Utah You Tube posting of forced landing in snow due to carb ice.



This is the writeup that did not follow when I posted the video.


Published on Feb 6, 2013
2/2/13- I was up for a birthday flight with my wife (her first flight ever), her mother and my seven month old boy when we received the shocking news that our carburator had iced over. After gliding over some field we found an ideal place to land the plane. The pilot was experienced in field landings but unfortunately the snow caused the landing gear to sever from the plane, flipping the plane front to back and smashing the tail before it came to a rest upside down. No one was hurt in the accident save for bruises, whiplash and minor cuts.

More to the story:
The pilot is very experienced and has landed in fields many times before even with snow in the field, just not this much snow. We were looking for roads to land on, but there were just too many power lines next to or crossing these roads. The interstate (large road parallel to flight) can be seen from the beginning of the video, which is a 5 lane road with the middle turn lane. There was absolutely no safe way to land on that road. Had he tried I'm confident that a collision would've occurred and this story could easily have ended in a fatality. The pilot made the BEST landing given the circumstances. Even the way that the plane dug in with its nose, taking the initial force followed by us flipping (instead of a violent abrupt stop) then crunching the tail also absorbing the rest of the collision was the best possible way to crash.
You can see more of the actual destruction to the plane and the way it landed if you look at the other video of the aftermath "Utah Plane Crash Aftermath Wreckage -ORIGINAL FOOTAGE-" located here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sCsIx...
Crash only + slow motion here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nADiI...

The Miracle behind the whole Experience:

-Please do not mock any beliefs or the follow story- I can just as easily turn off the option to allow comments. Please be respectful

When we first heard the news from the pilot that we were going to have to land out there my initial reaction was shock and fear. There was an incredible feeling of calm and peace with swept over all of us as we all said our own silent prayers in our heart. It was in that moment as I tried to recall any sort of ill or uneasy feeling before the flight, any kind of 'warning' feelings that I get sometimes to warn me away from when something really bad was going to happen, you know that 'inner feeling'. After I realized that I never once got a bad feeling of warning I knew in that moment that we were going to be ok. I knew that God was watching over us and protecting my family. We belong to The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and we've been taught to listen to those feelings because they are sent from God.
As we descended there wasn't much talking, we just felt calm and peaceful, very peaceful. I fully expected a smooth landing because of that peaceful feeling, and I just KNEW we were all going to be ok- which we were. I just was really shocked when we crashed. I wouldn't have been recording had I even thought we'd crash, but all-in-all we all walked away especially my baby boy who didn't have a single scratch on him. He's the real miracle about this story.
About 1 minute after the crash a family across the street who had been out on snowmobiles immediately came to our rescue and we climbed aboard and they took us to their house to wait for the paramedics to tell us what I already knew- that we were ok and incredibly lucky.

The only Tragedy:
The pilot is a good friend of my wife's parents. He is passionate about flying and loves to take people up in his plane. My wife had never been in an airplane and this was arranged for her birthday. This was a free flight provided by the pilot because of his good heart. The tragic part of this story is that he forgot to renew his insurance on the plane, and it lapsed the night before the flight- 13 hours earlier!!! The insurance company will not honor any kind of grace period and will do nothing for him, so now he's lost a $40k plane in a matter of 13 hours.  He is still happy and cheerful despite his loss.
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News & Politics
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Standard YouTube License

I have actually been wondering about the performance of the carburetor heat on my 180, which is probably identical to that on the 182. The 170 system that I am accustomed to using produces a lot of heat and is very effective. The 180 installation is open to the ambient lower cowling air, produces almost no rpm drop during run up, and it seems that after a low power descent it would have little effect in melting much of anything that has accumulated. I am sure that Cessna passed the regulatory requirements when certifying the installation, but I would not want to count on it to melt accumulated ice, rather use it to prevent any ice from accumulating. It looks like this guy's carb iced up on a clear day. Should I use it any time it's below 40F or something? Does anyone have any thoughts, opinions or experiences with this?

Looks like he has the EZ flap installed.

When the engine quits, we all get religion

One of the network news shows had a clip this am of another Utah forced landing, that all walked away from. Nothing about the snowmachine fatality last week here though, go figure.

Scolopax wrote:I have actually been wondering about the performance of the carburetor heat on my 180, which is probably identical to that on the 182. The 170 system that I am accustomed to using produces a lot of heat and is very effective. The 180 installation is open to the ambient lower cowling air, produces almost no rpm drop during run up, and it seems that after a low power descent it would have little effect in melting much of anything that has accumulated....

I am reconfiguring the carb heat on my Tundra. I had ram air coming in from the rear of the upper baffle to the muff jacket and was very effective but am trying to raise upper baffle pressure and improve cooling by closing that outlet and just using engine suction through the muff by free drawing air through it from the lower cowling. Is this a mistake? I know this system is used on many RV6 thru 9's with success. I do have a Superior (Lycoming style) engine.

Scary.

If the part about his insurance company not covering a 13 hour expired policy is legit then I want to know what company it was so I can make sure to take my business elsewhere. Not cool.

rw2 wrote:Scary.

If the part about his insurance company not covering a 13 hour expired policy is legit then I want to know what company it was so I can make sure to take my business elsewhere. Not cool.

My broker warned me about this kind of thing and said it applied to all the companies; made me wonder if it has more to do with the broker than the company.

Insurance companies do not want to pay claims. It can be detrimental to their bottom line. My guess is that most in the insurance business are in it for the money, as it doesn't exactly seem like "labor of love" type of work. Maybe I am wrong about this, but an expired policy, even if by ten minutes, gives them an easy out. There are a number of other reasons that they won't pay that seem unreasonable as well. Lesson in this: read your policy and don't let it lapse.

Scolopax wrote:My guess is that most in the insurance business are in it for the money, as it doesn't exactly seem like "labor of love" type of work.

Truer words were never spoken.

It could have been worse, at least there weren't any medical expenses that he would have been libel for. If someone had been really hurt, he could've been wiped out financially because he didn't carry any/enough insurance..a very costly mistake. It's the main reason I don't give rides anymore, unless it's family or Young Eagles where I'm covered by the EAA additional policy.
Pete

Jeez................

It happened in Utah.... He got major news coverage about the ( no insurance) thing..... Every LDS member for 2000 miles has heard about this now....

I bet when this is all over he will get "donations" that are 10 times his actual loss....

It actually looks like he made the emergency landing without flaps, unless the johnson bar disengaged and went to fully retracted, which I seriously doubt, being familiar with it's action. Can anyone think of a reason not to have those big flaps fully extended during an emergency landing?

Scolopax wrote:Insurance companies do not want to pay claims. It can be detrimental to their bottom line. My guess is that most in the insurance business are in it for the money, as it doesn't exactly seem like "labor of love" type of work. Maybe I am wrong about this, but an expired policy, even if by ten minutes, gives them an easy out. There are a number of other reasons that they won't pay that seem unreasonable as well. Lesson in this: read your policy and don't let it lapse.

You entered into a contract but when it suits you you want it changed. Where's the line? At what point past what you paid for should the insurance policy not be in effect? A day? A week? A month?

I didn't mean to imply that they should pay after a policy is expired. It is indeed a contractual agreement, and it is in no way dishonorable for the insurance company not to cover one with expired coverage. It was not articulated fairly, when I said "easy out". I should have said "legitimate out" instead.

Anyone else having a hard time buying the carb ice story? Bummer no matter the cause.

Terry wrote:Anyone else having a hard time buying the carb ice story? Bummer no matter the cause.

Yeah, I was wondering about that myself. In cold temps the air just doesn't hold much moisture. I wouldn't be surprised if they find a different explanation for the problem.

The 7 month old infant......in a belted down carrier or held in the mothers arm? Looks like she did a good job holding onto but maybe the kid could have stayed on the ground. Seems a tad negligent but glad it worked out for them.

The no flaps thing makes no sense.

Ummmm. Isn't this Jaerl's "My old plane down" plane?

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=11852

Gump

Cessna 180 and 182s are THE carburetor ice kings of the aviation world, in my experience. And, yes, you can aquire a load of carb ice in stone clear air. The moisture does NOT have to be visible. Look at a carburetor icing chart, if you haven't recently. It should be an eye opener.

I flew in Kodiak for eight years, and that is carb ice central. A 180 there kept me plenty paranoid about using the carb heat judiciously. Even the Super Cub, with a relatively ice resistant Lycoming engine made carb ice like crazy, and yes, on crystal clear days.

Here's a link to a carb ice chart: https://www.google.com/search?q=carbure ... B500%3B366

And, I'd be very careful about modifying carb heat systems. Test them carefully. My 170 with a Lycoming had poor cabin heat, so I installed a Scout/C-172 style exhaust stack robber carb heat shroud and used all the air coming out of the muffler shroud for cabin heat. The exhaust pipe shroud style carb heat systems seem to make sufficient heat.

When in doubt, apply FULL carb heat.

MTV

Multiple comments:

One of the more useful additions is a carb temp gauge. When I had the new Insight engine analyzer installed last year, I had the carb temp option installed. It theoretically allows one to use something other than full carb heat, which of course affects the mixture and consequently the power available. It's also nice to be able to check for certain that the carb heat is working, as it increases the carb temp by a good 30F at just run-up rpm.

And the icing chart definitely shows that carb ice can form in all sorts of conditions that we normally don't think of as carb ice risky. Probably the situation that fools more pilots is the warm weather icing, due to just the right mixture of humidity and temperature. But any long taxi can create carb ice, and relatively low power cruising can, with the critical outside temps being actually pretty warm in most cases.

I disagree that the flaps wouldn't necessarily retract. I don't know what this pilot did or didn't do, but with my airplane's manual flaps, although the bar's detents show no excessive wear, they've been known to pop off of 40 and go to 30 on their own. Haven't had it happen from any other position, but it's not impossible.

As for insurance, the easiest way to prevent being uninsured is to renew as soon as the renewal notice comes. That way continuous coverage is guaranteed. Otherwise, it is strictly a contractual issue, and if the policy has lapsed, the policy effectively doesn't exist. I can't speak about all of the insurance companies, of course, but Avemco has always sent me my renewal notice a good 6-8 weeks before the end of the policy year. When I had AIG before I switched, they did the same thing. With Avemco, I renew on line as soon as I get the notice. I use a credit card, and they don't charge the card until just before the renewal date.

Regarding kids in airplanes, there's a neat little harness system from http://kidsflysafe.com/, which is designed for single-back seats such as on airliners, but which is easily modifiable with a longer strap to go around the double-width back seat rest common in most GA airplanes. I bought one for Angel Flights and easily modified it to fit my Cessna's back seat--hope to use it also for my GKs, when they ride with me. It's so much better and safer than trying to hold a kid, and it's a lot more compact than a typical child seat. It probably wouldn't work very well for a 7 month old as in the crash story, but for somewhat larger kids, it's a good idea.

Cary

Both of my kids have flown in our Pacer since being days old. Just simply put their carseat in the airplane. Once my daughter turned two I bought one of those boosters with a high back that use the airplanes harnesses. She uses that in the Taylorcraft as well. My one year old son has not been turned around in the car yet so he flies backwards in Pacer, has not been in Tcraft yet.