of all. Wrap the streamlined wires individually to prevent abrasion, you do not want nicks or scratches in the wires. Wrap all the struts to prevent them banging into one another during transport. Any nick or dent in the struts and blocks is a potential stress riser. Treat your float parts as if your life depends on them because it does. Remove all 16 deck bolts that attach the spreader bars and slide them out of the float barrels. Mark the orientation of spreader bars as well as the location of each strut attach block. Transport the barrels inverted on the flat with cushioning, strap over the keels at structural locations (I prefer the spreader bar locations). I never place straps aft of the step during float transport as a flexible trailer could place unwanted stress on the tails of the floats, let the tails (aft of step) ride free. I refurbished a set of 3190's several years ago after purchasing, they were in service under a 185. Curious if you or anyone have ever removed the bolts for inspection. Attached photo is what mine looked like, known history, fresh water only. Needless to say, I replaced ALL hardware with new to include the wires and cables. If you need to replace the wood "compression" filler in each end of the spreader bar, feel free to PM me and I can send some shots of my solution using UHMW block which I ran by Terry and Helen of Aqua float. (Not sure of Terry and Helens current status ref Aqua) Have fun. TR

Got 2790s amphibs, they works great but you can’t just chimp jerk them off the water

If it were me, I’d ether just spruce up my edos, or pay up for aerocets and the only reason there is composite IMO

Investment wise, old saying about it’s more about the Indian than the bow

In my opinion, ALL float rigging should be disassembled every once in a while, to check for corrosion. We did this pretty regularly on floats in salt, not so regularly otherwise.

I second and third the caution to carefully wrap and protect those flying wires. And, if you need a replacement, get your order in early and don't bother to ask price.....it'll take your breath away. MacWhyte in Scotland used to be the only source.....maybe more now, but.....

None of this is rocket science. An FAA type might suggest that disassembly of float rigging is not an owner performed task. So don't ask.

Have your mechanic go over the rigging before flight.

MTV

Got my floats "home" to Colorado last summer. Disassembly was interesting - several bolts were severely corroded and will be replaced. The compression wood is rotting. And of course all of my work is overseen, as will the re-assembly and inspection by a certified mechanic with the required log entries. Not today, FAA.

Aqua Floats are now under new ownership. I'm not sure of the implications - but they (Clay?) are working on updated FAA approvals - and I think there is a new compression recommendation that is plastic.

Attached is a photo of my solution to the rotten wood removed from a set of Aqua 180-85 (3190) spreader bars. I coordinated this with Terry and Helen Claggett, owners of Aqua at the time. I used a high-density poly that machines easily and is very similar to the UHMW used on ski bottoms to make a "bushing" for each deck bolt. While you are installing new hardware, inspect those deck fittings and dress any sharp nicks caused by careless hacks with a wrench over the years. Better to remove a small amount of material resulting in a smooth radius rather than leave the sharp dings which may produce stress risers as shown in my photo. I like to NDI all fittings (EDDY Current preferred, FDP acceptable) to ensure I am installing a defect free fitting. Many will call this overkill; however, I call this good maintenance and risk management.

Inspect your tie rods for any bends or nicks as well. It amazes me the condition of tie-rods I see on aircraft floats. Most damage is caused by people using the wrong tool. It is not acceptable to dress nicks in stainless steel tie rods. A damaged tie rod must be replaced.

Have fun with those Aqua's and don't take any grief from others, they are great floats and do exactly as they were designed to do. There are rigging methods to improve your takeoff performance, typically to a detriment to cruise speed. It all depends on your mission. If this piques your curiosity, you can research float to wing chord AOI or shoot me a DM and I can point you in the direction of data.

TR