Saw this on Barnstormers today. The baggage door on the 180 is pretty small and seems to be a point of contention as people compare it to say a Maule. I was aware of the stretcher that can be used in the Cessna's (I believe origionally for the 170?) and we actually have one hanging on the wall in the hangar, but I've never heard of the stretcher door as seen in the picture below. Why isn't this more popular as a conversion today? This would certainly eliminate the contortion exercises needed for loading the extended baggage compartments in the C180! Educate me (or post the link where it's been hashed out before )





CW

One significant factor that makes this installation unattractive is that the fuselage can no longer support the loads reacted through float fittings. You have literally created discontinuities the vertical frames of a few critical bulkheads on the left side of the airplane.

A skywagon that is not eligible for float installations is quite a bit less attractive on the used aircraft market. In fact, I have noticed that float kit equipped airplanes are worth significantly more than planes without float kits. I think that Blue Ice aviation was recently selling their 185 for what appeared to be way below market value because it wasn't float kit equipped.

I have never thought that loading/unloading my 180 was particularly cumbersome, but I've never tried to put a 55 gallon drum in. I regularly put three 29 inch wheeled mountain bikes and three people in (all wheels off and stowed in the extended baggage). The factory split seats are not very comfortable, but are really nice for loading/unloading, because the seat backs slide off with very little effort.

A guy named Paul Lawrence used to own a mid-fifties 180 with one of those stretcher doors. He lived in the Portland/Vancouver area & was a long-time member of the NW Antique Airplane Club. I believe there were actually three of those stretcher-ddor equipped 180's running around that area back about 20 years ago, all painted alike from when a local flying service owned them. He said he liked it because it made it easier to crawl in and sleep in the airplane instead of messing with a tent.

Saw a 180 in western New Mexico with the stretcher door. Owner opened her up and let me check it out. It was cool, but its certainly no Maule or 206 cargo door.

I was weathered in at Cody WY back in the late 80's. Cecil McMillan had a plane like this one( might even be this one) and he hauled oil well drilling stuff around the country when they needed something yesterday.

hotrod150 wrote:He said he liked it because it made it easier to crawl in and sleep in the airplane instead of messing with a tent.

Why didn't I think of that. It looks really comfortable!

Scolopax wrote:One significant factor that makes this installation unattractive is that the fuselage can no longer support the loads reacted through float fittings. You have literally created discontinuities the vertical frames of a few critical bulkheads on the left side of the airplane


I have never thought that loading/unloading my 180 was particularly cumbersome, but I've never tried to put a 55 gallon drum in. I regularly put three 29 inch wheeled mountain bikes and three people in (all wheels off and stowed in the extended baggage). The factory split seats are not very comfortable, but are really nice for loading/unloading, because the seat backs slide off with very little effort.

Thanks for the replies.

Our extended baggage starts at about the top of where that stretcher door is and then there's a ski tube in the aft part of that. So to load it you have to first put your gear inside, then stick your torso through the baggage door while standing on the ground and twist to the right to load your gear. Or you can climb inside the airplane and have someone hand the stuff to you. It's not a big deal for me but I can see why it might be a little more difficult for someone who's "bigger", older or someone with a bad back or neck.

It looks like you would be able to add a door like this without cutting through the circumferential frame between the normal baggage door and the stretcher door?? That would cut down on the ability to load some longer items but would still greatly improve the accessability to the remaining baggage area.

I suppose if it really was that great or easy/possible to do then we'd see a lot more of them out there or at least someone holding an STC for the mod. It just looks intruiging to me. That's all!

CW

I had the factory stretcher door on the 180 I used to have. Really liked it for flat, long things (gun cases), but the other downside (no floats being the first) is the extended baggage area is not as open. There are a couple braces that run horizontally across the extended baggage section to re-enforce the fuselage. One was at the junction between the normal baggage door and the stretcher door, the other two about midway in the compartment, as shown in the pics.

I've seen this on a few 180/185s in past there's also a bigger one on the 182 that was available per STC . I also have a stretcher that attaches to seat rails for 170-210s . Used the stretcher many times as a midnight motel - in Idaho flying trips , hauling stuff etc. About 6 1\2 ft. Long - light weight and just wide enough for person.

My new 1953 Skywagon has a cavernous extended baggage, all the way down to the belly since the battery has been relocated to the firewall. Unfortunately the 53's didn't have a baggage door, and no one's ever added one to this airplane. Loading the standard baggage area through the boarding doors isn't bad since it's got folding jumpseats, but accessing the extended baggage is strictly a crawl-in operation. I was admiring the baggage door on a friend's early C210 the other day. The floor of the baggage area is quite high, as all the monkey-motion RG apparatus has to fit beneath it, and so the baggage door is also quite high-- about where this 180 stretcher door is. It'd be nice to add something like that to my airplane above the ext bay.

hotrod150 wrote:My new 1953 Skywagon has a cavernous extended baggage, all the way down to the belly since the battery has been relocated to the firewall. Unfortunately the 53's didn't have a baggage door, and no one's ever added one to this airplane. Loading the standard baggage area through the boarding doors isn't bad since it's got folding jumpseats, but accessing the extended baggage is strictly a crawl-in operation. I was admiring the baggage door on a friend's early C210 the other day. The floor of the baggage area is quite high, as all the monkey-motion RG apparatus has to fit beneath it, and so the baggage door is also quite high-- about where this 180 stretcher door is. It'd be nice to add something like that to my airplane above the ext bay.

That would be nice! In the meantime you can tie rope onto anything you shove in the way back so when it comes time to retrieve it you can just pull it out with the rope

Fredy, those are interesting pictures. I imagined the baggage compartment going all the way to the ceiling but it makes sense that extra bracing would be required. That really cuts down on the number of barrells one can haul

CW

I've always thought that this was an interesting option. Apparently a mod done originally by the MAF.

Preserves the seaplane structure but provides access to the rear-most portion of the extended baggage.

Doesn't do much for super long stuff that needs to span the length of the combined entries.

hotrod150 wrote:My new 1953 Skywagon has a cavernous extended baggage, all the way down to the belly since the battery has been relocated to the firewall. Unfortunately the 53's didn't have a baggage door, and no one's ever added one to this airplane.

Lots of folks have added baggage doors to 170s, and the 53 180 has the same aft fuselage, so it shouldn't be that big a deal to add a standard baggage door if you want to. Won't be insignificant, cost wise, but....

MTV

mtv wrote:

hotrod150 wrote:......it shouldn't be that big a deal to add a standard baggage door if you want to. Won't be insignificant, cost wise, but.... MTV

The key words are in that last sentence. Think I'll hld off, at least until I get the rest of the airplane tweaked just the way I want it. I would be more inclined toward installing a door at the ext baggae, as shown on N185JY in Wagnflyer's post-- it would be much more useful for my airplane than a standard baggage door. Like I said, I can easily access the std baggage area with the jumpseats folded up out of the way.

hotrod150 wrote:

mtv wrote:

hotrod150 wrote:......it shouldn't be that big a deal to add a standard baggage door if you want to. Won't be insignificant, cost wise, but.... MTV

The key words are in that last sentence. Think I'll hold off, at least until I get the rest of the airplane tweaked just the way I want it. I would be more inclined toward installing a door at the ext baggae, as shown on N185JY in Wagnflyer's post-- it would be much more useful for my airplane than a standard baggage door. Like I said, I can easily access the std baggage area with the jumpseats folded up out of the way.

Wagonflyer, I'm assuming that's your airplane. Is that an STC'd mod, a field approval, or what? I'd be interested in finding out more about it.

Did some online research, but didn't find an STC listed for an MAF extended baggage door. I did however find a reference to an "Alcor Cargomore utility door", but didn't find an STC listed for it either, not could I google up any photos. Anyone ever hear of that one?

hotrod150 wrote: Wagonflyer, I'm assuming that's your airplane. Is that an STC'd mod, a field approval, or what? I'd be interested in finding out more about it.

It is not my airplane. The picture of the baggage door is one that I took at Oshkosh (in the North 40 camping area) and the flying picture is one that I found on the web of the same airplane.

I don't recall who told me but at one point in years past, someone was very convincing that this door originated from the MAF group.

i don't have any more info...I just had saved the picture in the event that I ever got super ambitious about needing easier access to the extended section.