skywagon63d wrote:.......With all due respect, I would highly recommend some homework on that deal. Avion Research has gone to a lot of expense and trouble to certify the installation, and without their STC, obtaining a field approval for the change to the control system, using their parts may prove troublesome. ...

I'm not sure if the control column is an Avion part -- it may be a Cessna factory part.

Our mechanic in Nervino/Beckworth does these often. Have seen several he has done. Will ask about the STC tomorrow. He has said numerous times that it is very easy to do.

Will wait and see. I do believe it is a Cessna part but not certain.

430 WAAS and a HSI

My buddy with the 54 180 had his mechanic do the center-stack. I'm sure it wasn't an STC'd mod-- maybe not even a field approval, just a logbook entry. Depends on just how it was done & the mechanic's interpretation of the reg's. It seems like if you retain the T-column, all you're doing is moving the radio's around in the panel- a minor alteration IMHO.
Read the applicable FAR's about "major alterations" & it seems like a lot of field approved mod's don't really need to be, as they don't really meet the definition of a major alteration. People are just covering their ass in a lot of cases I guess- not necesarily a bad idea.
How about yours, Mike- major alt or minor alt?

My A&I did it as a repair to panel just a log entry.

It is a log book entry as it is not a major alteration. This is for certain.

Anyone have any photos of there panel?

Mike you have a good one. Actually printed it out. Thinking the Aspen does not make much sense. HSI is for certain however. Any recommendations? Lots out there...with the expense of them, may come back to the Aspen.

hotrod150 wrote:My buddy with the 54 180 had his mechanic do the center-stack -- I'm sure it wasn't an STC'd mod, maybe just a logbook entry & not even a field approval. Depends on just how it was done & the mechanic's interpretation of the reg's. It seems like if you retain the T-column, all you're doing is moving the radio's around in the panel- a minor alt IMHO.
Read the applicable FAR's about "major alterations" & it seems like a lot of field approved mod's don't really need to be, as they don't really meet the definition of a major alt. People are just covering their ass in a lot of cases I guess- not necesarily a bad idea.
How about yours, Mike- major alt or minor alt?

It was a major alteration because I made some changes to the lower panel, which is structural, so I got a field approval. Since I did the mod, there have been some important changes in AC 43.13, and you can now use that AC as approved data for certain major alterations, such as instrument panels and radio racks. It is still a major alteration, which requires the completion of a 337, but as long as the alteration falls within the guidelines, the AI can return the airplane to service without a field approval in block 3. My reading on changing over to a control "U" instead of the "T" is that it would need a field approval or STC, due to the fact that it is an alteration of the control system.

Mike

aktahoe1 wrote:It is a log book entry as it is not a major alteration. This is for certain.

Anyone have any photos of there panel?

Mike you have a good one. Actually printed it out. Thinking the Aspen does not make much sense. HSI is for certain however. Any recommendations? Lots out there...with the expense of them, may come back to the Aspen.

Thanks for the compliment on the panel.

Aspen seems like a good value, and I would love to have one. Just remember that with any of the electronic displays, you have to keep a standby attitude indicator, and if it's electric, it can't get it's only power from the same electrical system as the PFD. You can add the MFD, with a battery backup, keep the vacuum driven gyro, or add an electric indicator with battery backup.

Building the new panel and moving the radio racks also involved a bunch of work. There are more clearance issues than you might think, and I cut several panels before getting one that fit just right. I started by building a mockup out of plexiglass and taping paper instrument cutouts on it, so I could look back behind the panel to see what was going to hit. The original shock mounts will not support the weight of the radio rack, so I hard-mounted the panel to the original mounting points, added some to the new lower panel, and added supports for the back of the radio rack. If I had been paying a shop to do the work, it probably would have been more economical to buy the Avion Engineering package.

Mike

PS Engineering 7000B audio panel (I want to add a ham radio later)
Garmin 430W w/MD-106 ILS
Garmin SL-30 w/MD-106 ILS
Garmin GTX-327 Transponder
Garmin Aera 560 on the yoke

All being put in the 182 - hopefully done by the time I return from Graf.

Don