Battson wrote:Can you post a picture or a description of what's in your panel Cowdog?
I am really interested to hear the weight difference you mention there. I've talked to Mike about setup (he's been really helpful too!) but I would be very interested to know more about your setup as well!
Thanks for your help with my other questions

P.s. Bob made our engine as well, boy did he try to talk me down from the FI....

Yea, Bob isn't an FI guy, but Iit's worth it in my opinion. I decided to do FI for LOP operations if I am on a 500mi leg somewhere. My thoughts have been validated by Georg on the quickbuild list. He is running LOP at 8000 feet. Here is what he says:

When I am on cruise altitude at or above 8000ft I reduce RPM to about 2150 and pull back my mixture to a fuel flow of about 10 Gal. In the meantime I can hear when the engine goes over to the LOP side. Depending on the altitude I can lean a little bit more so I am ending up between 9 and 11 Gal/hr.
Throttle remains full open.
With this setting I usually see between 120 to 125 Kt TAS. (the only speed which counts )

He continues with:

I recently accompanied somebody with a Piper with 180 HP and that airplane used 9 Gal/hr and was cruising at about 80kt. As wingman at this speed my IO 540 was burning 7.5 to 8 Gal/hr. LOP

That is absolutely fantastic speeds for that fuel flow. So much so that I'm thinking about omitting my aux tanks, but then again Ketch to Boeing Field is 650 miles.

Anyway, I'll take the weight penalty for FI, if I don't need to worry about carb ice, the stupid airbox, fuel flow at high angles of attack, and to have a trip computer that tells me how much fuel I'm burning (which is hard to do on the gravity systems and a 540)

Yeah mate, I hear you loud and clear on all of those points. The hammock idea is gold.

If I lived where you do, I'd have the Aux tanks for sure. Little old NZ can be traversed practically end-to-end with normal tanks and just one fuel stop. Besides we have very well spaced airports with pumps available.

Georg has been a great help to me with the induction system design. I'm after that "clean cowl" look without the airbox, and using ram air. If you need measurements etc I can share them.

I thought those lightweight starters Bob runs can draw 185A up to 285A depending? Yours may be different. I'm at 14V too, which is really like 13.8V but meh. I figured on 6% voltage drop or so, maybe more, but Bob has told me he never had a problem running the same setup (less FI...). Easy to change if I have trouble anyway.

Oh - almost forgot to ask - how much weight do you figure on loading into your extended baggage, with a fully loaded plane?

There is a pic of most of our panel in the Where did you fly today thread that Mike posted when he and dad went sheep hunting. Pretty simple, but I am quite satisfied with what we have, that also includes an av80r gps. For cross country I take the iPad with fore flight also. I still have not figured out how to post pictures.

http://www.backcountrypilot.org/gallery ... photo6.jpg

I'll try to get a better one and figure out what I'm doing.

Thanks Maverick, I appreciate that.

That panel really appeals to me. I'm almost through installing ours, and it's quite minimalist too.

You guys gotta stop...your distracting me from my maule research.

Battson wrote:they have Maule breeding but on a diet.

I was under the impression they had a Ribblett airfoil? IMHO that alone makes them potentially a leap ahead of the Maule. Now if they only had a longer wing.
Are they Riblett ribs with a Maule / Piper airfoil (US35b), or ?

Bob's newer designs (Patrol & LSA) have Riblett aerofoils I understand, the Bearhawk is a modified NACA 4412 series aerofoil. Modified to be more like a Riblett I guess....

NACA 4412


I was just speaking to Bob - apparently Harry Riblett cleaned up a minor imperfection in the smoothing near the leading edge which NASA left when they originally designed this aerofoil. A relatively small fix, all said and done.
Bob also said the the Riblett they use on the Patrol is better than the mod.4412, but also that Harry liked the 4412 and always said good things about it (may he rest in peace). It is a reasonably good performer.

Battson wrote:Bob's newer designs (Patrol & LSA) have Riblett aerofoils I understand, the Bearhawk is a modified NACA 4412 series aerofoil. Modified to be more like a Riblett I guess....

NACA 4412


I was just speaking to Bob - apparently Harry Riblett cleaned up a minor imperfection in the smoothing near the leading edge which NASA left when they originally designed this aerofoil. A relatively small fix, all said and done.
Bob also said the the Riblett they use on the Patrol is better than the mod.4412, but also that Harry liked the 4412 and always said good things about it (may he rest in peace). It is a reasonably good performer.

I think if a guy were to bump up the Wölfbünglöckle just a hair, he'd be onto something.

Sorry Z - Ich glaube, du geschrieben, dass falsche

Not to mention enlarging the Profildicke...

Anyway the link below is a really long list of airfoils used by different planes. Aeronca's, Champs, Champions, and Luscomb's all had models using the 4412. I think a Thrush or two and a Broussard, too. Anyway, it certainly makes for a really fun flying airplane.

http://www.ae.illinois.edu/m-selig/ads/aircraft.html

That link should keep some of you busy for hours... It had that effect on me.

To decode the NACA designations:

http://pr.erau.edu/~draut129/NACAairfoilDesignations.html

Sorry Whee, a bearhawk is a bearhawk.

Don't knock it till you try it.

Every time you guys post pics of your Bearhawks while you are enjoying them in your playground I use the jealousy I have for shop motivation. I'm 4 years into a Patrol build and looking at at least another year. In the meantime I enjoy your pics. Keep 'em coming.

Kevin wrote:Every time you guys post pics of your Bearhawks while you are enjoying them in your playground I use the jealousy I have for shop motivation. I'm 4 years into a Patrol build and looking at at least another year. In the meantime I enjoy your pics. Keep 'em coming.

Keep it up and it won't be long before you can come out and join us. In the mean time, we'll do our best to provide you with more motivation.

The Planes are going through there annual condition inspections and getting some tweaks while the weather is lousy. It shouldn't be too much longer before we are out playing again, though.

I tried it and liked it. Blackrock took me for a ride and I thoroughly enjoyed it. The cost of the kit is what is holding me back.

You guys a killing me. Stick controls, round tail, same airfoil as my luscombe, 1100+ lbs useful...I'm going to end up spending the next 5 years building instead of flying if you keep this up.

whee wrote:You guys a killing me. Stick controls, round tail, same airfoil as my luscombe, 1100+ lbs useful...I'm going to end up spending the next 5 years building instead of flying if you keep this up.

As you might already know, it can be as much as 1400-1500lbs useful at takeoff if you go for that smaller 4-cyl engine you prefer, depending on how light you build the rest of it. That's a lot of useful load!

I have nearly finished mine, 9 months work so far, I'm expecting to be flying inside 12 months. I work full time to pay for it, so that's only weekends and after work (you NEED a supportive partner!). I first looked at a Bearhawk seriously this time last year, and here I am ordering the colour coat paint today..... 4-5 years - never mind that!!!! I want to fly now!

I wish I had mine in the air, it's been 4 years. Everything was going well until my wife had a midlife crisis and started down a different path. I spent the last 3 years trying to save it, but now that it's over it's time to get building again.

Anyway, the bearhawk builds nicely for any mission you have in mind. For long range cruising, float flying, family hauling, and light bush work the 540 is probably the best option, but if you just want something that works and is light, I think the o-375 is the best setup.

If I didn't find a deal on the 540 and wanted to get floats I would have gotten a 4cyl. Probably a custom built 4cyl with a parallel valve case and angle valve cyls.

schu

Just giving you a hard time Whee. We are installing new wheels and brakes, plus a couple of other tweaks. My limited time and anxiety of finishing the job right are holding me back.

Broke off the damn transponder antenna when I was moving under the firewall.
Two steps forward, one step back.

whee wrote:You guys gotta stop...your distracting me from my maule research.

Mwahaha!

whee wrote:You guys a killing me. Stick controls, round tail, same airfoil as my luscombe, 1100+ lbs useful...I'm going to end up spending the next 5 years building instead of flying if you keep this up.

Sorry about that.... (refer to Whee's Bearhawk build thread)

Reading through this old thread, it's very interesting to see what eventuated in the fullness of time. Or what didn't eventuate - like me, still holding out on those 31 ABWs I want.

Yeah, thanks a lot. Two years of no flying and a half done airplane sitting in my garage.[emoji35]

Shoulda bought a Maule[emoji38]